Asking for Trouble

[CliveV]

Still loads of questions on what is the best vehicle etc. Whilst my personal view is that it is whatever makes YOU happy, I thought it may be beneficial to publish the results of "4x4 Magazines" annual Best Off-Roader test. Results published this month.

Last year it was won by the Santana Hanibal PS10 (Spannish built - very similar to the 110) and so this vehicle became the control for this years test.

Results

Discovery 3 80 points

Defender 110 73 points

Toyota Land Cruiser 60 points

Nissan Patrol 60 points

Range Rover Sport 57 points

VW Touareg 54 points

Mercedes ML 53 points

Mitsubishi Shogun 48 points

Jeep Grand Cherokee 47 points

Kia Sorento 41 points

Santana PS10 (Control) 78 points

PLEASE - do take the time to read what is written! - This is a test of the Best OFF-ROADER - Towing a caravan did not come into it!

Therefore the fact that in a different test completely - the Kia became the CC "Towcar of the year" indicates that these tests are only relevent if you require your vehicle to do certain things.

I need to tow all sorts and go off-road regularly. Therefore based on the two reports, whilst the Kia is a super tow car and damned good value, it is not what I need.

Similarly - whilst the Range Rover Sport does better than I expected being a bit of "Bling Bling" sillyness in my view would I really want to take a £50K car down the muddy tracks I regularly go?

Yes if I did not have to pay for it, a definate NO if one ever became mine. With the cheapest Discovery 3 costing £27K I am not sure I would want to get one of those dirty either.

 

[Lutz]

I haven't got a copy of the 4x4 Magazine so I can't comment on the criteria that they used to award points but, as you so rightly say, towing performance wasn't taken into account. As such, the results are rather irrelevant in this respect. Also, there are, to my mind, some important and serious omissions:

BMW X3 and X5

Ford Maverick and Explorer

Hyundai Santa Fe and Terracan

Lexus RX

Mercedes G-Wagon

Nissan Terrano and Pathfinder

plus a whole host of smaller 4x4's which can be considered as serious contenders for towing even if their off-road capability is rather limited.

 

[CliveV]

I should have put the "entry criteria" for this test.

Diesel powered, 5 door vehicles currently available in the UK.

I would also suggest that some importers/manufacturers are somewhat less keen than others to have their product tested against others and so did not make a vehicle available for the test.

I personally think it bizarre that the Range Rover Sport is tested instead of the "normal" version.

 

[cris_408518]

I can't say where I've been today but due to horendous rain for the past few days the parking field was a wash. A new Range Rover sport raced past me and then got stuck as he sunk in mud. A Disco 3 was summoned to extract his brother in arms and was fine until his wheels broke through the grass and he sunk in the mud. Lad in ancient huge tractor pulled both out to the veiwing crowds amusement.

You can drive what you want but it seems some should have a warning to engage brain as well as 4x4.

My old humble 2 wheel drive parked and got out and drove past the RR Sport on the way out. I gave hime a friendly wave as I SLOWLY went by

May be tractor should come top of the list ;-)

 

[RogerL]

"Best XYZ Vehicle" competitions are very useful IF people examine the criteria that's been used for judging.

CliveV clearly needs a vehicle that's good at off-road, towing and solo but many caravanners never take their 4x4 off-road (I don't consider the grass next to a tarmac site road as "off-road"), they choose them for their towing ability.

Ironically all these competitions work very hard at eliminating driver ability from the equation BUT driver ability is the biggest single factor in a car's performance, by a long way. Several times in 3 decades I've watched caravans pulled by 4x4s going no-where, just digging holes, on wet grass while I just pull away, albeit very slowly, with my front-wheel drive family car & caravan. Thank you BSM instructors in the 60's.

Some caravanners will look at the scores in "Best Off-Roader" without reading any details of criteria, rush out and buy one fitted with tarmac tyres, reassured that it'll get them out of trouble anytime and then be surprised why better drivers in more "humble" vehicles can get through when they can't.

 

[CliveV]

As I labled this thread - I just new there would be more people out their with all the "my aunt had one but the wheel fell off" and the "I tow a twin axle with a Fiat Cinquocento" tales!

 

[CliveV]

Oh and anyone who wants to play silly B*ggers - I am away for the w/e - stack the responces up - I will deal with them on Tuseday - along with all the other "mail" I get!

LOL!

 

[Dusty_5112460]

Asking for trouble? Aren't you just! Don't let this guy wind anyone up for God's sake. Especially any new readers to this forum. Just 4x4 him. (with a two finger gesture simultaniously x 2)

Knowledge point: Your tow car choice is what you choose or can afford and is in your price range.

 

[LMH]

cris

As Ron is on line - you've got a good working knowledge of France, can't you help him out with his paris/alps trip? He's taking his wife on a really special trip.

 

[BrianStAlbans]

Oh no, we're going to get a story about digging the tunnels with his bare hands. Lmmaaaoooo.

 

[LMH]

Hello Brian how are you, wife and your lovely boys?

Lisa

 

[BrianStAlbans]

Hello Brian how are you, wife and your lovely boys?

Lisa

very well thanks Lisa , only working tomorrow then two days off, can't wait. Brian (",)

 

[LMH]

Hello Brian how are you, wife and your lovely boys?

Lisa

Glad you are all ok. I've got a new computer and lost my address book so haven't got any emails addresses if you get my drift.

Get my new van next weekend. Looking forward to it.

Lisa

 

[LMH]

cris

My daughter is going to Paris in July. Anything I should be worried about?

 

[cris_408518]

cris

My daughter is going to Paris in July. Anything I should be worried about?

Crossing the road by the Arc de Triomphe

 

[cris_408518]

Another reason not to say what I do ;-)

 

[354]

I have recieved my copy of 4x4 and read the article with some intrest, and yes it is an off road test not a towing or all round test. Nothing wrong with this as not so long ago they did general tests and catogorised 4x4's. When choosing our car we were looking for confort power and on road ability which the GC provides. But it is an interesting article.

 

[BrianC_5111810]

I use a Defender in the fields for the daughters horse box and dragging trailers around the fields.

As a mud plugger I guess it is unbeatable and my wife loves it down the lanes.

To events and for working I use V10 Taureg. Most of its life is on the roads. Power is awesome and it tows heavy trailers up and down hills with ease and with power to spare. I've had a Range Rover and two TDI's, they are just different animals and the VW fits my road needs better.

 

[DavidW1]

Clive,

Americans, with their sometimes pithy grasp of "our" language would have a two word comment for your posting which they would accenuate to suit the situation, ranging from shere boredom to outright offence.

In this case to indicate that they are aware that this is a provocation or wind up but that they are mildly bored it would be "oh reeeally"

 

[trucker]

David W, it might not float your boat but it does other people, thats whats so intersting about this foum different subjects. If its not for you move on dont av a go.

Mods a personal attack by Dsty on Clive is not needed.

Prahaps Kanga is bakeafter reading some of Dustys posts!!!!!!

 

[DavidW1]

A point yes Kevin but I am entitled to be bored when Clive unsubtly tries to convert us all to Green Laning and the ins and outs of serious off roading (again) on what purports to be a forum for towcars.

I would be equally bored by a treatise on hangliding or Coarse Fishing under the Towcar topic although I'm sure it would interest some vanners if included under a more relavent subject heading.

I think also that Clive will not be offended by my comments as he was clearly trying to provoke debate on his hobby and this was my contribution.

I could have said, Clive I am not slightly interested in the latest hideously expensive machines capable of chewing up the local tracks in my area and turning them into mudbaths and it has nothing to do with towing caravans but that would be rude.

 

[CliveV]

Asking for trouble? Aren't you just! Don't let this guy wind anyone up for God's sake. Especially any new readers to this forum. Just 4x4 him. (with a two finger gesture simultaniously x 2)

Knowledge point: Your tow car choice is what you choose or can afford and is in your price range.

Dusty - PLEASE read what was said -

CliveV Asking for Trouble

26 May 2006 04:24 PM

Still loads of questions on what is the best vehicle etc. Whilst my personal view is that it is whatever makes YOU happy, I thought it may be beneficial to publish the results of "4x4 Magazines" annual Best Off-Roader test. Results published this month.

 

[CliveV]

"Whilst my personal view is that it is whatever makes YOU happy, I thought it may be beneficial to publish the results of "4x4 Magazines" annual Best Off-Roader test. Results published this month."

Oh deary deary me!

 

[CliveV]

Clive,

Americans, with their sometimes pithy grasp of "our" language would have a two word comment for your posting which they would accenuate to suit the situation, ranging from shere boredom to outright offence.

In this case to indicate that they are aware that this is a provocation or wind up but that they are mildly bored it would be "oh reeeally"

Have you seen some of the enormous motorhomes and 4x4's our cousins from over the pond produce!

Really awsome! - but as relevant to the UK as their use of the queens English.

 

[DavidW1]

Have you seen some of the enormous motorhomes and 4x4's our cousins from over the pond produce!

Really awsome! - but as relevant to the UK as their use of the queens English.

Yes, quite coincidentally just come back from US and amazed by the quite frequent sight of huge RV's towing huge (by our standards) 4x4's in their wake. Even saw one towing a Cadilac Escalade - evironment, what evironment gas is still only 3$ a gallon, long live America!