Emergency Towing of a Twin-Axle

[stevearty]

Hi folks, I'm currently part-time wardening on a caravan site, where we recently had a chap pull on who had damaged his twin-axle 2000(ish) Conqueror. Damage was on the nearside, extensive to the bodywork, but more worryingly, his front axle, of the two was twisted.

He has spent the last few weeks, whilst staying with us trying to either find someone who could repair the damage and get him mobile, or replace the axle, all to no avail. He is due to leave us tomorrow and has a long journey in front of him. I asked him his plans and essentially they boiled down to; a) tow the van with the wheel bent out of true, accepting that it may cause excessive wear on the tyre, making sure he checks it at regular intervals. b) take the wheel off and tow on the remaining three.

I could find no easy way to put him off, but suggested he did his homework before resorting to such drastic measures - thing is, does anyone have experience of this? What's the alternative?

 

[Lutz]

The only sensible and safe alternative is to load the caravan on a truck and transport it like that. His insurance should pay for the costs of having it moved off the site so I don't know why he's even contemplating the other suggestions, which aren't really viable or safe alternatives.

 

[ProfJohnL]

It one thing to have a caravan damaged whilst travelling on the road, and then having to move it so it doesn't cause a hazard - that is an emergency.

But to knowingly start a journey with an un-roadworthy vehicle is not only extremely foolhardy but I am certain illegal and not an emergency.

I hate to think what the handling of the outfit will be like, and whilst the driver may feel at liberty to endanger his/her own lives, but they have no mandate to endanger the lives of any passengers or othe road users.

If Social Services were aware of this persons intentions they'd be required to remove any children from an obvious danger their parents may intend perpetrating.

Lutz's advice is correct. He should arrange a caravan transporter to move the caravan.

 

[Damian]

He cannot legally tow it off site with a known bent axle, its that simple.
He must arrange for recovery.
You are now in the position of being a party to whatever happens, and if he does try to tow it off , you are obliged to inform the Police of his actions.

Just think on a bit.....if you allow him to leave, knowing what he has got and he has an accident, which he will, and someone is killed,,,,,how will YOU feel?
Try explaining to a Judge why you did not report him...it wil not be an easy thing to do.

 

[Dustydog]

Steve

If this bloke is still intent on leaving today please ring the Police now and arrange for them to be at the campsite entrance to stop him leaving.

 

[Parksy]

Just to add to the good advice already given, this guy's car insurance will be invalidated if he tows a damaged caravan on the highway, so not only is he risking an accident but he would have no insurance either.
Is he in the AA or RAC? Either of the two main clubs?

 

[stevearty]

Hi folks, thanks and I agree with everything you say, Sadly he hadn't insured his Caravan when he purchased it. Since then lots of Caravan repair services have promised they would look at it and then let him down.

He is not in the process of leaving with it yet - he's actually just gone to a Caravan Dealer who says he has a recon axle he can buy, so it may not be an issue. But I agree, pursuading him not to leave with it, would be the best option and then "dobbing" him in if he refuses to see sense.

 

[seth1]

The safest way without a recovery would be to take the wheels completely off the damaged axle and strap it up securely.Making sure the van is totally empty.Then move it to the closest repairer.

 

[Lutz]

You're not seriously suggesting removing wheels from the damaged axle and then towing the caravan like that to the repairer, are you?

 

[Damian]

Quote " The safest way without a recovery would be to take the wheels completely off the damaged axle and strap it up securely.Making sure the van is totally empty.Then move it to the closest repairer."

That has got to be the craziest idea I have ever heard of.

 

[ProfJohnL]

If Seth's suggestion of removing the pair of wheels on the damaged axle and towing relying on the remaining pair of wheels is based on the number of HGV's where one axle of pair can be raised when the trailer is unloaded is wildly misjudged.

For a start the HGV's where this happens are designed to do it. twin axle caravans are not.

Secondly the difference between the unloaded and loaded masses (i.e. payload) of an HGV can be more than twice the ULM, This means the single axle is sufficient to carry the ULM. Where as the caravan payload is small fraction of the ULM, so even empty and unladen caravan is most likely to be well above the single axles load margin and suspension rating, a fact that is well evident when you raise the nose with the jockey wheel to try and reduce the front axle tyre contact with the ground when trying to manoeuvre by hand.

Thirdly It is quite likely the weight of the caravan will exceed the tyres load rating on a single axle.

the suggestion may have been made with the best of intentions, but in practice it is highly unsatisfactory, illegal and far from safe.

 

[seth1]

Based on what?does anyone know the exact wieght of the van empty?Some twin axle caravans can be lighter than a single axle.It is quite normal practice to do this with a commercial vehicle and im not refering to a trailer lift axle.Ive yet to come across someone fitting a road spring on the hard shoulder.

 

[ProfJohnL]

"Based on what?does anyone know the exact wieght of the van empty?"

In short, no I don't, - but I do know the vast majority of caravans MIRO/MIS weight is usually 75% or more of the caravans MTPLM - a fact you verify by checking manufactures specifications.

The manufacturer will specify the caravans axle/suspension components based on the caravans designed MTPLM. This is necessary to comply with the Constructions and use regulations that specify ride height and road obstacle clearances.

All caravans do not use the same axle and suspension rating. So in the context of this thread there is no point comparing single axle caravans to twin axle caravans regardless of size and weight.

In the context of this thread, with a TA set on the ground each axle carries about 50% of the weight. If you prevent one axle from carrying its assigned load, that load is transferred to the second axle/suspension, to all intents and purposes doubling its load bearing. This is likely to exceed the suspension units rating even with an empty caravan.

"It is quite normal practice to do this with a commercial vehicle and im not refering to a trailer lift axle."

As I had already pointed out, an unloaded HGV will be well under its MAM, which means a single suspension unit may well be capable of carrying the vehicle load without exceeding its axle rating. Though I am surprised to read that its common practice for vehicles without an axle lift.

"Ive yet to come across someone fitting a road spring on the hard shoulder."

I have absolutely no idea why you have included this comment, as no one has suggested removing or fitting a road spring on the hard shoulder

 

[seth1]

So as you state you dont know the wieghts and niether do i so why make such sweeping statements.As the title says emergency towing of a twin axle,not every day use of a twin axle.
So the scenario is use the van on the road with axle damage possible then leading to frame damage from towing with wrong castor/camber angle or even worse the wheel/hub assemble comes off from bearing failure.You work it out.
My reference to a commercia trailer i thought was quite easy to understand,But i,ll explain.A road spring brakes whilst in service perhaps on the motorway,its very unlikely of getting it on to a suitable vehicle for pretty obvious reasons.There is no real option of working on the hard shoulder.So the axle gets strapped up.Very similar to this scenario dont you think?

 

[Lutz]

If the damaged caravan cannot be pulled on to a low loader, then it will just have to be lifted on.
Even a lightweight twin axle caravan will have proportionately considerably less difference between MIRO and MTPLM than in the case of a heavy commercial vehicle so there is absolutely no way that just one of the two axles would cope with the load. MIRO is considerably more than half the MTPLM.

 

[Surfer]

Just to add to the good advice already given, this guy's car insurance will be invalidated if he tows a damaged caravan on the highway, so not only is he risking an accident but he would have no insurance either.
Is he in the AA or RAC? Either of the two main clubs?

The above is an urban myth and this can be checked with any car insurance company. Third party insurance will always be in place which is why it is compulsory.

 

[Surfer]

Based on what?does anyone know the exact wieght of the van empty?Some twin axle caravans can be lighter than a single axle.It is quite normal practice to do this with a commercial vehicle and im not refering to a trailer lift axle.Ive yet to come across someone fitting a road spring on the hard shoulder.

As pointed out by John, the weight of the caravan will definitely exceed the load index of the tyres as most twin axles have car tyres and not commercial tyres. This alone woudl make it illegal to tow on a public road.
As for the caravan being uninsured, this is why many storage and some caravan sites insist that a caravan is insured. If that caravan caught on fire while on a caravan site and damaged other caravans, there may be some liabuility on the site owner for allowing an uninsured caravan onto the site.
Even so the owner of a caravan that was damaged by the uninsured caravan would have a very hard time claiming off the person who is uninsured as they probably cannot afford any sort of payment.
Perhaps it should be compulsory for storage and site owners to insist that all caravans on their premises have valid insurance at all times.

 

[Parksy]

Just to add to the good advice already given, this guy's car insurance will be invalidated if he tows a damaged caravan on the highway, so not only is he risking an accident but he would have no insurance either.
Is he in the AA or RAC? Either of the two main clubs?

The above is an urban myth and this can be checked with any car insurance company. Third party insurance will always be in place which is why it is compulsory.

So you don't think that towing a caravan that you know to be damaged with your car would have any effect on the car insurance policy if they were asked to pay out as a result of an accident that could be attributed to you towing this damaged caravan then?

I wouldn't take the chance.
If the guy can't arrange for the caravan to be transported or dealt with by qualified engineers his next best bet might be to source a second hand axle from a caravan breaker who does mail order and arrange for a mobile caravan engineer to fit it.

 

[Dustydog]

Parksy is correct.

Every motor insurance policy has a due diligence type clause that demands the insured takes good care and ensures their vehicle is in a good legal condition. This applies to trailers and caravans being towed.
If the OP follows Seth's advice then the Insurer will be fully justified in rejecting any claim that arises.

 

[seth1]

Car tyres on a caravan?Ive never fitted car tyres to any of my vans.The ply rating is wrong for a start.The load index is also wrong.So by that assumption any body who has car tyres fitted is uninsured?We still dont have any proper facts.

 

[seth1]

Well seen as we,ve got no proper facts i thought i,d look on BPW,S web site.It may have these particular axles fitted,it may not.But the lightest braked axle on rubber i can find is rated at 1850kg by BPW them selves.

 

[NigelHutson]

2013 Swift Conquerors tyres,
570 (single axle) 195/70 R15C 104 R = load rating of 900 kg, commercial tyres.
630 (twin axle) 185/70 R14 88 T = load rating of 560 kg, car tyres.
Obviously four tyres of 560 kg rating will give 2240 kg in total, whereas the two commercial tyres give 1800 kg.
Generally the single axle tyres have higher pressures too.
Nigel.

 

[Lutz]

Going by Nigels data, if the tyre load rating of the twin axle is 560kg, then the load rating of each axle won't exceed twice that or 1120kg. Now, unless I've got my figures wrong, the MIRO of twin axle Conqeror is around 1650kg and that's a lot more than what each axle can carry.

 

[ProfJohnL]

Hello Seth,

I consider my comments to have been carefully thought through and took into account the known facts about caravans and their load and tyre margins. Points which have been recognised by other contributors.

Whilst the title of the thread uses the word "Emergency", if you read the thread, then it is clear the proposed action is far from an emergency, but a calculated and premeditated action by the owner to move a damaged caravan onto the road.

The comments on this thread have expressed concern about the caravanners proposal, and are attempting to explaining why it is not a good thing to even attempt to move the caravan in the ways suggested.

The OP's posting reports the caravan to have been damaged Quote
"but more worryingly, his front axle, of the two was twisted."

So this is not a simple broken coil or leaf spring, so your comments "The safest way without a recovery would be to take the wheels completely off the damaged axle and strap it up securely.Making sure the van is totally empty.Then move it to the closest repairer." is not relevant. If the caravanner were to try your proposal then the whole weight of the caravan would be carried on just one axle doubling its intended load, and that on its suspension and tyres.

Other contributors have added specific technical details which show the remaining axle and tyres would be overloaded, and that is both hazardous and dangerous.

Whilst you solution may be applicable for HGV's it is not a safe solution for caravans.

 

[seth1]

A totally empty conqueror wieghs in at 1400kg.The tyre load rating is 88T ,this translates to 560kg each.Plus the normal 25% extra load bearing for unevenly loaded wieght.By my maths thats 1400kg or there abouts.