Speeding

[FrintonMike]

I followed 3 caravans out of town this morning with o problems on the A133 but as soon as we reached the A12 dual carriageway two vans took off like bats out of hell. I was driving solo but even at 70mph they were still losing me. One was bouncing all over the road.
I do not like extra regulations but is it not time to make a towing course compulsory even if there is no test at the end
On the way home we passed over 25 vans leaving town in a distance of 5 miles, many more than usual.

 

[Hutch]

Maybe a rally of some sort.
With the latest newcomers to caravanning, maybe many do not realise the speed restrictions, just as a lot of White Van drivers are not aware of different speed restrictions for them, ie 60 mph on dual carriageways.

 

[otherclive]

I followed 3 caravans out of town this morning with o problems on the A133 but as soon as we reached the A12 dual carriageway two vans took off like bats out of hell. I was driving solo but even at 70mph they were still losing me. One was bouncing all over the road.
I do not like extra regulations but is it not time to make a towing course compulsory even if there is no test at the end
On the way home we passed over 25 vans leaving town in a distance of 5 miles, many more than usual.

Presumably the drivers had all taken a driving test so why suggest another one if only a course. When would they be required to attend or interact on IT. Would it cover trailers or motorhomes all of which are subjected to varying speed limits compared to solo vehicles. It could be included within the online element of the driving test just in case the driver doesn’t plan on getting a full BE licence.

Speeding is endemic even in solo cars so another test/ course isn’t just related to caravans. What could be a solution would be more cameras or traffic police followed by an “ invite” to a Speed Awareness Course.

 

[Parksy]

I usually tow at between 55 - 60 mph on motorways if road and traffic conditions permit, and I was being passed by cars, often large German saloon cars, towing caravans past me as though I was standing still at times.
I put it down to new caravan buyers who usually fly with their family to warmer places opting for 'staycations' because of C19 restrictions.
They ignore national speed limits, quite apart from the speed restrictions for towing vehicles.
I wonder if they don't know or if they just don't care?

 

[ProfJohnL]

I have a similar concern about driver actually not having the correct licence entitlement's to tow many outfits we see on the roads.

Those who were 17 in 1997 will now be 43 and of an age where families, ego's or job status require them to have a large flashy car, and their parents who may not have realised the entitlements have changed or may not understand how they work will tell then yes just hitch up and go.

 

[JezzerB]

I am not sure what another test will do. Thousands of none caravan owners speed and adding a caravan makes no difference to them test or no they speed. Need police on the roads.

 

[Buckman]

I followed 3 caravans out of town this morning with o problems on the A133 but as soon as we reached the A12 dual carriageway two vans took off like bats out of hell. I was driving solo but even at 70mph they were still losing me. One was bouncing all over the road.
I do not like extra regulations but is it not time to make a towing course compulsory even if there is no test at the end
On the way home we passed over 25 vans leaving town in a distance of 5 miles, many more than usual.

I would be interested to know how a towing course will prevent speeding with a caravan or overloading of the caravan? What we really need is more traffic police who ae not scared of pulling over errant motorists. After all it is the responsibility of the motorists to ensure theya re aware of the various laws.

 

[littlebasher]

What some people need is a 'co-pilot' like i have.

I get audible notifications whenever i approach the speed limit, very little chance that i dare exceed it.

 

[RogerL]

It seems noticeable that caravanners are far more concerned about others towing above their speed limit than drivers in general are concerned about car/.van drivers exceeding the overall speed limits - this isn't new, it's something that has occurred from time to time on caravan forums and club magazine Letters pages.

The ACPO guidelines of 10% +1mph are generally regarded as socially acceptable - by the same measure, caravans on motorways and dual carriageways at 67 mph GPS or say 70 mph speedo should be expected as normal - such speeds aren't illegal in France so can't be unsafe

 

[otherclive]

It seems noticeable that caravanners are far more concerned about others towing above their speed limit than drivers in general are concerned about car/.van drivers exceeding the overall speed limits - this isn't new, it's something that has occurred from time to time on caravan forums and club magazine Letters pages.

The ACPO guidelines of 10% +1mph are generally regarded as socially acceptable - by the same measure, caravans on motorways and dual carriageways at 67 mph GPS or say 70 mph speedo should be expected as normal - such speeds aren't illegal in France so can't be unsafe

Doesn’t the speed limit in France depend on your outfit weight as plated irrespective of actual on the road weight? Also the French don’t seem so tolerant of speed limit + 10% +1mph ( or Kmh). I think that advocating a speed range going up to 67 mph isn’t very responsible as new caravanners might want to go that high and find themselves in trouble.

Outfits in France over 3500kg the limit is 56 mph on autoroutes, less on other roads.

 

[JezzerB]

I agree, GPS speed is generally quicker due speedo over read etc so they may not have been too much over. Doesn't bother me any more than a speeding car. I just think they may be risking their licence. Those we see speeding past wobbling usually get the message and slow down.

 

[Dustydog]

Supporters of this Forum know only too well the perils of poor loading, caravan behaviour at speed. Sadly many newcomers probably have no idea at all about towing never mind the legal aspect mentioned by the Prof. Have subscriptions to the Clubs and PCv increased over the last year? I doubt it .That probably shows how ignorant a lot of people may be of the perils and science of towing.

 

[otherclive]

If I see a fast moving outfit coming up behind me I tend to move to the left of lane 1 and ease off to facilitate the rush to eternity.

 

[Buckman]

If I see a fast moving outfit coming up behind me I tend to move to the left of lane 1 and ease off to facilitate the rush to eternity.

Yesterday on M5 doing GPS 58mph got overtaken by car towing single axle like we were standing still. The combination must have been exceeding 70mph with family on board.

The ACPO guidelines of 10% +1mph are generally regarded as socially acceptable - by the same measure, caravans on motorways and dual carriageways at 67 mph GPS or say 70 mph speedo should be expected as normal - such speeds aren't illegal in France so can't be unsafe

Not true as we are limited to 90kph.

 

[Thingy]

Im sure that "not knowing" will be the excuse of many of them if and when they get stopped. But it is no defence. If you are in charge of a vehicle, it is your responsibility to load it properly, know the law as it applies to your vehicle and of course drive it accordingly. In the transport world, the driver is responsible for his load, although 99 times out of a 100 he didnt load it himself. It has to be the same for all of us. Sorry I didnt know is NOT an acceptable defence.

It beggars belief, even on this forum the number of people that have bought a caravan with an unsuitable tow vehicle or the wrong licence.

If these people havent been towing a caravan long enough to know the law, it defies sanity to be towing at 70mph.

As FM says, one of them was bouncing all over the road too. I wonder if his village knows its idiot is missing.

 

[otherclive]

As an addition the last thing I will do is flash a fast moving outfit to come into my Lane. I really don’t need to see an outfit snaking in front of me despite easing off as they come by.

 

[ProfJohnL]

It seems noticeable that caravanners are far more concerned about others towing above their speed limit than drivers in general are concerned about car/.van drivers exceeding the overall speed limits - this isn't new, it's something that has occurred from time to time on caravan forums and club magazine Letters pages.

The ACPO guidelines of 10% +1mph are generally regarded as socially acceptable - by the same measure, caravans on motorways and dual carriageways at 67 mph GPS or say 70 mph speedo should be expected as normal - such speeds aren't illegal in France so can't be unsafe

It is totally irrelevant what happens in other countries, UK road are governed by UK laws.

Regardless of why a speed limit has been set, it is a limit without tolerances. Its not a target its a limit.

ACPO guidelines are not the law, they provide guidelines to the Chiefs of Police to avoid having too many speeding prosecutions fail because of questions concerning the accuracy of measurement equipment, and the processes used when taking measurements. There is absolutely no law that says zero or tighter tolerance to speeding can't be applied. That would only be practical if the authorities have sufficiently accurate measurement systems, and systems are improving all the time.

There are standards for Speedometers in cars which says they can over read but but not under read, so there is no legitimate excuse for a driver to claim their speedo was showing the limit whist traveling faster than the limit.

Drivers should be aware of any derating of limits applicable to the type of vehicle they are driving.

 

[JezzerB]

I am not so sure they don't know-don't care more likely-same way as you see them doing 90 on the mway without a caravan in tow.

 

[RogerL]

It is totally irrelevant what happens in other countries, UK road are governed by UK laws.

Regardless of why a speed limit has been set, it is a limit without tolerances. Its not a target its a limit.

ACPO guidelines are not the law, they provide guidelines to the Chiefs of Police to avoid having too many speeding prosecutions fail because of questions concerning the accuracy of measurement equipment, and the processes used when taking measurements. There is absolutely no law that says zero or tighter tolerance to speeding can't be applied. That would only be practical if the authorities have sufficiently accurate measurement systems, and systems are improving all the time.

There are standards for Speedometers in cars which says they can over read but but not under read, so there is no legitimate excuse for a driver to claim their speedo was showing the limit whist traveling faster than the limit.

Drivers should be aware of any derating of limits applicable to the type of vehicle they are driving.

Such comments apply to all types of vehicles.

I'm not advocating speeding but we know that most drivers do so routinely - I'm just surprised at contributors berating other caravanners for speeding - do the same contributors berate solo car drivers when they (the contributors) aren't towing.

 

[Parksy]

What some people need is a 'co-pilot' like i have.

I get audible notifications whenever i approach the speed limit, very little chance that i dare exceed it.

I have an audible speed warning on my sat nav set to 58mph.
Everybody is likely to exceed 60mph when towing for a very short time span, usually seconds, and the audible warning will continue to sound which renders continuous excess speed uncomfortable

As an addition the last thing I will do is flash a fast moving outfit to come into my Lane. I really don’t need to see an outfit snaking in front of me despite easing off as they come by.

I'm happy to flash the headlights as an indication that it's safe for an overtaking unit, be it lorry, van or towed caravan, to change lanes in front of me, but care must be taken that two drivers in separate lanes don't wrongly interpret the flash as being intended for them, and move accordingly.
Be careful where you flash
😜😜😜
[/QUOTE]

 

[Beachball]

Going down A1 with our outfit we were doing roughly between 55- 60 mph and my wife say here they go two outfits towing twin axle caravan passing us at speed .

 

[Buckman]

Such comments apply to all types of vehicles.

I'm not advocating speeding but we know that most drivers do so routinely - I'm just surprised at contributors berating other caravanners for speeding - do the same contributors berate solo car drivers when they (the contributors) aren't towing.

When a solo car is not towing it is a lot less dangerous than a car towing at speed with a caravan bouncing all over the place!

 

[Beachball]

Generally people follow the rules about speed when pulling a caravan, but there are always exceptions to the rule and these are the ones that stick in your mind...............taking risks with other people on the road, going too fast.

 

[otherclive]

Such comments apply to all types of vehicles.

I'm not advocating speeding but we know that most drivers do so routinely - I'm just surprised at contributors berating other caravanners for speeding - do the same contributors berate solo car drivers when they (the contributors) aren't towing.

A car speeding is less likely to become unstable as it most likely has various stability aids plus it doesn’t have the best part of 1.2-2.0 tonnes pivoting about its rear with loading unknown.

 

[Jcloughie]

I do not like extra regulations but is it not time to make a towing course compulsory even if there is no test at the end

Although others have disagreed with this idea I am with you on this one. If education and courses are not necessary why not do away with the driving test!

Of course it is alway the responsibility of the driver and rightly so. But as others have already said. People are (we think). Going around in unsuitable outfits with possibly incorrect documentation. Let’s not just pass the responsibility onto them through the ether. Legislate for an authorised course and we will all be safer for it.

John