Car/caravan towing weights

[Tonka]

After using our 1984 Eldiss Cyclone 5 berth for the last seven years, I am finally considering changing it for something at least from the 90's
The old Eldiss' MPTLM is 895 so I know it is fine for my car. No problem at all.
What I need to know is this. What is the maximum I can tow with my car? Once I have this information I can start keeping my eye out for a new to me 'van.
The car is a VW Passat Highline Estate 1.9 130
A visit to my local dealership (Brayford Leisure) gave me this info which they gleaned from their Towsafe database:
Kerb: 1418
May Tow: 1600
Train:3630
My cars weight plate says this:
2030
3630 - train
1050 - front axle
1040 - rear axle
From that I would say that the max gross weight of the car (fully laden) is 2030kg. The max train weight is 3630kg which is a fully loaded car plus a trailer. The difference between the two numbers is 1600kg.
Therefore, the next 'van I buy must weigh no more than 1600kg MPTLM at 100% car to 'van weight ratio and 85% of 1600kg would make 1360kg which is the recommended weight my car should tow.
Is this all correct folks??

 

[TD42]

Not Quite Im afraid,according to your infomation your are legaly allowed 1600kg tow weight ,but the "recommended "85% ratio refers to the kerbweight of the car 1418kg so using the 85% formula you can tow a caravan of 1205kg.
how ever the 85% formula is a recommendation but even then you should not for safety sake exceed 100% of the kerbweight of 1418KG & if you passed your driving test after 1997 you may not even be legaly allowed to tow a trailer that exceeds the kerbweight of the car
I am not conversant with the full regulations or licence catorgories so you will have to double check you licence groups

 

[TD42]

Not Quite Im afraid,according to your infomation your are legaly allowed 1600kg tow weight ,but the "recommended "85% ratio refers to the kerbweight of the car 1418kg so using the 85% formula you can tow a caravan of 1205kg.
how ever the 85% formula is a recommendation but even then you should not for safety sake exceed 100% of the kerbweight of 1418KG & if you passed your driving test after 1997 you may not even be legaly allowed to tow a trailer that exceeds the kerbweight of the car
I am not conversant with the full regulations or licence catorgories so you will have to double check you licence groups

 

[Tonka]

Thanks TD42. I Thought the figures were too good to be true.
I passed my test in 1984 and hold B+E.
This does narrow my choice down a little but not by much.

 

[Tonka]

Just make this a little more baffling for me, I have been to look on http://www.whattowcar.com/
I don't know if it is just me but I can't find my car on it

I presume 'variant' means estate
It is a 2004 Passat Highline Estate, TDI, 5 speed manual, 130, 1.9pd
Would a kind person please have a look and see if I am going blind or stupid

 

[Sproket]

Hi Tonka
Have a look on your V5 under mass in service ( G ) that is the kerb weight of your car / model that you have.....

Do your weight calculations on that figure as that is the one that counts...

 

[Tonka]

Hi Sir Sprocket.
The G. Mass in service is 1569kg
This gives an 85% of 1333kg
That has widened my options again.
Thanks
Sean

 

[otherclive]

You could take the car to a local weigh bridge and that would give you the cars actual weight.

 

[pmb]

If you google mass in service you will find several threads about this. Worth a read if you have some spare time.

 

[josh1]

hi
just thought id chime in

i also have a vw passat estate, a 130 tdi sport, i tow a coastline 570 6 birth van MPTLM 1454 kgs and it tows like a dream, plenty of power an dosent really struggle unless in 6th gear up a hill but thats no supprise

 

[Tonka]

Hi Josh. Good to read you enjoy your 'Dub' as much as I do. That is a good weight to pull. Now I know they will perform as people claim. Are you a member of the forum 'ukpassats'?
Sean

 

[twindaddy]

Hi Tonka

With that weight available to you, you can get good 5 size 5 berth, mine is a 1996 Sterling 5 Berth with Max laden weight of 1250. There are 5 of us and seems spacious enough. Got to be sold and changed to much bigger now as got twins due so no doubt I will have to get up to the dizzy heights of 1600kg to get enough room!

TD

 

[Tonka]

Wow TD. That sounds great. My change is not happening until next year so plenty of time to make a choice.
We are wanting to reduce berths. The Eldiss is a five berth. Two up front and three in the rear. I would ideally like something more modern. Blown air heating, a cassette loo and hot water would be great. As there are only three of us and the dog now, a four berth would be fine.
We could even look at a three berth. By staying around the 20' length this would give us a really good 'van. Can't wait
Sean

 

[ProfJohnL]

Just a general note,

As most of us know the oft quoted industry recommendation of towing at 85% of kerbweight is only a guideline, but alas its also very imprecise because its based on the cars notional kerbweight, which is often not quoted by the car manufacturers except as a range of weights so often its just an fuzzy guess.

For these reasons (and there are many more) trying to be so precise to achieve an 85% match is frankly not worth loosing sleep about. A few percent either way is not going to make a massive difference, and if it does then there are most likely other important things you should be concerned about.

The only way of determining you true kerbweight is to strip the car of all personal belongings adjust the fuel and make sure you weigh 75kg and take it to a weighbridge. I Question weather its worth it as the result has no legal significance, and it offers no guarantee of the match actually being safe or legal.

I am not suggesting scrapping guidance, as it is logical to try and keep the weight of any trailer as small as possible and both novices and experienced caravanners should try to follow, but perhaps it should be realigned to take regard of accessible technical data the manufacturers have to provide. This may actually result in recommending a figure lower than the current 85% guidance!

For drivers with only Cat B (i.e not BE or B+E) then the towing limit is 100% but as the regulations state that is of Unladen Weight not Kerbweight. Perhaps ULW should be the basis of all recommendations? or
a percentage of the manufactures maximum towed weight limit, with additional speed restrictions if the trailer weighs more than the tow vehicle? Or
A percentage of the Gross Train Weight?