We've ordered a 2015 Swift Challenger Sport 524 and I wanted to know if anyone can explain to me why Swift don't fit the AL-KO ATC trailer control system as standard on this caravan?
AL-KO ATC trailer control system
- Thread starter DJMilly
- Start date
To keep the price down - and to keep some sort of differential between that model and more expensive ones.
Thanks RogerL and Raywood for your replies. It seems a little crazy to sacrifice a safety item to cut down on the cost of the caravan. Any idea roughly how much dealers charge or if it would be possible for Swift to install ATC in the factory?
Having heard it from 'the horse's mouth' so to speak, Swift suggested that on the Continent when the ATC system was offered as an option, the uptake was very low. Now, me being the synical type, suggest that it is purely a money saving exercise, and I am certainly not alone in that thought.
Personally, I believe that stabilisers and an ATC type system (together with any other safety device) should be a mandatory fit. Perhaps it could startwith the NCC making it part of their approval?
Personally, I believe that stabilisers and an ATC type system (together with any other safety device) should be a mandatory fit. Perhaps it could startwith the NCC making it part of their approval?
- Mar 14, 2005
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OOOOO Nigel, 
hmy:
I think you may have opened up the floodgates there, Every Tom, Dick and Harriet, will claiming their product enhances safety and therefore must be fitted.... Tyre Bands for example, Suspension assisters, etc etc etc....
I do support the use of equipment and protocols that have a proven track record of increasing safety or safety margins, But equally one of the best safety features would be if drivers:-
Stopped being so impatient, and getting frustrated with other road users,
kept within speed limits but maintained good progress,
Stopped tailgating,
Stopped undertaking,
Stopped amber gambling and stop creeping at traffic lights and crossings,
Used MIrror signal manoeuvre,
Indicated when turning or changing lanes,
Lane discipline at round-a-bouts.
Stopped using mobile phones,
Turned the music down so they can hear what's going on around them,
Wore seat belts
Drive in accordance with the prevailing conditions
Turn their base ball hats the right way round and stop smoking! :dry:
hmy:I think you may have opened up the floodgates there, Every Tom, Dick and Harriet, will claiming their product enhances safety and therefore must be fitted.... Tyre Bands for example, Suspension assisters, etc etc etc....
I do support the use of equipment and protocols that have a proven track record of increasing safety or safety margins, But equally one of the best safety features would be if drivers:-
Stopped being so impatient, and getting frustrated with other road users,
kept within speed limits but maintained good progress,
Stopped tailgating,
Stopped undertaking,
Stopped amber gambling and stop creeping at traffic lights and crossings,
Used MIrror signal manoeuvre,
Indicated when turning or changing lanes,
Lane discipline at round-a-bouts.
Stopped using mobile phones,
Turned the music down so they can hear what's going on around them,
Wore seat belts
Drive in accordance with the prevailing conditions
Turn their base ball hats the right way round and stop smoking! :dry:
Tyre pressure monitors are compulsory on new car models now,probably will be on caravans also,Bailey are starting fitting the sensors
DeliDave_ said:
I would say its pretty unlikely they will ever be compulsory on caravans , they cant even make it compulsory to be road worthy yet?
I wonder how many people have purchased the monitor? I dont know of anyone who has?
It's ALWAYS been a legal requirement under the UK Construction & Use regulations that every vehicle, including trailers, has to be road worthy.
Car MoT's only apply on the day they're tested - the C&U regs apply every day, all year.
Car MoT's only apply on the day they're tested - the C&U regs apply every day, all year.
And such a compulsory trailer test would have no positive effect for any trailer that was properly maintained, but would have a detrimental cost for owners.MichaelE said:
A compulsory trailer test would have benefits with the much smaller numbers of trailers that have no or little maintenance carried out - but these are exactly the sort of trailers targetted by VOSA trailer checks for which the same benefit accrues.
Innovations in safety equipment is rarely made retrospective on vehicles or trailers - some cars aren't even required to have indicators or rear high intensity (fog) lights.
On talking with the Dealer today they suggested that the Swift Challenger Sport 524 wasn't fitted with the AL-KO ATC as standard because it was a very stable caravan due to it's aerodynamics and overall design. It's not apparently necessary on this Swift model.
He cant possibly know all the scenario's that you will encounter? The lorry that overtakes you , a windy day the list goes on.
Its a safety device not for use all the time only when you need it?
Basically he is saying it will never snake?
Its a safety device not for use all the time only when you need it?
Basically he is saying it will never snake?
That sounds like salesman's BS !DJMilly said:
The Challenger Sport shares it's bodyshell with the Sport SE which gets ATC - presumably because it needs it !
Sprocket no, I've never towed a caravan before. I was quite surprised with what he said. I thought I'd post on here to receive some feedback from experienced caravaner's that weren't trying to confuse me with sales waffle. I'm sure there are other 4 birth light weight caravans that have ATC and drivers appreciate having an extra piece of kit to keep them safe whilst towing.
DJMilly said:
That's a bit like saying you don't need ABS on your car. If you drive carefully it may never operate but having driven on the Volvo test track in Sweden25 years ago with it switched on, then again with it switched off, I wouldn't be without it. All safety aids are invaluable the one time you are caught out.
- Mar 14, 2005
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Hello DJ,
I have lost count of the number of different trailers and tow vehicles I have used, and I can definitely tell you that a trailer that is stable and tows well with one vehicle may be very different with a another tow vehicle, and the same can apply to caravans. So the salespersons explanation of the non-fitting of ATC is untrue no trailer can be guaranteed to be stable -except when it's stationary.
However most caravans when carefully set up and matched to the right size of car can be towed with little drama. And that is what you should aim to do be able to do. As with other safety devices such as ABS, and ESP these are the safety belts which hopefully will never be needed, but are there just in case.
It is in my mind totally wrong to have a set up where you rely on any these additional bits of kit to make it possible to tow, because if any of these systems stops working for any reason, the outfit becomes very dangerous.
So in reality ATC is not an essential bit of kit, but it may add reassurance.
You may have picked up references to Tyre bands, No scientific evidence has been brought to the table to show what if any difference they make to caravan safety, so I cannot support the fitting or use of these devices which as far as I can see is a total waste of money, but some people feel happier to have them fitted, so its really up to them. ATC on the other hand does have corroborable evidence.
I have lost count of the number of different trailers and tow vehicles I have used, and I can definitely tell you that a trailer that is stable and tows well with one vehicle may be very different with a another tow vehicle, and the same can apply to caravans. So the salespersons explanation of the non-fitting of ATC is untrue no trailer can be guaranteed to be stable -except when it's stationary.
However most caravans when carefully set up and matched to the right size of car can be towed with little drama. And that is what you should aim to do be able to do. As with other safety devices such as ABS, and ESP these are the safety belts which hopefully will never be needed, but are there just in case.
It is in my mind totally wrong to have a set up where you rely on any these additional bits of kit to make it possible to tow, because if any of these systems stops working for any reason, the outfit becomes very dangerous.
So in reality ATC is not an essential bit of kit, but it may add reassurance.
You may have picked up references to Tyre bands, No scientific evidence has been brought to the table to show what if any difference they make to caravan safety, so I cannot support the fitting or use of these devices which as far as I can see is a total waste of money, but some people feel happier to have them fitted, so its really up to them. ATC on the other hand does have corroborable evidence.
- Jun 20, 2005
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Morning Prof
So in reality ATC is not an essential bit of kit, but it may add reassurance.
When I started caravanning back in the 70s additional safety items were pretty well non existant.
Snaking however was common place and I suggest experienced by more people then than today.
Caravans were shorter for a start. I well remember buying a Scott friction damper type stabilsier which actually worked!
So the old lags were brought up the hard way having to experience hazards that today may well be masked by modern technology such as ATC etc.
With caravans much longer and heavier I believe manufacturers have a duty of care to offer an inclusive "safety" package . Thus I'm surprised Swift are back pedalling a bit with ATC.
I do agree the basics are still crucial but sadly forgotten by a lot of caravanners .
So in reality ATC is not an essential bit of kit, but it may add reassurance.
When I started caravanning back in the 70s additional safety items were pretty well non existant.
Snaking however was common place and I suggest experienced by more people then than today.
Caravans were shorter for a start. I well remember buying a Scott friction damper type stabilsier which actually worked!
So the old lags were brought up the hard way having to experience hazards that today may well be masked by modern technology such as ATC etc.
With caravans much longer and heavier I believe manufacturers have a duty of care to offer an inclusive "safety" package . Thus I'm surprised Swift are back pedalling a bit with ATC.
I do agree the basics are still crucial but sadly forgotten by a lot of caravanners .
Good morning ProfJohnL and Dustydog
If I'd have realised that the Challenger Sport didn't have ATC we'd probably ordered a different caravan. I assumed nievely that just like ABS on cars it came as standard on all caravans. It was on my must have list of features. So now we have to find an additional £500+ for kit that in th opinion of several here should be a standard safety feature.
If I'd have realised that the Challenger Sport didn't have ATC we'd probably ordered a different caravan. I assumed nievely that just like ABS on cars it came as standard on all caravans. It was on my must have list of features. So now we have to find an additional £500+ for kit that in th opinion of several here should be a standard safety feature.
Dont worry too much? concentrate on a getting the van loaded correctly and getting a well matched towing vehicle .
Its a good place to start, sometimes safety features make us a bit complacent?
Its a good place to start, sometimes safety features make us a bit complacent?
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