Caravan rear mounted cycle carriers - real world experience

[GaryB]

I have fitted a Thule G2 Sport cycle carrier to the back of the caravan, as this is one of those things that often prompts heated debates (often from those that have never used one), I thought I'd just write up how I got on.

The car is a Volvo V90 with a published kerb weight of 1850kgs, the caravan a Sprite Major EB with an uprated MTPLM of 1500kgs, so (for those obsessed by percentages) it is an 81% weight match, in reality the Volvo is probably quite a bit heavier. The caravan layout is central bathroom/end bedroom so weight distribution is pretty good. When we purchased the caravan I weighed everything on loading the first time so we should be within it's limits (the weight upgrade gave another 35kgs from memory). Towing without the bikes previously showed it to be a very stable tow.

The bike rack attaches to the factory-installed points on the caravan, BUT it does come with mountings so if fitting to a caravan that doesn't have the factory mounts, everything is included. You have to cut the uprights down to suit your application but it's all straight forward to assemble and fit. The rack comes ready to take two bikes, the bikes are secured with ratchet straps for the wheels and universal arm clamps for the frame.

Weights: The rack weighs 7kgs, my two bikes weigh 8.5kgs each so the total added weight is 24kgs.

When travelling we always put the clothes (in bags) on the bathroom floor, restricting hanging clothes in the end wardrobes to long items (wife's dresses etc), but this time we laid them on the foot of the bed and pulled the quilt back over them to keep them in place.

Noseweight with all of the above was 100kgs.

We travelled from home to Cornwall (M42, M5, A-roads) for 275 miles and back again last week and I can report that in my case, there was absolutely no difference to handling. With the bikes on the roof previously (when towing) my consumption was 23mpg, with the bikes on the back it was 26mpg.

Obviously other car/caravan designs and combinations will be different but I thought some might find my own experience interesting.

 

[otherclive]

Thanks, in reality 24 kg is a relatively low weight but you’ve given careful consideration to the various aspects of overall loading. Our Sprite was nose heavy and to get down to 80kg noseweight I would put some heavier things at the back and like you didn’t notice any untoward towing behaviours. I’m a bit envious as my non electric push bike probably weighs more than your two together. 😂

 

[GaryB]

Also note that when not in use the rack folds flat, adding around 8" to the overall length:

 

[GaryB]

Thanks, in reality 24 kg is a relatively low weight but you’ve given careful consideration to the various aspects. Our Sprite was nose heavy and to get down to 80kg noseweight I would put some heavier things at the back and like you didn’t notice any untoward towing behaviours. I’m a but envious as my non electric push bike probably weighs more than your two together. 😂

Yes, a battery bike (or even some normal bikes) certainly require more planning and thought. I eagerly await to see someone rolling up on site with a moped precariously strapped to one!

 

[Mr Plodd]

Have you been on a weighbridge to check your gross weight?
It's easy to balance weight fore and aft, but any extra (such as bikes etc) will impact GVW.
Just saying.

 

[GaryB]

Have you been on a weighbridge to check your gross weight?
It's easy to balance weight fore and aft, but any extra (such as bikes etc) will impact GVW.
Just saying.

No. The only weigh bridge round here had an accuracy reading of about +/- 30kgs from memory (I asked a few years back) so unfortunately I have to work with the assumption that the MIRO is correct and hand-weigh everything else. And yes, I KNOW some folks have had a bit of a shock with MIRO's being on the optimistic side of inaccurate. I just try to be as diligent as I can with what I have at my disposal. Watching the junk (sorry, essentials) that some folks unloaded from their caravans on arrival in Cornwall last week makes me think some think that every spare inch in a caravan can be loaded with something.

I seriously doubt the GTW for the car is exceeded!

 

[Mel]

We passed an Xplore 422 (MPTLM 1099kg) with a rear cycle rack carrying 2 bikes. The 422 has the same layout as our previous Elddis 462. Kitchen across the back and off side bathroom in the rear third. Our Elddis was always nose light.
I am sure that Gary is correct when he says that different layouts would be more suited to a rear cycle rack. Getting any any sort of sensible nose weight and weight distribution on an Xplore 422 carrying 2 bikes would be quite a task.
However I am not criticising, the person loading and towing it may well report a different experience.
Mel

 

[GaryB]

We passed an Xplore 422 (MPTLM 1099kg) with a rear cycle rack carrying 2 bikes. The 422 has the same layout as our previous Elddis 462. Kitchen across the back and off side bathroom in the rear third. Our Elddis was always nose light.

My parents have a Coachman with the same layout and empty he noseweight is negligible, it takes some careful loading to get it anywhere near what they need, I think if you put bikes on the back of that it'd have a negative noseweight.

 

[ProfJohnL]

As GaryB correctly states each outfit will be different so whilst his experience caused no undue concerns, that won't necessarily be true for every one.

Correct loading cannot be based on a single feature like end loading, it has to be about getting a range of features correct or keeping them within reason.

Some people suggest you should not end load at all, which in fact is ignoring the fact that caravans always do have some end loading caused by whatever they construct at the ends of the caravan. As always whilst the advice may be don't end load the reality is its an infinite number of shades of grey, not black and white. and some limited end loading as Gary has found may be manageable.

It is a physical guarantee that end loading does increase the yaw inertia of a caravan which is one of the major factors involved with loosing stability, and it will reduce the safe operating envelope of the outfit, so it should always be avoided if possible.

 

[Raywood]

Basically loading correctly is a nightmare to get right and the cycle carrier can make it even more difficult. This looks a very light addition and the impact has been thought out and it looks decent on paper. I cannot see any obvious problem and upgrading the MTPLM has increased the load allowance even with the bikes fitted. I would agree checking on a weighbridge would be good if a better on could be located.
Looks like the wind resistance of bikes on the car roof is pretty high given the improvement in fuel consumption, but it probably needs a couple more trips to confirm this. .

 

[ProfJohnL]

...
Looks like the wind resistance of bikes on the car roof is pretty high given the improvement in fuel consumption, ...

It is well proven fact that anything added to a car, even just the roof bars is enough to make a measurable effect on MPG, especially if doing high speed driving. The general advice is always to remove unnecessary load and aero drag from your car if you want to maximise efficiency.

This is one of the reasons why many new cars no longer have spare wheels and fewer cars have roof bars as standard.

Even a few Kg can make an impact, consider the effect the weight of fuel has on F1 cars, and how their lap time improve over the duration of the race, and the degradation of tyres which improves as the race progresses.

 

[otherclive]

A F1 car will reach speeds of 223 mph, with a full fuel load of 100 kg of which most is used up in the race. It weighs 660 kg including the driver. No wonder a few kilos of weight affect performance, much more difficult to discern on a car and its caravan. The right foot has significantly more effect on mpg.

 

[Raywood]

As far as weight is concerned I do agree. Given that a car and caravan combination is normally well over 3,000 kg a few more here or there makes almost no discernible difference although it will be there. Wind resistance is very different and small changes can make appreciable differences.

 

[Mandarin]

Wilst I fully understand the importance of avoiding excessive end loading i do wonder how much difference 20 to 40 kgs under an end bed or in a rear cupboard or hanging on the back will make to a van weighing 1500+ kgs.

Those scary videos of model cars towing on a belt show the extremes with 90% of the weight being moved, but if with a MIRO of 1350 kgs only 150kgs (10% of MTPLM) remains to be moved and 50kgs of that is probably battery, and motor mover close to the axle.

Clearly nose weight is critical but given other threads where unladen noseweights have been found to be over 130kgs then there's no alternative but to offset that with 30 to 40 kgs in the back, especially as most of the lounge / kitchen storage is ahead of the axle.

We've been towing an EB van for a while and have had no option but to use the rear storage to the max just to get the noseweight down to 90kgs, yet have never felt any negative effects when towing.

Not advocating end loading at all but just curious to know what the thoughts are of those who've studied this,

 

[otherclive]

My last van was nose heavy when unladen as most of its equipment was in front of the axle. Wardrobes bathroom, table and bunks were at the back. So like you I had no option but to place stuff aft of the axle to get noseweight down from 110kg unloaded to 80 kg for the car. At times my tool bag would go at the back and I generally had 2 litres in the cassette and 5 litres in the flush tank. But it towed very well.

 

[Raywood]

The problem of rear loading is the laws of physics. Quite simply too much weight at the rear can create a see saw effect but in the real world it does seem to take something near silly to be a real problem. in normal driving. Just where this becomes dangerous is simply not within the ability of most of us. The best you can do is get the nose weight legal and see how it tows. If you feel a problem then the combination is not good enough and something has to change. Even when it feels safe you would be well advised to take care as you will probably have a lower point at which snaking occurs.

 

[Hutch]

Wilst I fully understand the importance of avoiding excessive end loading i do wonder how much difference 20 to 40 kgs under an end bed or in a rear cupboard or hanging on the back will make to a van weighing 1500+ kgs.

Those scary videos of model cars towing on a belt show the extremes with 90% of the weight being moved, but if with a MIRO of 1350 kgs only 150kgs (10% of MTPLM) remains to be moved and 50kgs of that is probably battery, and motor mover close to the axle.

Clearly nose weight is critical but given other threads where unladen noseweights have been found to be over 130kgs then there's no alternative but to offset that with 30 to 40 kgs in the back, especially as most of the lounge / kitchen storage is ahead of the axle.

We've been towing an EB van for a while and have had no option but to use the rear storage to the max just to get the noseweight down to 90kgs, yet have never felt any negative effects when towing.

Not advocating end loading at all but just curious to know what the thoughts are of those who've studied this,

I had a Coachman 545 with rear Island bed, which had a huge storage space under the bed for the Cadac, wheel ramps, spare kitchen sink etc. Travelling past an HGV one day and just as the rear of the van passed the front of the HGV a massive snake began , three swings and the ATC cut in dragging the unit straight.
Arrived at the site and took almost everything out from under the bed and I could feel the difference in the tow when going round , roundabouts.

 

[ProfJohnL]

...
We've been towing an EB van for a while and have had no option but to use the rear storage to the max just to get the noseweight down to 90kgs, yet have never felt any negative effects when towing.
...

What is an EB?

 

[GaryB]

What is an EB?

End Bed. Same as ours shown in the original post, the cavernous storage space under the bed is tempting for some folks to load without considering the effects of doing so.

 

[ProfJohnL]

Knowing how much you can afford to nd load is a very difficult figure to predict, as each outfit will be different. Even outfits with teh same tow vehicle and trailer types, will respond differently depending on how each individual loads the outfit with their items.

But also the effect of end loading is highly dependant on road and driving conditions. For those that tell us they have so many Kg of end loading and its no problem, that assessment could change due to changing dynamics of actually driving as Hutch has reported in #17.

End loading isn't the only aspect of towing that is difficult to quantify and predict.

 

[littlebasher]

I use ours for a single electric bike (minus the battery). That, combined with the rack adds about 25kg of weight to the back

Can i feel a difference? - absolutely. Definitely more sensitive to side winds / trucks, but manageable.

 

[RogerL]

End Bed. Same as ours shown in the original post, the cavernous storage space under the bed is tempting for some folks to load without considering the effects of doing so.

Or End Bathroom! There's no standard for caravan abbreviations.

 

[GaryB]

Or End Bathroom! There's no standard for caravan abbreviations.

I know! However John was asking about Mandarin's EB caravan which is End Bedroom.

 

[Buckman]

Or End Bathroom! There's no standard for caravan abbreviations.

EB is generally End Bathroom.

 

[ProfJohnL]

All the more reason to use the intended full description and follow that with the abbreviation so its clear whats in discussion for example

Gross Train Weight (GTW)