Bailey warranty work

Jun 25, 2005
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Hello

Our Series 5 Bailey Pageant Bretangue is due to go back to Bailey at Bristol at the end of February for some warranty work to be done due to cracks in front panel causing damp. Spoke to dealer today re emptying our van etc. Have been informed that at present Bailey are running 6-8 weeks behind in repairing caravans of existing customers, priority appears to be on getting the new Pegasus out to customers. Has anyone else had experience of this or know any other information? We know that there are others at the dealers also affected.

Will be contacting Bailey tomorrow. Kids and us have holidays and catteries booked based on the date and timescale we were given by Bailey.

Many thanks

Annette
 
Mar 14, 2005
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Hello Annette,

I don't hold out a great deal of hope for compensation if you do loose out on your planned holidays. Under Sale of Goods Act, the supplier is only liable for repairs, and unavoidable costs that arise from the failure or the method repairing it.

If you have taken out holiday or travel insurance, you may have a claim but that will depend on the small print.

Your dealer is not obliged to it but they may take pity on you and arrange a courtesy caravan, but considering the way the s/h market has been going recently there are not too many available.
 
Nov 20, 2006
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the reason for bailey running behind is because so many caravans are being returned, due to the number of dealers unable or unwilling to repair their customers caravans themselves.

i never return a caravan to bailey, but thats simply because i have invested in aftersales, have a separate workshop just for body work and damp repairs, employed and trained some very good technicians to deal with water ingress problems. in this respect i can repair a damp van usually within 4 weeks, dependant on parts delivery.

when will other dealers realise that damp repairs are their responsibility and not to palm it off back to the manufacturer. surely they have a duty to their customers!?
 
Nov 20, 2006
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i suppose you could even argue, why do manufacturers let dealers sell their caravans if they cant even repair them when something goes wrong? would you expect a focus go back to ford if it needed an engine or gearbox?
 
Mar 14, 2005
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What a refreshing post from a dealer.

Read seem to understands their responsibilities under the SoGA, Its a pity that quite a number of others don't, or deliberately try to deflect customer complaints.
 
G

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Without offering any defence of Bailey or any other manufacturer I could point out that it is approaching the start of the 2010 holiday season and all manufacturers are geared up to supply the pre-ordered vans/motorhomes in time for the summer. Repairs or otherwise will undoubtedly have to fit in as where can. That is maybe not the answer Annette would like to hear but we are talking about relatively small operations when compared with automobiles and people have only so many hours in the day to do everything.

I don't think the 'Pegasus' is the main culprit, but all types of vans, however it is convenient to blame that one. I hope Annette gets an answer from Bailey that she wants, but we have all had to change plans made on the basis of 'promises' by suppliers and service companies. She may have to face the choice of keeping the van meantime, and getting her dates, or delivering it for repair with no guarantee of return when she wants it.
 
Nov 20, 2006
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What a refreshing post from a dealer.

Read seem to understands their responsibilities under the SoGA, Its a pity that quite a number of others don't, or deliberately try to deflect customer complaints.
i dont see it as SoGA, it is just a case of looking after YOUR customers and our problems with their caravans.

plus there is a small part of not trusting someone elses workmanship LOL
 
Mar 14, 2005
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Going by the last remark by Stephen does anyone know how long

an ABS panel will last ? especially front ones - will they for

example last as long as an GRP front panel ? I only say this

because they look very thin and flimsy to me and I wonder how

they will weather in say 6-10 years time.
 
Mar 10, 2006
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When i bought a new avondale caravan, the grp rear panel was poorly finished, a very patchy gel covering. The dealer said a new panel was the only answer, but he considered the job beyond his workshops expertise.

I agreed to have the caravan returned to avondale for the repair, and actually was happier to have the production company do the panel change than a sales out let.

In my opinion only small jobs, of a simple nature should be undertaken by a dealer, the outlay required to carry out large repairs, can only be passed on to the customer in the form of increased prices.

All the new caravans i have bought have always been from family type companies, that is small scale.

When bailey went to production line techniques, the end product started to become very patchy, poor technique, procedures and QC are responsible for cracked panels, it is a disgrace that bailey should be ashamed of, and makes one wonder at the "not yet discovered problems, that await peg' & olm' owners
 
Mar 14, 2005
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What a refreshing post from a dealer.

Read seem to understands their responsibilities under the SoGA, Its a pity that quite a number of others don't, or deliberately try to deflect customer complaints.
Hi,

Looking after your customers makes good commercial sense, and I applaud you for that. But it is also what SoGA is about, it just setting out the minimum ground rules for what should (as you say) customer care.

Having worked with many companies on their quality assurance systems, those that truly value the customer beyond the point of sale, are often more profitable.

Without any doubt, those that choose to try to deny their customers their legal rights, might get away with it because many customers do not fully understand their rights, and these companies exploit that ignorance. But often they are the ones that might make a quick buck, but have no longevity in the market.

The recent take over of Cadbury causes me great concern. Cadbury was a Quaker, and the company was founded on those philanthropic principals of taking care of their workforce and sharing good fortune with them. Even though the recent owners may not have been Quakers, the underlying principals involved were still evident. I fear that these good points will now be lost by the purely profit motive of Kraft.

Cadbury was by most standards a successful business, but in commercial terms there are historic decisions that may have turned a bigger profit, but they were moderated by their ethos, and in the long run have been better for all.

Just out of interest - Google "Quaker owned Business" and find out how many surprisingly well known names of longstanding businesses have origins in the Quaker movement.

Keep up the good work
 
Aug 11, 2009
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the reason for bailey running behind is because so many caravans are being returned, due to the number of dealers unable or unwilling to repair their customers caravans themselves.

i never return a caravan to bailey, but thats simply because i have invested in aftersales, have a separate workshop just for body work and damp repairs, employed and trained some very good technicians to deal with water ingress problems. in this respect i can repair a damp van usually within 4 weeks, dependant on parts delivery.

when will other dealers realise that damp repairs are their responsibility and not to palm it off back to the manufacturer. surely they have a duty to their customers!?
A superb reply, If they are flying the Bailey repair flag then they should look after them totally not just take the easy service money
 
Nov 20, 2006
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if you invest in the right people, premises and tools there is no need to pass on any costs. i can prove it, no increase in service prices or labour charges since end of 2007. the reason for this is because a repair shop generates its own revenue, bringing in large warranty work from the manufacturers, damp repairs and insurance repairs. servicing is only bread and butter work. big repairs make the money because people will always pay for quality repairs and expertise. this in itself brings more customers. i think it is very stupid for any business willing to turn away work.

in fact in 2004 & 2005 avondale were sending their factory repairs to us instead of them going back to the factory. we must have repaired over 200 from them with cracked panels and water ingress. their reason for using us..... we could repair them quicker and better than they could and at less cost than their down time from using production staff. they always told me, we make them, you repair them and to be honest making something like a caravan is only carried out by labourers and semi skilled tradesmen at best. repairing them is a skilled job
 
Jun 25, 2005
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Hi

Its interesting reading the responses so far. I agree with Read that a workshop can generate its own revenue - reputation is everything, its a lot easier to keep existing customers compared to having to attract new customers. Its good business sense to keep existing customers happy. Our local dealer has been helpful, they picked up the cracks and damp and contacted Bailey straight away. Unfortunately they do not have the facities to replace panels. Our van was originally purchased from Barrons who became Discover at York. Due to relocation we transfered servicing to more local Discover branches, Discover then closed the Cannock and Wrexham branches.

We think it is unreasonable of Bailey (or any other manufacturer) to expect existing customers to wait over 6 months to have warranty work carried out and that is before any additional running over time gets added on. If Bailey cannot complete the work required within a reasonable time, then it should outsource the warranty work to companies who can eg Read. Waiting 6 months is not a reasonable time.Last year we looked at the latest Bretangue but didn't like it. Depending on how Bailey handles the points we have raised in an e mail will depend on which manufacturer we look to buying another new van in the future. Kelly at customer services informs us that she has passed on our e mail. We await with interest.

Annette
 
Mar 14, 2005
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Quote:.... "and to be honest making something like a caravan is only carried out by labourers and semi skilled tradesmen at best. repairing them is a skilled job"

I have to say I find that statement strange for several reasons, but, if we except it at face value, then surely and first, the skill level is in the wrong place? The cart before the horse?!

If that's so the purchase price is attractive, then second and assuming it gets beyond the warranty period mostly without problem? then the original purchase price begins to rise as you start paying on top for repairs.

As potential warranty has to be paid for and incorporated within the purchase price, and this is carried out by 'skilled' more expensive labour, using at least more 'skilled' labour in the first place and getting it built right first time, should end up being cheaper and at the same time more profitable!

Surely it can't be dearer?
 
Nov 20, 2006
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Quote:.... "and to be honest making something like a caravan is only carried out by labourers and semi skilled tradesmen at best. repairing them is a skilled job"

I have to say I find that statement strange for several reasons, but, if we except it at face value, then surely and first, the skill level is in the wrong place? The cart before the horse?!

If that's so the purchase price is attractive, then second and assuming it gets beyond the warranty period mostly without problem? then the original purchase price begins to rise as you start paying on top for repairs.

As potential warranty has to be paid for and incorporated within the purchase price, and this is carried out by 'skilled' more expensive labour, using at least more 'skilled' labour in the first place and getting it built right first time, should end up being cheaper and at the same time more profitable!

Surely it can't be dearer?
Annette,

Contact us at service@readcaravans.com and we would more than happy to complete the warranty work for you instead of it going back to Bailey.
 
Apr 23, 2005
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I have a bailey senator 5 3 years old and last spring at my annual service (having seen many postings about bailey front panel cracking) I asked the bailey approved mobile engineer to look out for cracks. He replied "its mainly pageants that suffer this problem we dont see it on senators at all". Now I did have a compass previously and this went back to explorer for a new front panel when cracks appeared around the grab handle and I have heard that avondale were prone to this also.

My point is how can there be any future confidence in any van that suffers from this fault. Even if repaired how long will it be before this fault reappears and out of the warranty period as well? I know that I got rid of my compass sharpish after this happened....
 
Nov 20, 2006
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the cracking does effect the ranger, pageant and senators but in saying that it is not every caravan. the fault and cause has been identified and this is why they should not reoccur once repaired correctly. we have been repairing them since 2005 without a repeat failure. i hope this puts your mind at rest a little.
 
Dec 4, 2007
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Do you not think that Bailey as the manufacturer should call back in all the caravans effected at their cost.

Why should the customer yet again pick up the costs for transportation etc. when there is an obvious design issue.

Its mentioned that this fault does not involve all models produced, but we are only aware of forum members comments. Is this a true representation of the actual problem.

Is it a case that it could well involve all - is it only a question of time.
 
Nov 20, 2006
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i would say since the problem first appeared we are only talking about 2% of all caravans produced. in a lot of cases Bailey are going beyond their normal terms and conditions of their warranties to repair these caravans and in most cases of what is required under SoGA. so i see no grounds what so ever for a recall. they are attending to them in a totally professional way, when and if they occur
 
Mar 14, 2005
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Bob,

Your contract of sale for any product exists between you and the seller. The seller is the person or organisation that takes your money,and as such it may be a dealer, or manufacture if the sell direct, or it could be a finance house. That is am important distinction.

at the point of sale the Sale of Goods Act comes into play, and that inexorable makes the seller liable if the product is faulty. It does not matter if it is a design or manufacturing fault the seller is liable.

So you should return your defective product to the seller. If the seller must either repair replace or refund the defective product.

If the product can be repaired, but the seller does not have the facilities to do it themselves, they must make tall necessary arrangements to effect the repair, as if they were doing it them selves. That may mean they sub contract the repair to another organisation - which may be the original manufacturer. But as it is a subcontract issue, the product owner has no need to be involved in any way in fulfilling the contract.

If the product needs to be transported to place other than the sellers premiss, it is the sellers responsibility to make all the necessary arrangements without any cost or extra inconvenience to the product owner.

In essence if your seller asks you to transport the product to a third party, then the seller is obliged to compensate you for any real costs incurred.

There is big But! The above only applies if you have arranged for the repair under the sellers warranty. It does not apply If you have arranged to have a repair done under the manufactures guarantee,which is a totally separate thing and is governed by the terms and conditions set out in the guarantee documentation.

The moral of this, is if you have a major repair due to faulty products insist it is done under SoGA warranty through your seller - not you nearest dealer.
 
Dec 4, 2007
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Bob,

Your contract of sale for any product exists between you and the seller. The seller is the person or organisation that takes your money,and as such it may be a dealer, or manufacture if the sell direct, or it could be a finance house. That is am important distinction.

at the point of sale the Sale of Goods Act comes into play, and that inexorable makes the seller liable if the product is faulty. It does not matter if it is a design or manufacturing fault the seller is liable.

So you should return your defective product to the seller. If the seller must either repair replace or refund the defective product.

If the product can be repaired, but the seller does not have the facilities to do it themselves, they must make tall necessary arrangements to effect the repair, as if they were doing it them selves. That may mean they sub contract the repair to another organisation - which may be the original manufacturer. But as it is a subcontract issue, the product owner has no need to be involved in any way in fulfilling the contract.

If the product needs to be transported to place other than the sellers premiss, it is the sellers responsibility to make all the necessary arrangements without any cost or extra inconvenience to the product owner.

In essence if your seller asks you to transport the product to a third party, then the seller is obliged to compensate you for any real costs incurred.

There is big But! The above only applies if you have arranged for the repair under the sellers warranty. It does not apply If you have arranged to have a repair done under the manufactures guarantee,which is a totally separate thing and is governed by the terms and conditions set out in the guarantee documentation.

The moral of this, is if you have a major repair due to faulty products insist it is done under SoGA warranty through your seller - not you nearest dealer.
Thank You I stand corrected.
 

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