I read in the October issue of PC an article about gas flow being interrupted due to residue buildup. Does this occur with both types of gas (Propane/Butane) or just one of them. We are currently using butane but are expecting to take delivery of a new 2007 caravan and would like advice on which gas regulator would be best to have fitted. We don't winter caravan at the present time so 'freezing' would not be a problem. Thanks for any advice.
Gas problems on 'new caravans'!
- Thread starter AnnM1
- Start date
My 2004 van just suffered the dreaded regulator problem and i have looke dinto this issue in great detail.
if you model is a 2007 you might well have the new elbow that is being fitted to the regulators, this alters the input angle of the gas hose and eradicates the build up issue.
The issue is much less likely if you use propane (red) for some reason. If your van does not have this new elbow they will soon be available for less than a fiver.
I have made allowances for this by keeping a old style regulator with hose and jubilee clips in the van in case it ever goes again. (i hate warm beer)
with reference to which gas i use propane al year round even in freezing temps.
if you model is a 2007 you might well have the new elbow that is being fitted to the regulators, this alters the input angle of the gas hose and eradicates the build up issue.
The issue is much less likely if you use propane (red) for some reason. If your van does not have this new elbow they will soon be available for less than a fiver.
I have made allowances for this by keeping a old style regulator with hose and jubilee clips in the van in case it ever goes again. (i hate warm beer)
with reference to which gas i use propane al year round even in freezing temps.
We collected our new van last week and where adviced that the problem has been eradicated so had no need to worry. Like mike we use propane all year round mainly due to us using the van all year and dont want butane freezing up on us so the residue issue is even more unlikely.
I use Propane in my 2005 model and had to replace the regulator last month. I spoke to my caravan dealer today regarding the reimbursement we had previoiusly discussed and they told me they had received a fax from Truma informing them the regulators are not at fault, it is contamination causing the problem and therefore they will not be replacing old regulators free of charge that have failed. However, fortunately for me my dealers, Lowe & Rhodes in Stoke-on-Trent, have kindly agreed to honour the reimbursement as arranged.
I have a 2006 Avondale using butane and have had no trouble with the regulator, but I am on my third Gaslow Change over valve. The first two gummed up with a black residue.
They were mounted on the regulator at the top of the gas locker above the gas cylinder.
They were mounted on the regulator at the top of the gas locker above the gas cylinder.
Hello Vernon,
If you are on your third regulator with the previous two failing with the same condition, them it strongly suggests that the regulator is not at fault, but something else, most likely the flexible neoprene hoses.
The gas system is demonstrably not fit for purpose, and under consumer regulations, the supplier is responsible to ensure it is repaired or repalced. A re-occurance of the the difficulty clearly shows the dealer has failed to resolve the problem. I would be concerned that if the regulator has been invaded by this black residue then it may have spread beyond and contaminated the copper pipework and some of the appliances.
You do have rights under consumer law, and you should seek proffesional advice, but I think you could insist that tyour supplier (not the manufacturer) should replace the affected parts of the gas system.
see:-
http://www.dti.gov.uk/consumers/fact-sheets/page24702.html
If you are on your third regulator with the previous two failing with the same condition, them it strongly suggests that the regulator is not at fault, but something else, most likely the flexible neoprene hoses.
The gas system is demonstrably not fit for purpose, and under consumer regulations, the supplier is responsible to ensure it is repaired or repalced. A re-occurance of the the difficulty clearly shows the dealer has failed to resolve the problem. I would be concerned that if the regulator has been invaded by this black residue then it may have spread beyond and contaminated the copper pipework and some of the appliances.
You do have rights under consumer law, and you should seek proffesional advice, but I think you could insist that tyour supplier (not the manufacturer) should replace the affected parts of the gas system.
see:-
http://www.dti.gov.uk/consumers/fact-sheets/page24702.html
http://www.dti.gov.uk/consumers/fact-sheets/page24702.html[/quote
John,
The regulator has not given any problems, it is the Gaslow valve that has stuck due to the black residue.
The system has worked fine with Gaslow removed, so the regulator is OK.
The Gaslow valve is not part of the original equipment, neither are the hoses. New caravans are not supplied with flexible hoses, so the Manufacturer or Supplier are not responsible. It is Calor's responsibilty to solve the problem, and they don't appear to be doing much about it.
I doubt if the new elbow will achieve anything, as my regulator and Gaslow are already mounted above the cylinder where the elbow will be.
http://www.dti.gov.uk/consumers/fact-sheets/page24702.html[/quote
Hello Vernon,
Sorry I went of on the wrong tack, having re-read your submissions, it is a tricky one.
The legal aspect does not change, who ever has supplied the faulty part is still responsible under the quoted act.
What is not clear is what is actually happening to cause the residue. from the actions you have taken it would apper that the residue is local to the Gaslow valve, which suggests its something in the valve. But to counter that Gaslow have been manufacturing valves and devices for LPG product for a long time, so they should be fully aware of the necesity to use petrolium resistant products that dont degrade in the presence of LPG.
The next suspect is the pipework, andy flexible elements must of course be LPG compliant (Neoprene or Nitrile based. If the flexi pipe work does not comply with BS.
I cannot offer any advice on how to sting either Gaslow or the supplies of any other element of your systm into action, perhaps a call to Trading Standrds may offer some light.
The problem seems to be that propane is taking out binders from the pipe and they're running down into the regulators. Soemoen suggested the elbow joint but in Camping Club magazine I saw the recommndation that the regulator input should be higher than the bottle outlet. This means that the gunge drains into teh bottle not the regualtor.
The angle / position of fitment seems to have a major influence. Apparently Avondale fit the regulator at a different angle to other manufacturers and get virtually no problems
Hello Chris,
I would be very surprised if the 'binders' are being dissolved unless either the wrong grade of pipe is being used or there is a new constituant in the gas.
If either is the case then that is worrying. I have to say that on balance I believe it is more liekely to be incorrect or lower grade pipes, as the gas manufacturing process is a chemical reaction which should be very predictable.
Unfortunately I no longer have access to the necessary diagnostic gear or reports to be able to pursue this.
I would be very surprised if the 'binders' are being dissolved unless either the wrong grade of pipe is being used or there is a new constituant in the gas.
If either is the case then that is worrying. I have to say that on balance I believe it is more liekely to be incorrect or lower grade pipes, as the gas manufacturing process is a chemical reaction which should be very predictable.
Unfortunately I no longer have access to the necessary diagnostic gear or reports to be able to pursue this.
Hi,
Just from my background in petrochemicals, the black liquid that people report blocking the regulator is probably dissolved material (plasticisers) from the flexible hose.
To my knowledge, no Eriba owner has had an issue - these have the regulator mounted high up on the locker wall and most (all?) Eriba owners use the smaller 4.5 kg Butane / Propane sized bottles or smaller BP Light Gas bottles. So there is an up-slope from the bottle head to the regulator.
The problem does seem to be common where the regulator is below the top of the gas bottle, and the hose runs down to the bottle - allowing leached materials to run down into the regulator.
Changing the angle of the hose input / regulator mounting angle could well help to eradicate the problem.
As could the use of a higher grade flexible tubing - or tubing that doesn't need plasticisers to stay flexible.
Robert
Just from my background in petrochemicals, the black liquid that people report blocking the regulator is probably dissolved material (plasticisers) from the flexible hose.
To my knowledge, no Eriba owner has had an issue - these have the regulator mounted high up on the locker wall and most (all?) Eriba owners use the smaller 4.5 kg Butane / Propane sized bottles or smaller BP Light Gas bottles. So there is an up-slope from the bottle head to the regulator.
The problem does seem to be common where the regulator is below the top of the gas bottle, and the hose runs down to the bottle - allowing leached materials to run down into the regulator.
Changing the angle of the hose input / regulator mounting angle could well help to eradicate the problem.
As could the use of a higher grade flexible tubing - or tubing that doesn't need plasticisers to stay flexible.
Robert
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