Post Brexit Driving

[Scorpy]

I have read recently on a number of sites (inc RAC) that post Brexit a UK driving licence will no longer be valid on it's own and more than likely UK drivers will have to have IDP as well to tour in Europe. To this end the government are setting up a facillity in about 70,000 post offices from January 2019. To make sure I am covered (given I'll be in Spain on 31/03/2019) I have already applied for mine-for £8.50 it gives me peace of mind. However, on discussing this with a friend who is also applying now for one, we suddenly thought-what about the GB stickers.
At present in EU if you have a standard plate with Country of origin ie GB on the blue LH side it is accepted in Europe-what happens after Brexit? As this will no longer be a European plate, do we have to go back to a large GB sticker on the Car & Van and fit new plates all round?
Trivial I know but if it gives Johnny Foreigners Police another reason to stop & fine us for some contravention or other it would be interesting to know the law situation!

Mike

 

[PaulT]

I would hope that common sense would prevail but it doesn't just apply to "Johnie Foreigners" police. My cars have an "F" on the plate (being French registered) - am I going to be stopped in the UK?

 

[otherclive]

No big deal getting an IDL I got my first one st 17 years to drive my dads Singer Gazelle to Switzerland a couple of weeks after passing my test. Even border crossing checks were cursory except for return to U.K. where the car had to be emptied and mecand my fiancé (now wife) we’re searched too.
Regarding number plates with GBand the Euro stars just duct tape over them and use the sticker type GB plate as I do anyway in the van. Life will go on but it may be a bit less smooth.

 

[otherclive]

I would hope that common sense would prevail but it doesn't just apply to "Johnie Foreigners" police. My cars have an "F" on the plate (being French registered) - am I going to be stopped in the UK?

Why should you be stopped if your car is legal in France? Before we joined the EEC now EU foreign registered cars came to Britain and once through Customs they drove around without any problems. My German relatives came to UK to visit the British branch of the family. By land this time

 

[Lutz]

I have read recently on a number of sites (inc RAC) that post Brexit a UK driving licence will no longer be valid on it's own and more than likely UK drivers will have to have IDP as well to tour in Europe. To this end the government are setting up a facillity in about 70,000 post offices from January 2019. To make sure I am covered (given I'll be in Spain on 31/03/2019) I have already applied for mine-for £8.50 it gives me peace of mind. However, on discussing this with a friend who is also applying now for one, we suddenly thought-what about the GB stickers.
At present in EU if you have a standard plate with Country of origin ie GB on the blue LH side it is accepted in Europe-what happens after Brexit? As this will no longer be a European plate, do we have to go back to a large GB sticker on the Car & Van and fit new plates all round?
Trivial I know but if it gives Johnny Foreigners Police another reason to stop & fine us for some contravention or other it would be interesting to know the law situation!

Mike

Do you honestly think that legislation concerning number plate design will be changed in time for the actual Brexit taking place? I am convinced that not only that but also many other less significant laws will take years to be amended accordingly. A lot of EU requirements will remain effective in UK legislation until well after 30 March simply because the legislators have so much on their hands that they simply won't get round to completing the job in time. One can't just declare legislation based on EU directives invalid after Brexit date without saying what they will be replaced with.

 

[Craigyoung]

When the time comes about looking into getting additional information for my licence I will get it ; as for sticking a big GB sticker on the back of my van - no chance , luckily when I re-done all my reg plates I got "Great Britain" ( with our flag ) put on to the left hand side instead of the EU symbol !! Phew !!

 

[Lutz]

When the time comes about looking into getting additional information for my licence I will get it ; as for sticking a big GB sticker on the back of my van - no chance , luckily when I re-done all my reg plates I got "Great Britain" ( with our flag ) put on to the left hand side instead of the EU symbol !! Phew !!

Euro style number plates but with the Union Flag replacing the 12 stars are already illegal outside the UK without an additional GB sticker so nothing changes there.

 

[PaulT]

I would hope that common sense would prevail but it doesn't just apply to "Johnie Foreigners" police. My cars have an "F" on the plate (being French registered) - am I going to be stopped in the UK?

Why should you be stopped if your car is legal in France? Before we joined the EEC now EU foreign registered cars came to Britain and once through Customs they drove around without any problems. My German relatives came to UK to visit the British branch of the family. By land this time

By the same token, why should UK drivers think that they will be stopped if they come to Europe? The authorities have far more to worry about. I think there is a lot of scaremongering concerning minor issues surrounding Brexit.

 

[Craigyoung]

....Euro style number plates but with the Union Flag replacing the 12 stars are already illegal outside the UK without an additional GB sticker so nothing changes there......

Never been stopped for it and I'm not the only one that doesn't have GB stickers on , plenty others dont have them . I chose to get the ID on the plates to save me clagging the sticker on the car or the caravan !
I've got it on 3 plates , the GB plus the flag !!

 

[Dodger524]

Our "government" has already enacted legislation to adopt all EU regulations into UK law should we ever leave the EU.

 

[Lutz]

Never been stopped for it and I'm not the only one that doesn't have GB stickers on , plenty others dont have them . I chose to get the ID on the plates to save me clagging the sticker on the car or the caravan !
I've got it on 3 plates , the GB plus the flag !!

OK, then you have been lucky so far, but you'd have no recourse if a foreign police officer decides to get nit-picky

Our "government" has already enacted legislation to adopt all EU regulations into UK law should we ever leave the EU.

They already have in many cases concerning vehicle type approval.

 

[otherclive]

I have read recently on a number of sites (inc RAC) that post Brexit a UK driving licence will no longer be valid on it's own and more than likely UK drivers will have to have IDP as well to tour in Europe. To this end the government are setting up a facillity in about 70,000 post offices from January 2019. To make sure I am covered (given I'll be in Spain on 31/03/2019) I have already applied for mine-for £8.50 it gives me peace of mind. However, on discussing this with a friend who is also applying now for one, we suddenly thought-what about the GB stickers.
At present in EU if you have a standard plate with Country of origin ie GB on the blue LH side it is accepted in Europe-what happens after Brexit? As this will no longer be a European plate, do we have to go back to a large GB sticker on the Car & Van and fit new plates all round?
Trivial I know but if it gives Johnny Foreigners Police another reason to stop & fine us for some contravention or other it would be interesting to know the law situation!

Mike

Do you honestly think that legislation concerning number plate design will be changed in time for the actual Brexit taking place? I am convinced that not only that but also many other less significant laws will take years to be amended accordingly. A lot of EU requirements will remain effective in UK legislation until well after 30 March simply because the legislators have so much on their hands that they simply won't get round to completing the job in time. One can't just declare legislation based on EU directives invalid after Brexit date without saying what they will be replaced with.

In fact the legislation has already gone through Parliament to embody existing laws into post Brexit law effective from day 1. So you are correct that the Great Repeal Bill will take years to work through and many laws are eminently useful that they won’t be changed or repealed other than when future amendments may be needed.

 

[otherclive]

....Euro style number plates but with the Union Flag replacing the 12 stars are already illegal outside the UK without an additional GB sticker so nothing changes there......

Never been stopped for it and I'm not the only one that doesn't have GB stickers on , plenty others dont have them . I chose to get the ID on the plates to save me clagging the sticker on the car or the caravan !
I've got it on 3 plates , the GB plus the flag !!

You don’t need GB stickers if your car and van comply with the number plate rules as excercised throughout the EU. Don’t bank on such tolerance in future. Where the law is concerned compliance is the best option.

 

[Craigyoung]

....Euro style number plates but with the Union Flag replacing the 12 stars are already illegal outside the UK without an additional GB sticker so nothing changes there......

Never been stopped for it and I'm not the only one that doesn't have GB stickers on , plenty others dont have them . I chose to get the ID on the plates to save me clagging the sticker on the car or the caravan !
I've got it on 3 plates , the GB plus the flag !!

You don’t need GB stickers if your car and van comply with the number plate rules as excercised throughout the EU. Don’t bank on such tolerance in future. Where the law is concerned compliance is the best option.

Thanks .... of which they do , they are of legal font legal height and comply with the British trademark sign in the bottom corner.
The first time we went to France a few years ago I made a bit of a boo boo when I put my plates on , I ordered the wrong size and I got motorbike plates yet I still didn't get pulled for them !

 

[ProfJohnL]

I think the question needed to be asked, but do bear in mind that no one that I am aware on the forum has the inside track on what is actually going to happen,

It seems to be a reasonable assumption that nothing precipitous is likely to happen, but we are in the hands of our politicians and of course Brussels, and if things become more acrimonious who knows what sanctions might be put up.

What is beyond reasonable doubt, is that despite the view that EU has eroded British sovereignty and control of our laws and regulations, much of the EU's legislation has advanced many areas of our laws for the better, and even if we had not been part of the EU, we would have probably progressed along very similar lines independently. I'm not saying that's universally true for all laws.

Commercially, lets just consider car manufacture in the UK. If we had not been part of the EU, the EU would still have been a very significant market for us to sell into, and consequently we would have had no choice but to comply with the EU's regulations for motor cars, so we WOULD still be and WILL be tied to those same regulations, and the same principle will apply to any commercial products we trade with EU.

So overall its unlikely that a lot will change concerning what we can and can't actually do but its almost certain that more red tape will arise.

 

[otherclive]

....Euro style number plates but with the Union Flag replacing the 12 stars are already illegal outside the UK without an additional GB sticker so nothing changes there......

Never been stopped for it and I'm not the only one that doesn't have GB stickers on , plenty others dont have them . I chose to get the ID on the plates to save me clagging the sticker on the car or the caravan !
I've got it on 3 plates , the GB plus the flag !!

You don’t need GB stickers if your car and van comply with the number plate rules as excercised throughout the EU. Don’t bank on such tolerance in future. Where the law is concerned compliance is the best option.

Thanks .... of which they do , they are of legal font legal height and comply with the British trademark sign in the bottom corner.
The first time we went to France a few years ago I made a bit of a boo boo when I put my plates on , I ordered the wrong size and I got motorbike plates yet I still didn't get pulled for them !

Sorry Craig
But a number plate with GB and the Union Flag is not legal in EU countries. The fact that you’ve not been pulled is pure good luck. Don’t bank on it in the future. French police can be picky look at their recent purge on U.K. cars without beam benders and which cannot adjust headlights either.

 

[otherclive]

I think the question needed to be asked, but do bear in mind that no one that I am aware on the forum has the inside track on what is actually going to happen,

It seems to be a reasonable assumption that nothing precipitous is likely to happen, but we are in the hands of our politicians and of course Brussels, and if things become more acrimonious who knows what sanctions might be put up.

What is beyond reasonable doubt, is that despite the view that EU has eroded British sovereignty and control of our laws and regulations, much of the EU's legislation has advanced many areas of our laws for the better, and even if we had not been part of the EU, we would have probably progressed along very similar lines independently. I'm not saying that's universally true for all laws.

Commercially, lets just consider car manufacture in the UK. If we had not been part of the EU, the EU would still have been a very significant market for us to sell into, and consequently we would have had no choice but to comply with the EU's regulations for motor cars, so we WOULD still be and WILL be tied to those same regulations, and the same principle will apply to any commercial products we trade with EU.

So overall its unlikely that a lot will change concerning what we can and can't actually do but its almost certain that more red tape will arise.

Prof
Bang on. We sell cars and other items to countries other than the EU and have to align with their standards. Business is well versed in aligning with other standards and regulations but the benefit of greater globalisation is that costs come down as harmonisation increases.

 

[Big S]

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/driving-in-the-eu-if-theres-no-brexit-deal/driving-in-the-eu-if-theres-no-brexit-deal
The Government has recently issued a series of guidance notes in preparation for a no deal exit from the EU.
The above link for in respect of driving licences after 31st march 2019. There hasn't been a guidance note issued yet in respect of number plates.
However given the information on the link to the current guidance below, it is safe to say that the European Union flag will no longer be valid for the UK then attaching a GB sticker to the back of a car and trailer would be a wise move.
https://www.gov.uk/displaying-number-plates/flags-symbols-and-identifiers

 

[Thingy]

And this shows what Europe is all about

There are 2 types of IDP required by EU countries. Each is governed by a separate United Nations convention.

One type is governed by the 1949 Geneva Convention on Road Traffic.

The other type is governed by the 1968 Vienna Convention on Road Traffic.

The version of the IDP you would require depends on which EU country you are visiting and whether it is party to the 1949 or the 1968 convention.

Who was it said they couldnt agree on the colour of you know what.

 

[otherclive]

And this shows what Europe is all about

There are 2 types of IDP required by EU countries. Each is governed by a separate United Nations convention.

One type is governed by the 1949 Geneva Convention on Road Traffic.

The other type is governed by the 1968 Vienna Convention on Road Traffic.

The version of the IDP you would require depends on which EU country you are visiting and whether it is party to the 1949 or the 1968 convention.

Who was it said they couldnt agree on the colour of you know what.

Ireland, Spain, Malta and Cyprus retain the 1949 convention, all other EU countries plus Switzerland and Norway are signed up to the later one. Guess the first four never got round to changing as it only affects non EU drivers who go there.

 

[Lutz]

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/driving-in-the-eu-if-theres-no-brexit-deal/driving-in-the-eu-if-theres-no-brexit-deal

The Government has recently issued a series of guidance notes in preparation for a no deal exit from the EU.
The above link for in respect of driving licences after 31st march 2019. There hasn't been a guidance note issued yet in respect of number plates.
However given the information on the link to the current guidance below, it is safe to say that the European Union flag will no longer be valid for the UK then attaching a GB sticker to the back of a car and trailer would be a wise move.
https://www.gov.uk/displaying-number-plates/flags-symbols-and-identifiers

The law regarding the deletion of the optional Euro symbol would have to be passed before it can become invalid and that may take quite some time as there are more important issues to be resolved first. Until such time, the Euro symbol will remain valid even after Brexit.

 

[Buckman]

When the time comes about looking into getting additional information for my licence I will get it ; as for sticking a big GB sticker on the back of my van - no chance , luckily when I re-done all my reg plates I got "Great Britain" ( with our flag ) put on to the left hand side instead of the EU symbol !! Phew !!

Euro style number plates but with the Union Flag replacing the 12 stars are already illegal outside the UK without an additional GB sticker so nothing changes there.

How can it be illegal when it is legal in the home country. Our plates have the UK and the Union Flag on the left hand side and never been stopped.

 

[Lutz]

How can it be illegal when it is legal in the home country. Our plates have the UK and the Union Flag on the left hand side and never been stopped.

You ask how it can be illegal? It's because UK legislation only makes a Euro style plate with anything other than the circle of stars legal within the United Kingdom, but not outside.

 

[Buckman]

How can it be illegal when it is legal in the home country. Our plates have the UK and the Union Flag on the left hand side and never been stopped.

You ask how it can be illegal? It's because UK legislation only makes a Euro style plate with anything other than the circle of stars legal within the United Kingdom, but not outside.

We have seen loads of cars with either England, Wales or Scottish flag on left hand side of number plate while in France and Spain. No stars of course. Like us these vehicles had a GB sticker. Bobbies there did not take any notice of the different type of number plate.

 

[Grey13]

Question for the boffs.....I read somewhere that there will be a shortage of sandwiches after Brexit and I also that our planes will not fly over EU soil...? All this talk about number-plates but will our cars still work as we cross the channel? :huh: