Energy price increases

[Sam Vimes]

Gas and Oil prices seem to be increasing which has the knock on effect of raising prices of electricity. However, I'm with Scottish Power which is 100% green from their own wind farms. So, my electricity prices shouldn't affected much - right!

Which also got me thinking - When I get my volts, how do they filter out all the non- green stuff?

 

[otherclive]

Gas and Oil prices seem to be increasing which has the knock on effect of raising prices of electricity. However, I'm with Scottish Power which is 100% green from their own wind farms. So, my electricity prices shouldn't affected much - right!

Which also got me thinking - When I get my volts, how do they filter out all the non- green stuff?

If the very many small energy suppliers there are scams insofar as there is no regulation to cover the ”green” supplies that they charge more for. But this Which article might be helpful.
https://www.which.co.uk/news/2019/09/how-green-is-your-energy-tariff/

 

[Sam Vimes]

My question was somewhat 'tongue in cheek' since its raining here and has been for what seems like days - so I'm bored not being able to work outside.

The article was somewhat interesting but I knew most of that already. BTW: didn't see Scottish Power mentioned in the article.

My comment about filtering out the non-green stuff was also a dig at the energy companies and suppliers marketing folks, but if my company wants a large increase I shall be querying the fact that they are a 100% renewable energy supplier and are one of the 'Big Six', so supposedly they should be somewhat immune from increased gas prices.

It also irritates me that many of the smaller companies are often refered to as energy suppliers when in fact they do no such thing. They mearly buy and sell someone elses stuff.

I don't see it mentioned much these days but there used to be a 6% surcharge on our bills to provide cash for green projects. Also the Highlands also had a small surcharge - I think it used to be about 2p a unit - just because we were the Highlands. I can't see if these still apply.

Oooh! I think it may have stopped raining - for a while anyway.

 

[Tobes]

My question was somewhat 'tongue in cheek' since its raining here and has been for what seems like days - so I'm bored not being able to work outside.

The article was somewhat interesting but I knew most of that already. BTW: didn't see Scottish Power mentioned in the article.

My comment about filtering out the non-green stuff was also a dig at the energy companies and suppliers marketing folks, but if my company wants a large increase I shall be querying the fact that they are a 100% renewable energy supplier and are one of the 'Big Six', so supposedly they should be somewhat immune from increased gas prices.

It also irritates me that many of the smaller companies are often refered to as energy suppliers when in fact they do no such thing. They mearly buy and sell someone elses stuff.

I don't see it mentioned much these days but there used to be a 6% surcharge on our bills to provide cash for green projects. Also the Highlands also had a small surcharge - I think it used to be about 2p a unit - just because we were the Highlands. I can't see if these still apply.

Oooh! I think it may have stopped raining - for a while anyway.

Couple of interesting things. 1) As I understand it the day ahead bid price is set based on the lowest successful bid, independent of source. I.e. cheap renewable energy may be sold for a much higher price based on the cost of gas or coal driving the market,.
2) While there is lots of renewable energy available in the north of Scotland, the inter-connectors between Scotland and England are in practice a bit naff, and can only handle so much power. There are plans to add new inter-connectors between England and Scotland off shore, to allow greater distribution from the very top of the Highlands to the large consumers in the midlands and south.

 

[Raywood]

We are with Octopus which is all genuine green, which some are not.
I am afraid my costs have gone up just like anyone else and trying comparison does no good. The simple answer is that although they only buy green energy the price they buy it at is the same as the charge for other forms of generation, so only their profit margin is the difference. They may generate a bit themselves but are reliant on the market for most. Basically those buying none green energy will buy up green energy in preference if it is cheaper, so they set the market rate.
The only thing you can do is if you are on a fixed contract which has not renewed since the price hike, is hang on to it as long as possible, but even then if prices rise further you could end up paying even more then. Sorry, but no escape for most of us.
Octopus say in their blurb that they charge 5% to cover their costs but I have not seen any other firm show what they charge.

 

[Buckman]

It also irritates me that many of the smaller companies are often refered to as energy suppliers when in fact they do no such thing. They mearly buy and sell someone else's stuff.

The small energy companies and the Big Six like BGAS, Scottish Power are all suppliers as they supply to premises.
These suppliers buy the electric from a distribution company i.e. Scottish Power as a supplier buys from Scottish Power the distribution company. Same with Npower, EDF, EMEB etc.
Confusing isn't it?

 

[otherclive]

The small energy companies and the Big Six like BGAS, Scottish Power are all suppliers as they supply to premises.
These suppliers buy the electric from a distribution company i.e. Scottish Power as a supplier buys from Scottish Power the distribution company. Same with Npower, EDF, EMEB etc.
Confusing isn't it?

But the big boys can buy their electricity or gas for longer contract periods into the future and so hedge against market ups and downs. The smaller companies tend to buy short term so having set low tariffs they have to pay higher prices than the tariffs, thus losing money which they are not capitalised to lose.

 

[Buckman]

But the big boys can buy their electricity or gas for longer contract periods into the future and so hedge against market ups and downs. The smaller companies tend to buy short term so having set low tariffs they have to pay higher prices than the tariffs, thus losing money which they are not capitalised to lose.

Actually other way around. Smaller companies tend to buy long term to be competitive as it is to their advantage as they can offer a lower price in the future. They normally buy from one of the Big Six suppliers.
Smaller companies can be forced out of business in the bidding war if they have sufficient funds to bid which is highly unlikely. generally they buy from one of the Big Six who can manipulate the price upwards when it suits their purpose.
The general public have no idea how the energy market is being manipulated. They may think they are buying from i.e. Octopus as they are cheaper, but Octopus may have bought the electric from BGAS, EMEB, or one of the other suppliers.
BGAS, EMEB, Npower, Scottish Power etc only issue bills to customers as they do not generate or distribute power. I cannot comment on gas as was never involved on the gas side.

 

[Dustydog]

No free lunches! Green ? Spare me! Window dressing. So Octopus have now bought the defunct AVRO portfolio. Will it be green😜😜😜😜

 

[Beachball]

We are with Octopus which is all genuine green, which some are not.
I am afraid my costs have gone up just like anyone else and trying comparison does no good. The simple answer is that although they only buy green energy the price they buy it at is the same as the charge for other forms of generation, so only their profit margin is the difference. They may generate a bit themselves but are reliant on the market for most. Basically those buying none green energy will buy up green energy in preference if it is cheaper, so they set the market rate.
The only thing you can do is if you are on a fixed contract which has not renewed since the price hike, is hang on to it as long as possible, but even then if prices rise further you could end up paying even more then. Sorry, but no escape for most of us.
Octopus say in their blurb that they charge 5% to cover their costs but I have not seen any other firm show what they charge.

We are also with Octopus but our fixed contract is until next Feb 2022 as someone says hang on to it and how much it has gone up my wife putting some money aside into a pot

 

[otherclive]

We are also with Octopus but our fixed contract is until next Feb 2022 as someone says hang on to it and how much it has gone up my wife putting some money aside into a pot

Our son looked at a new tariff and the best he could find was +£1000 pa.

 

[Sam Vimes]

Couple of interesting things. 1) As I understand it the day ahead bid price is set based on the lowest successful bid, independent of source. I.e. cheap renewable energy may be sold for a much higher price based on the cost of gas or coal driving the market,.
2) While there is lots of renewable energy available in the north of Scotland, the inter-connectors between Scotland and England are in practice a bit naff, and can only handle so much power. There are plans to add new inter-connectors between England and Scotland off shore, to allow greater distribution from the very top of the Highlands to the large consumers in the midlands and south.

#1 Essentially the effects of a Free Market Economy.

#2 My information is a bit behind the times but a couple of years back when I looked into this there was a target in terms of wind power Mwh to be fullfilled by I think 2030 or whatever. At the time I looked that target had been exceeded way ahead of time yet still wind farms were encouraged.... until the subsidies were dropped and the pace of build slowed but not entirely. The over target production, as you refer to in #2 produced more energy than Scotland demands and therefore the excess needed to be exported and this is where problems occured.

The Western HVDC link was new technology to the UK and has proven to be unreliable. Now an Eastern HVDC link is planned - will this be any better. Recently the link from Skye to the Western Isles broke and was only fixed a couple of weeks ago.

During problems when the excess wind power cannot be used or exported operators are told to constrain their output, for which they get paid. Paid to do nothing , for which the end user foots the bill.

Its complicated.

 

[otherclive]

#1 Essentially the effects of a Free Market Economy.

#2 My information is a bit behind the times but a couple of years back when I looked into this there was a target in terms of wind power Mwh to be fullfilled by I think 2030 or whatever. At the time I looked that target had been exceeded way ahead of time yet still wind farms were encouraged.... until the subsidies were dropped and the pace of build slowed but not entirely. The over target production, as you refer to in #2 produced more energy than Scotland demands and therefore the excess needed to be exported and this is where problems occured.

The Western HVDC link was new technology to the UK and has proven to be unreliable. Now an Eastern HVDC link is planned - will this be any better. Recently the link from Skye to the Western Isles broke and was only fixed a couple of weeks ago.

During problems when the excess wind power cannot be used or exported operators are told to constrain their output, for which they get paid. Paid to do nothing , for which the end user foots the bill.

Its complicated.

Similarly owners coal, gas and diesel stations will be paid to maintain the back up capacity and then paid if its required on line. There is a small diesel generator set up not far from us which is part of a solar farm. But Wiltshire now has two large battery storage facilities recently installed.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-engla...,a year to construct near Minety in Wiltshire.

 

[Raywood]

No free lunches! Green ? Spare me! Window dressing. So Octopus have now bought the defunct AVRO portfolio. Will it be green😜😜😜😜

Yes it will be green, but I am afraid you will have to pay the current rates, which are higher than I suspect you will have been paying, but the near the same as any other supplier. Octopus are probably the greenest of the suppliers and all there electricity is genuinely green and gas has green offset.
I did see in todays paper that they have just managed to get an investment of over £4,000,000, so they should be safe, and they were regarded as one of the safer ones on last Thursdays Martin Lewis money show.
What you may notice is their service level which gets the the Which recommendation every year.
Personally I am not sure buying green makes any difference to the environment, but it does put pressure on suppliers to produce it. The energy we use as a nation any given day is whatever the mix is and the companies not using all green energy simply take whatever is available after the green users have taken their share. Basically that means that the more people who take fully green power the higher the percentage of the rest is in other suppliers output.

 

[Beachball]

Our son looked at a new tariff and the best he could find was +£1000 pa.

i hope your son get one but at present we do not need to

 

[otherclive]

i hope your son get one but at present we do not need to

Thanks BB. My son doesn’t have much choice as he’s nearly finished his contract.

 

[Sam Vimes]

Similarly owners coal, gas and diesel stations will be paid to maintain the back up capacity and then paid if its required on line.

That's true but the last time I looked into this Wind Farm operators were getting considerably more than conventional operators.

I wish when my services weren't required I still got paid

 

[Beachball]

Thanks BB. My son doesn’t have much choice as he’s nearly finished his contract.

otherclive with us on a smart meter they give us prices if you can get your son to keep searching on energy prices there is always new ones coming up and i hope he gets one very reasonable for his budget

 

[Thingy]

Beware of Smart Meters. A great number of them are incompatable between suppliers. Some for example that work with British Gas, simply dont work properly if you switch to another supplier, and so on and so forth. There is supposed to be another generation of these things, if you are going to have one, make sure it is this later version.

 

[Dustydog]

BB . Why does a smart meter give you a better price?

 

[otherclive]

Beware of Smart Meters. A great number of them are incompatable between suppliers. Some for example that work with British Gas, simply dont work properly if you switch to another supplier, and so on and so forth. There is supposed to be another generation of these things, if you are going to have one, make sure it is this later version.

We enquired of BG and they confirmed they are only fitting the latest generation 2 models.

 

[otherclive]

otherclive with us on a smart meter they give us prices if you can get your son to keep searching on energy prices there is always new ones coming up and i hope he gets one very reasonable for his budget

With my contract I put my readings in monthly. I can see gas and electric usage each month but no costs or consumption. Yet I used to be able to see and compare with the previous year. When I complained I was told the facility to closely look at your figures is now only available if you have a smart meter. I have had two smart meter appointments cancelled at short notice so can’t really be bothered at present. What I do is every two months go on the chat line and get them to update my account and send a statement. But bizarrely it comes by mail not a soft copy.

 

[Dustydog]

Does it really matter? We pay via DD. I can look back year on year and see how much my costs have increased. A smart meter? Sorry not for me. There’s more than enough Big Brothers out there!

 

[Ern]

Does it really matter? We pay via DD. I can look back year on year and see how much my costs have increased. A smart meter? Sorry not for me. There’s more than enough Big Brothers out there!

If you were unable to enjoy the reduced rate for off peak without one, would you then want one?

 

[Beachball]

BB . Why does a smart meter give you a better price?

Octopus Energy put our smart meter in compare all top UK Energy providers in ten seconds free to use service but so far we are happy with this company we have had two fixed contract .