hi does anybody run there car on bio-diesel? ive been offered bio-diesel at 85 pence per litre which is alot cheaper than an the petrol station im just bit concerned how my car will perform using it and will it damage the car
bio diesel
- Thread starter max1979
- Start date
No idea, but the new BMW diesel I've been driving today has a warning saying NO BIO DIESEL or DIESEL ADDATIVES. So worth checking with manufacturer if it's a newish car.
Damian
Moderator
The only way to be sure is check with your car main agent or manufacturer, unless there is any information in your vehicle handbook.
A lot of newer cars cannot run on bio alone, however, pump diesel does contain a small amount of bio,about 5% I think
A lot of newer cars cannot run on bio alone, however, pump diesel does contain a small amount of bio,about 5% I think
Personally, if you're running a common rail diesel or the car has a Lucas pump in it i wouldn't even consider it!
If you can & do use it, you'll need a new fuel filter after a few hundred miles - there's nothing better than biodiesel for cleaning out a fuel system!
If you can & do use it, you'll need a new fuel filter after a few hundred miles - there's nothing better than biodiesel for cleaning out a fuel system!
im running a 2000 reg fiat with 157k on the clock a mate of mine runs his transit on it no problem
Damian
Moderator
I am not quite sure now what you are asking.
You say you have a 2000 Fiat, are you running that on it?
As for Transits,. they will run on almost anything depending how old they are.
You say you have a 2000 Fiat, are you running that on it?
As for Transits,. they will run on almost anything depending how old they are.
This was not a scientific test:
I tried using 80% Bio Diesel in a 2001 Saab 2.2 (GM engine Diesel).
I was frankly disappointed with it, The car was noticeably lower in power and its acceleration was not good. I did not tow with it but I suspect it would have felt it was struggling. I also believe my fuel consumption deteriorated significantly. I cant remember the figures, but I do recall the lower mpg almost eliminated any cost benefit of the bio, and the loss of performance was almost embarrassing, so I personally wont use it any more with this car.
There are some cars that claim they will accept Bio Diesel, and as others have said some that wont.
I suggest that if you want to try it, first of all check with your cars manufacture if the car is safe to run on bio. If it is, they will probably quote you a maximum proportion of Bio to use – do not exceed it.
Remember that normal diesel already has about 5% bio, so take that into account during the following.
Progressively increase the proportion of bio in each tank fill up, and monitor its performance. If you notice a significant change then revert to the previous proportion.
I tried using 80% Bio Diesel in a 2001 Saab 2.2 (GM engine Diesel).
I was frankly disappointed with it, The car was noticeably lower in power and its acceleration was not good. I did not tow with it but I suspect it would have felt it was struggling. I also believe my fuel consumption deteriorated significantly. I cant remember the figures, but I do recall the lower mpg almost eliminated any cost benefit of the bio, and the loss of performance was almost embarrassing, so I personally wont use it any more with this car.
There are some cars that claim they will accept Bio Diesel, and as others have said some that wont.
I suggest that if you want to try it, first of all check with your cars manufacture if the car is safe to run on bio. If it is, they will probably quote you a maximum proportion of Bio to use – do not exceed it.
Remember that normal diesel already has about 5% bio, so take that into account during the following.
Progressively increase the proportion of bio in each tank fill up, and monitor its performance. If you notice a significant change then revert to the previous proportion.
i have been making my own, 70% rape seed oil 30% diesel, the diesel has its own anti freeze and it mixes with the oil no problem and also dilutes it to a thinner consistency,l use it on my 95 peugeot 806 1900 td (have even ran this old thing on pure rape seed oil with no issues), more modern common rail engines will struggle more, not because the engine cant handle it but because of the amount of sensore, sensitivity of electronic injectors and fuel pumps and above all the partitulate filters will probably clog up quicker.... smells like a fish and chip shop to lol
From the sound of your post,correct me if im wrong,the fuel is not coming from the pumps.So is it coming out of 25 litre drums?If so these may already be contaminated.One major problem with Bio is the water content.Even electronic fuel pumps as mentioned by John L (Bosch VP,s)have problems with internal timing sensors being attacked.Common rails suffer deeper,with nozzles struggling to pass debris larger than one-tenth of a human hair thus leading to fuel pressure issues.I would say yes to engine damage in the long run.
if it is filtered propely then it will be fine, dont forget diesel is a dirty grimey fuel in itself and if you were to put a litre of diesel in a clear glass, leave it 24 hours and you will see a small amount od debris at the bottom after, thus why diesels need a fresh fuel filter quite often where as petrols will go for 100k on one filter
its not the water contnt that shouldconcern yiu as just about eisels have a waer trap in the fuel system. Bio diesels can contain fat too much mthanol and this can cause seals to fail and also add to pinking issues as the methanol pre ignites. Methanol is also very hygroscopic, and its this that brings theer in.
"have been making my own, 70% rape seed oil 30% diesel, the diesel has its own anti freeze and it mixes with the oil no problem and also dilutes it to a thinner consistencyps"
i trust you have been keeping your reciepts as any fuel used in ic engines is subject to fuel duty and vat. Many make the mistake of thinking that bio fuels are duty free... they are not.
if you buy bio fuel it is often sold without the duty added to it, its up to the purchaser to inform HMRC about the purchase and pay the duty.
I knew a guy who made his own from used hydraulic fluid and iirc white spirits. His transit ran very well until the HMRC caught him. They calculated the duty owed based on how long he had been using it..... he had to sell his house to pay the duty or go to prison..
"have been making my own, 70% rape seed oil 30% diesel, the diesel has its own anti freeze and it mixes with the oil no problem and also dilutes it to a thinner consistencyps"
i trust you have been keeping your reciepts as any fuel used in ic engines is subject to fuel duty and vat. Many make the mistake of thinking that bio fuels are duty free... they are not.
if you buy bio fuel it is often sold without the duty added to it, its up to the purchaser to inform HMRC about the purchase and pay the duty.
I knew a guy who made his own from used hydraulic fluid and iirc white spirits. His transit ran very well until the HMRC caught him. They calculated the duty owed based on how long he had been using it..... he had to sell his house to pay the duty or go to prison..
the law actually is that anyone can make upto 2500 litres per year tax free. i have checked this out and its fact.
We have a neighbour who makes his own biodiesel, and he pointed out the regulations on the HMRC website - which confirm what Mozzy says - you can make 2500 litres without being liable for fuel duty - but must keep records of what you make and use.4.2.1 Exempt producers/users
If you have produced or used less than 2,500 litres of:
Production includes the manufacture or processing of road fuel, and the setting aside of any product that has not been charged with duty, with the intention of using it as road fuel.4.9.1 Exempt producers’ records
If you are an exempt producer (as defined in paragraph 4.2.1) you only need to record and keep the following information:
If you have produced or used less than 2,500 litres of:
- any biofuel, or
- any other fuel substitute or additive
Production includes the manufacture or processing of road fuel, and the setting aside of any product that has not been charged with duty, with the intention of using it as road fuel.4.9.1 Exempt producers’ records
If you are an exempt producer (as defined in paragraph 4.2.1) you only need to record and keep the following information:
- the date of each supply and/or own use
- the amount in standard litres of each supply or own use.
Quite interesting
I wonder what the recipy is for me to be able to run my Rover 75 on it. Bit worried though as they run BMW diesels in them.
With the current rediculas price of fuel and the fuel market getting the jitters over Egypt, I can only see people wanting to find and try alternative fuels.
There have been warnings issued on local news for people to secure their oil fired heating oil tanks better as the spate of thefts is increasing. I'm guessing it's the old transit brigade using red heating oil to run their vans. But do wonder, just how many cars actually get checked for red diesel. I could imagine Taxi's being checked as they are a business vehicle. Again I know lorries are checked frequently as again at around 10Mpg they use a hell of a lot of fuel.
With regard to diesel being a dirty fuel, I haven't realy seen any dirty fuel as such. But I could understand that a particle of debris is more likely to get into the fuel system as it might float in diesel as it is a more viscos fuel. I used to make brass fittings for a firm called Filtakleen based in Dorset who reckoned to save diesel users a substancial saving on standard fuel filters and service parts by using their fuel filtration system. I did fit a kit to our 1993 Diahatsu F70 and I did find a service parts cost saving but realy unless I did 100'000 miles per annum it was hard to detect any fuel saving they predicted. Howerver the engine oil fitration system did show a noticably better consistancey of oil at oil changes which meant that the oil was not at the end of it's useable life on or before an oil change was due. You certainly didn't get the oil pouring out black as soot and of tap water viscosity which is often the case with any oil these days. So again I reckon there was a good case for extended engine life before a major rebuild. The other product I was involved in with them was automated lorry greasing systems to lubricate all the suspension and steering pivot points.
I wonder what the recipy is for me to be able to run my Rover 75 on it. Bit worried though as they run BMW diesels in them.
With the current rediculas price of fuel and the fuel market getting the jitters over Egypt, I can only see people wanting to find and try alternative fuels.
There have been warnings issued on local news for people to secure their oil fired heating oil tanks better as the spate of thefts is increasing. I'm guessing it's the old transit brigade using red heating oil to run their vans. But do wonder, just how many cars actually get checked for red diesel. I could imagine Taxi's being checked as they are a business vehicle. Again I know lorries are checked frequently as again at around 10Mpg they use a hell of a lot of fuel.
With regard to diesel being a dirty fuel, I haven't realy seen any dirty fuel as such. But I could understand that a particle of debris is more likely to get into the fuel system as it might float in diesel as it is a more viscos fuel. I used to make brass fittings for a firm called Filtakleen based in Dorset who reckoned to save diesel users a substancial saving on standard fuel filters and service parts by using their fuel filtration system. I did fit a kit to our 1993 Diahatsu F70 and I did find a service parts cost saving but realy unless I did 100'000 miles per annum it was hard to detect any fuel saving they predicted. Howerver the engine oil fitration system did show a noticably better consistancey of oil at oil changes which meant that the oil was not at the end of it's useable life on or before an oil change was due. You certainly didn't get the oil pouring out black as soot and of tap water viscosity which is often the case with any oil these days. So again I reckon there was a good case for extended engine life before a major rebuild. The other product I was involved in with them was automated lorry greasing systems to lubricate all the suspension and steering pivot points.
The problem was that the guy was making loads and selling it.
It will not be long before the tax rules change as the chancellor needs every penny he can get his hands on.
It will not be long before the tax rules change as the chancellor needs every penny he can get his hands on.
something has to be done as in our local press they predict fuel to cost £1.80 a litre by the summer with is just crazy, this means im going to be spendind £15 per week for the not so pleasurable task of going to work and having been refused a pay rise on the excuse of my employers rates going up im going to have to look for a job closer to home, dont think he realises that everybodys rates have gone up not just his
http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/carreviews/firstdrives/262954/volkswagen_xl1.html?CMP=NLC-Newsletters&uid=1be379a5eeb2d914565291c6163889ac
how about 313miles per gallon then......
how about 313miles per gallon then......
the reason why they brought in the 2500 litre exception was because they cannot police it, so unlikely to change that rule for sometime.betides take a look at LPG, I am sure the market for this stuff is greater than the market for the home brew stuff, and as yet its still taxed much much lighter than the hardcore stuff.So if anything was going to become a target one would assume this would.Philspadders said:
our local morrisons started to sell bio diesel at the pump but they removed it within 2 months saying that they had received many complaints, i was tempted after seeing it at the pump and contacted ford to see if the galaxy i had at the time would be ok it was a 2007 new style 2.0 diesel, ford said it would be ok with 5% and no more which as has already been said is pretty much what pump diesel is anyway.
the thing that worries me is i now have a ford transit with the psa derived 2.2 tdci 140 diesel fitted and it clearly states on the pump cover "do not use bio diesel" if all pump diesel has 5% bio in it then how do you avoid it.
the thing that worries me is i now have a ford transit with the psa derived 2.2 tdci 140 diesel fitted and it clearly states on the pump cover "do not use bio diesel" if all pump diesel has 5% bio in it then how do you avoid it.
morrisons if i recall correctly started to use a 7% bio mix in there diesel, which they then withdraw. Your peugeot will be fine,all regular diesel has about a 5% mix of Bio and has had so for a few years, and 5 or 7 or even a 10% mix is fine and car manufacturers have to comply with this. when they say do not use BIO fuel it means 100% Bio.Icemaker said:
lpg is rising dramatically, my local garage has gone from 51.9 to 72.9 in 3 months,give it 2 years and i can see it being the same prie as diesel
Hi Mozzy,
Don't forget that LPG conversions use between 10 to 20% more fuel than the petrol, (see http://www.honestjohn.co.uk/faq/lpg-and-cng )
so motoring fuel costs are not quite half that of petrol, but close - at the moment.
I am also fairly confident that if use of LPG for motive power continues to increase, the Gov't will want to offset the loss of revenue from conventional fuels, and I think they are likely to impose greater fuel duty on LPG thus eroding any cost advantage. We saw this happen with Diesel vs Petrol.
Don't forget that LPG conversions use between 10 to 20% more fuel than the petrol, (see http://www.honestjohn.co.uk/faq/lpg-and-cng )
so motoring fuel costs are not quite half that of petrol, but close - at the moment.
I am also fairly confident that if use of LPG for motive power continues to increase, the Gov't will want to offset the loss of revenue from conventional fuels, and I think they are likely to impose greater fuel duty on LPG thus eroding any cost advantage. We saw this happen with Diesel vs Petrol.
I worked out on mine, that i was down about 5% on MPG
Plus, in Sheffield you get free council parking if you run on LPG...With the fuel savings (in cost per litre) the conversion paid for itself within 18 months - from then on i was quids in.
All depends on the quality of the conversion though...you pay for what you get!
Plus, in Sheffield you get free council parking if you run on LPG...With the fuel savings (in cost per litre) the conversion paid for itself within 18 months - from then on i was quids in.
All depends on the quality of the conversion though...you pay for what you get!
i get free parking in Sheffield and i have a deisel.. i go to Crystal Peaks or Meadowhell and also avoid the nightmare that is the city centre these days.
Facebook
Twitter