Smart battery charger connection options

[empee]

I keep our Pageant 7 in the driveway so am able to leave power connected.

I'd like to hook up a smart charger to keep the battery topped up but there's no room in the battery box for the charger (113 Amp battery) and limited access for battery terminal clips too. In addition external connection would require an additional power outlet for the charger so inside the van out of the weather appears a better option but what would be the best place to connect it to? Showing my ignorance here - could I just plug it into one of the 12v outlets in the van maybe?

Martin

 

[JTQ]

You need to know more about the controller in this modern van before making decisions.

First it could already feature a "smart" charger, obviating the need for a separate charger.

Secondly it could contain a voltage regulator to limit the "load" system voltage to the order of 13 v whilst at the same time charging the battery at up to 14.4 required to properly charge the battery. If it is then it would be unwise to charge via a "12v" outlet because these are not coupled directly back to the battery.

If it's a basic unit system simply coupling the load directly to the battery then it could safely be charged via a 12v outlet.

Whatever type of unit it would be wiser to couple directly to the battery; are there not "mover" feeds you could access for example as these will be direct?

 

[empee]

Thanks JTQ

I suppose I'll need to talk to Bailey re the existing charger, it says in the manual that it should not be left on permanently though so I suspect it is not 'smart'

There is a mover - newly fitted Powrtouch but such a mass of wires under the wardrobe floor for it I'd want further advice before venturing there!

I'll talk to Bailey and Powrtouch then.

Thanks again

Martin

 

[JTQ]

Martin,

As Bailey say "it should NOT be left on permanently", then I agree with you its not a chance of being a smart charger; if it was they would encourage leaving it connected.

That being the case then charging via a 12 volt socket would be fine; provided the vans charger is not ON at the same time.

I would recommend getting a quality smart charger like the CTEK 3600 [not one of its cheap look alike clones]. This is only a three stage unit but at its price point regarded as the best available. Whilst this is sold for up to 100Ah batteries unless you really flatten your 113 Ah battery it will be completely satisfactory for that, just a tad slower as its only outputting 3.6 amps.

 

[xtrailman]

Martin

I don't understand why you feel the need to have the battery on charge permanently?

If its because you have a mover, then again, i see no need.

I only top my battery up via the on board charger, and in 5 years have had no issues.

The battery is only a cheap 110AH, but has always kept its charge. All i do is put the power on a couple og days or day before we go on holiday, charge the battery, and cool the fridge.

Smart or not, were is the logic of leaving an electrical device on?. It still consumes power, even in standby mode.

 

[empee]

Hi Ray

As I understand it a battery will naturally discharge over time, and it is not good to leave a battery for too long in a discharged state.

I believe the chargers normally fitted in caravans are designed to provide a 12v supply for the 12v systems in the van, as well as supply the charge for the battery and as such do not charge a battery all the way up to the required 13.5v (?) A 'smart' charger will monitor the state of charge and adjust the charge rate accordingly to bring the battery up to, and then maintain the battery in a fully charged state, reducing the charge rate to a trickle as the full charge is achieved. The caravan charger has no facility to adjust the charge rate and will just keep charging at the same rate - which would be bad for the battery once it is fully charged.

(As I say this is my understanding - I'm no expert so everyone feel free to jump in and put me in my place!!!)

I could just allow the battery to discharge and then every month or so switch the caravan charger on for the day to top it up again but this would not bring the battery back up to full charge for the reasons above. With the van away in storage I'd have to bring the battery home and do this in the garage but with the van in the drive it would be nice to just hook up the charger inside the van - much easier than disconnecting the battery and removing it - as it's a gel there's no need to do anything with it really (maybe check the terminals occasionally perhaps)

You've guessed it - I'm just lazy!

Martin

 

[JTQ]

Martin that's my understanding as well.

The basic charger will not fully charge the battery; it's likely to peak at 13.8 volts, the bulk charge limit not the required finishing charge of 14.4 or even as high as 15.5 depending on construction.

Thus those with basic chargers who only use the van's charger will not fully charge the battery, probably they only get about 80/85%.

Therefore a 110 Ah battery is the equivalent of a 88/93Ah one properly charged.

As it's never fully charged its life will not be as good as if it was fully charged because in this state it starts to sulphate. On top of that it will naturally decay, further adding to the life limiting issues.

This is a compounding thing, the part charging, the time left partly discharged and the related sulphating leading to a loss of the ability to take and hold charge. So the once 110 Ah battery become a much lesser capable unit.

You're better off charging with a sophisticated quality multi phase charger.

The better charger permits you to remain on continuous EHU, optimising the holding capacity and condition of your battery second to second, not month to month and in a part charged state. Be careful not to skimp by buying a budget charger; the good ones are not cheap.

Whilst it might not be "green" to use a few Watts on powering the smart charger, it must be better for the environment that mistreating 110 Ah lead acid batteries.

 

[JohnWelch]

We have a 2008 Bailey Senator S6 Louisiana and whilst the handbook says

"do not continuously charge the battery when caravan is not in use" it also says " The charger is capable of charging leisure batteries and will not overcharge"!

It has now got me a bit confused as to the correct way to proced as to be honest we have had the mains connected and charger on whilst it is stored in our driveway due to the handbook stating as noted above that the charger will not overcharge.

Which way forward I wonder.

John

 

[JTQ]

We have a 2008 Bailey Senator S6 Louisiana and whilst the handbook says

"do not continuously charge the battery when caravan is not in use" it also says " The charger is capable of charging leisure batteries and will not overcharge"!

It has now got me a bit confused as to the correct way to proced as to be honest we have had the mains connected and charger on whilst it is stored in our driveway due to the handbook stating as noted above that the charger will not overcharge.

Which way forward I wonder.

John

John

I don't know the details of your charger which is needed to give you the answer to your puzzle.

The wording "do not continuously charge" implies to me a basic charger as stating that would not be the case with a sophisticated charger. And "capable of charging" does not imply to me optimum charging. With your situation I would definitely not be leaving it connected for more than 12 hours at a time.

A safe option, good for the battery and a technique ensuring you really do have a full charge would be to not to use your inbuilt charger but use a separate good quality smart charger left on continuously. That is what I used to do when I had a van with a basic charger. However its going to cost you

 

[JohnWelch]

John

I don't know the details of your charger which is needed to give you the answer to your puzzle.

The wording "do not continuously charge" implies to me a basic charger as stating that would not be the case with a sophisticated charger. And "capable of charging" does not imply to me optimum charging. With your situation I would definitely not be leaving it connected for more than 12 hours at a time.

A safe option, good for the battery and a technique ensuring you really do have a full charge would be to not to use your inbuilt charger but use a separate good quality smart charger left on continuously. That is what I used to do when I had a van with a basic charger. However its going to cost you

 

[JohnWelch]

John(JTQ)

Thanks for your comments to my post and sorry for the delay in responding. I have looked at the charger in my S6 Senator and whilst there is no name on it it does say the DC output is 13.8v 24 amps.

Here in New Zealand I can purchase a CTEK XS3600 for approx 78 GBP and am quite willing to do so but before doing so I have a few questions which I hope you can answer.

My battery is an Exide 105a/h so will this charger be man enough for the job?

Is it as simple as;

1. Disconnecting the power to the onboard charger and unplugging the 12v 2 way connector from the charger into the vans wiring

2. Connecting the CTEK charge leads direct to the battery terminals and switching it on. (Bit worried about what I would be losing by not having power to the 12v 2 way connector)

Or would it be simpler to use the inbuilt van charger when we are using the van but when at home with van on the drive, switch off the vans charger and connect the CTEK to the battery terminals and switch it on for the duration it is on my drive. If this is the prefered way would there be any problem with me not physically disconnecting the wiring from the onboard charger but just relying on switching it off.

Sorry to be so long winded but hope you can advise/help on this issue.

Thanks

John

 

[xtrailman]

Martin

I keep my caravan in the rear courtyard of my property.

It is connected permanently to the mains, if i so wish.

That i don't consider sensible, or necessary.

While i agree 13.8v will not fully charge a battery, it will keep a battery healthy, and more importantly allow the charger to be on charge permanently for a duration while on holiday. Without gassing the battery.

Further i have never hloose the water content, the reason why you have to top up with deionised water.

Fit the smart charger if it makes you feel happy, but i wouldn't advise leaving any electric device left switched on unattended.

ad a battery discharge, one month will not discharge a battery to a unsafe level, unless you have loaded it, charge and discharge is what keeps the battery plates clean.

And as i have already stated my battery is 5 years old, and still doing the job i bought it for.

Don't forget the battery is charged at 14.5v while towing, via the car.So it does see a full charge from time to time.

Theory is all well and good, but i have since 1997, used a charger with a 13.8v output, and never had a battery problem.

Caravan manufactures' didn't always have these chargers with reduced outputs, they were introduced after batteries were found to have boiled dry. If you charge above 13.8v the battery starts to "bubble" and

 

[xtrailman]

Sorry chopped of the message end.

You will lose the water content from the battery, hence the necessary to top up with deionised water.

 

[valeter]

Hi Martin;I took my battery of the caravan all winter put it in the garage and connected it to a CTEK 3600 for 6 months,put it back on caravan last weekend works great fully charged;