Just bought a swift major 6 TD and found that when the water pump stops the interior lights flash once, the dealer has told me that is common now days and that it happens on most caravans. Has anyone else experienced this or is the dealer trying to fob me off ??
Swift Major 6 Interior Lights Electrical issue
- Thread starter Maz23
- Start date
Just because I haven't heard of that excuse it doesn't mean a fob off BUT I haven't heard of that happening to anyone I've ever talked to about caravans. Certainly not something we've ever experienced in any of our vans.
Parksy
Moderator
The dealer is trying to fob you off.
Is it the 12v lighting system that flashes? It would appear that there's a fault on the system, this is definitely not a common occurrence and you need to insist that the dealer rectifies the fault.
You have the law on your side, the Consumer Rights Act covers this situation.
I moved your post to the Technical message board to attract further replies
Is it the 12v lighting system that flashes? It would appear that there's a fault on the system, this is definitely not a common occurrence and you need to insist that the dealer rectifies the fault.
You have the law on your side, the Consumer Rights Act covers this situation.
I moved your post to the Technical message board to attract further replies
Thank you for moving it and yes it's the 12v system. He's told me that it's a voltage spike when the pump stops and that it's normal and nothing to worry about.
Parksy
Moderator
You're welcome Maz.
Like Martin, it's the first time that I've heard of this happening but perhaps other forum members will be able to offer technical information or advice.
Like Martin, it's the first time that I've heard of this happening but perhaps other forum members will be able to offer technical information or advice.
I've seen the lights flicker when the pump starts when running on battery only and the battery is getting low.
I'm glad Parksy moved this to the technical forum, as the most likely explanation is a "technical one."
A possible, some would say, probable, technical explanation is:
that maybe someone is speaking with "forked tongue"
When you go back to the dealer (insisting on your rights) you could ask him to demonstrate that a similar effect is present on all the other caravans that they have either in stock or on their premises..... if what is says is true then the majority of them will all present with the same symptoms!
But, be prepared for further technical reasons that is difficult or they are not allowed... etc etc.,
When you had the pre purchase inspection ( by a mobile caravan technician) the fault could have been pointed out to the dealer who would no doubt not tried to fob him ( or her!) off with such a lame excuse.... you did have a pre purchase inspection didn't you???
Unfortunately many folks are happy to spend quite a lot on a caravan but are unwilling to spend a few hundred on a pre purchase inspection; whether it's a brand new caravan or a pre-owned one, a pre purchase inspection is often a wise investment
Hope you get a good result from the dealer... and in the meantime,
Happy Caravanning
paws
A possible, some would say, probable, technical explanation is:
that maybe someone is speaking with "forked tongue"
When you go back to the dealer (insisting on your rights) you could ask him to demonstrate that a similar effect is present on all the other caravans that they have either in stock or on their premises..... if what is says is true then the majority of them will all present with the same symptoms!
But, be prepared for further technical reasons that is difficult or they are not allowed... etc etc.,
When you had the pre purchase inspection ( by a mobile caravan technician) the fault could have been pointed out to the dealer who would no doubt not tried to fob him ( or her!) off with such a lame excuse.... you did have a pre purchase inspection didn't you???
Unfortunately many folks are happy to spend quite a lot on a caravan but are unwilling to spend a few hundred on a pre purchase inspection; whether it's a brand new caravan or a pre-owned one, a pre purchase inspection is often a wise investment
Hope you get a good result from the dealer... and in the meantime,
Happy Caravanning
paws
Maz23 said:
Hello Maz,
Can I clarify exactly what's happening please.
Are you telling us that even if the lights are turned off, they will flash when the pump turns off?
Do you have a battery fitted?
Does this happen if you have the caravan on an electrical hook up?.
Does it happen when only using the battery?
Or do you mean if the lights are on they become brighter for a moment?
Or when the lights are on, do they become brighter and stay brighter when the pump stops?
Answers to these may help us to fully understand and possibly even diagnose the problem.
Hi
Yes the lights will flash once when they are turned off. So with an electric hook up on a campsite, battery still connected, when the water pump reaches pressure and stops the interior lights flash, I haven't noticed anything different with the lights on.
Yes the lights will flash once when they are turned off. So with an electric hook up on a campsite, battery still connected, when the water pump reaches pressure and stops the interior lights flash, I haven't noticed anything different with the lights on.
Maz23 said:
Thank you for the clarification. I have spent a couple of hours considering your problem. Based on your clarification I understand that with the light switches turned off, when the pump stops the lights flash!
That simply should not happen. In electrical terms a light circuit with its switch open simply cannot pass current, as there is no circuit. So in my view there is problem with the 12V installation.
Whilst I cannot be certain, but I do wonder if somehow the aluminium panels of the wall construction are acting as a large capacitor which is charged up when the pump runs, and is discharged through the lighting circuit causing the flash. But that simply should not be possible if the wiring has been installed correctly.
Maz.
In 39 years never happened to me. But on a Castleton I had there was a dull flicker when the pump ran. I put that down to a power drop.
The Prof is technically the Guru.Go with him and indeed Parksy.
Back to the dealer. Good luck.
In 39 years never happened to me. But on a Castleton I had there was a dull flicker when the pump ran. I put that down to a power drop.
The Prof is technically the Guru.Go with him and indeed Parksy.
Back to the dealer. Good luck.
We have a 2017 Sprite Major 4EB which does exactly the same. The LED lights flash when the pump stops even though they are off. Keep us updated if you find a reason.
It happens to our 2017 Lunar Clubman when the water pressure switch starts chattering and then the bathroom ceiling LED goes out and the living room LED won't switch off. I told the dealer and he's quite happy to replace them when |I take the caravan back. . I just haven't done it yet.
Apparently there was a faulty batch of LED ceiling lights.
Apparently there was a faulty batch of LED ceiling lights.
YorkieF said:
Logically it can't be the lights. If a bulb of any sort won't switch off it must mean the switch or wiring is faulty.
I do wonder if it might be something to do with these new all singing and dancing command centres that some manufacturers are fitting. It's begging to sound like a software or system failure. But As I have not looked at how these work and what systems they manage its just a guess.
Hi spoke to another dealer at the weekend and seems to think it's the control system ( swift command ) he thinks it just needs updating so it might be worth looking into it.
Sounds a bit unusual but strange that another owner has similar symptoms. You could try a post on the Swift Talk where owners and maker will submit replies. Also I had found Swift/Sprite to be very good when approached with a problem.
paws said:
Why should a buyer have to spend some hundreds of pounds on a pre acceptance delivery inspection? We don't do it with new cars, although some may do so with second hand cars. But given the buyer's rights under CRA advising people to spend on such inspections defeats the overall aim of the Governments excellent legislation. I have bought a number of caravans both new and used, but never had a pre -inspection. I spend time checking things myself and on some occasions have found some pickups which the Dealer(s) had always rectified, albeit at a later date as pre inspections invariably occur on collection day. When other issue s have arisen and I have found them worth taking up with the Dealer(s) I can't recall ever having any problems with getting them rectified. Of course some things aren't worth the hassle of taking up with the Dealer as half an hour can often get them sorted myself. Overall, perhaps I have been lucky, but I am generally satisfied with the caravans I have owned.
Hello Clive.
I agree with you. A brand new product should not require a pre acceptance inspection, Equally it should not require a pre-delivery inspection which most dealers used to charge for.
I'm not likely to be buying a new caravan now, but if I were I would be challenging the dealer to justify why I should have to pay them to check the product the law says is their responsibility to supply free from defects?
I suspect if it were wide spread across all purchases it would have been outlawed by now in much the same way as PPI
Another suspect charge is the Delivery charge! This is another way that the customer is funding the dealer to what they are in business for. As you do not have possession of the caravan until after its been delivered, why should the customer be paying delivery? Most customers collect their caravan from the dealership, so there are nos delivery expenses.
I agree with you. A brand new product should not require a pre acceptance inspection, Equally it should not require a pre-delivery inspection which most dealers used to charge for.
I'm not likely to be buying a new caravan now, but if I were I would be challenging the dealer to justify why I should have to pay them to check the product the law says is their responsibility to supply free from defects?
I suspect if it were wide spread across all purchases it would have been outlawed by now in much the same way as PPI
Another suspect charge is the Delivery charge! This is another way that the customer is funding the dealer to what they are in business for. As you do not have possession of the caravan until after its been delivered, why should the customer be paying delivery? Most customers collect their caravan from the dealership, so there are nos delivery expenses.
ProfJohnL said:
Interesting points you raise Prof.
When we ordered our heap of crap thrown together pile of common poor quality parts masquerading as a caravan, there was no PDI fee. We did visit the dealer prior to them doing the PDI, where we found incorrect seat backs and a non affixed window blind mounting. Later we suffered a host of faults that are well publicised on the internet forum of the circus and in the dealers records.
There was 'free delivery' as a show offer at the NEC October show; clearly a marketing ploy to make you believe you were getting something for your custom. The 'delivery' charge was for the transportation of the aforementioned heap of crap from the circus to the dealer, despite it going as a part load on a lorry with other units.
As I've mentioned previously, this caravan lark is a cartel with some dodgy practices to say the least. Fortunately as time goes on and [strike]mugs[/strike]customers realise they have been hoodwinked they will publicise the abysmal quality and lack of customer service that abounds in the cartel to make prospective buyers aware. If the first link in the customer experience chain is broken i.e. the assembler to the dealer, dealers are after all the customer of the assembler, what realistic possibility of decent quality product and service is there for the poor mug buying it?
It would be better all round if the caravan industry collectively raised their game and set foot in the 21st century aka the information age.
I have been contributing to this forum for over 12 years I have pointed out a number of dubious traditions and accepted customs and practice. Unfortunately there are still plenty of such things heavily ingrained into manufacturers, dealers and caravanners and they are difficult to dislodge.
I would like to think that my approach has opened more peoples eye to the dangers of relying on traditions etc, especially in light of modern engineering, and the greater depth of information about products that has become available. We have certainly had some interesting debates along the way.
The Consumer Rights Act and the a lesser extend the previous Sale of Goods Act have given consumers a real boost to their rights and confidence, and I am really pleased to read of more people flexing their rights and showing traders that the public is not as gullible as they used to be.
The manufacturer's first line of defence from public contact are there dealers, We are slowly but surely battling them into shape though it will be a long process. No longer can dealers expect to be in business and shrug off their legal duties because the public are becoming more savvy.
Shady practices need to be highlighted and dealers shamed (not named) into putting things right. The dealers will have to understand rather than taking the Manufacturers line, they risk their profits if they don't follow their legal duties to customers.
Sadly whilst consumers have the CRA, dealers contracts with the manufactures do not have theh same legal oversight, but it would only take one dealer to challenge the tied contracts they have with manufactures regarding the quality of goods supplied to change the game.
Any dealers out there care to comment?
I would like to think that my approach has opened more peoples eye to the dangers of relying on traditions etc, especially in light of modern engineering, and the greater depth of information about products that has become available. We have certainly had some interesting debates along the way.
The Consumer Rights Act and the a lesser extend the previous Sale of Goods Act have given consumers a real boost to their rights and confidence, and I am really pleased to read of more people flexing their rights and showing traders that the public is not as gullible as they used to be.
The manufacturer's first line of defence from public contact are there dealers, We are slowly but surely battling them into shape though it will be a long process. No longer can dealers expect to be in business and shrug off their legal duties because the public are becoming more savvy.
Shady practices need to be highlighted and dealers shamed (not named) into putting things right. The dealers will have to understand rather than taking the Manufacturers line, they risk their profits if they don't follow their legal duties to customers.
Sadly whilst consumers have the CRA, dealers contracts with the manufactures do not have theh same legal oversight, but it would only take one dealer to challenge the tied contracts they have with manufactures regarding the quality of goods supplied to change the game.
Any dealers out there care to comment?
Its funny that you should say the manufacturers defense is the dealers, the dealer i bought mine from is a telling me that I need to ring Swift to chase them up and there telling to speak to the dealer! . There Both as bad as each other in my experience. At this point I went and spoke to the finance company Hopefully they have more weight behind them, then ME and they can get some answers out of them. ( fingers crossed )
I have to also agree with you that if you buy BRAND NEW van I shouldn't need inspecting, that should of been done at the factory/dealers or even both. I think they should just accept responsibility for what they sell and if its not upto scratch don't put it on your forecourt untill it is!!
I have to also agree with you that if you buy BRAND NEW van I shouldn't need inspecting, that should of been done at the factory/dealers or even both. I think they should just accept responsibility for what they sell and if its not upto scratch don't put it on your forecourt untill it is!!
Maz23 said:
Hello Maz,
I think you have certainly done the right thing. The finance company will have a more clout.
But I think you other points needs addressing also. You don't tell us what has required contact with your dealer, but I would guess you have a fault (s) that need to be corrected.
Now it depends on what arrangement you have entered into for the repairs, Again I'll guess you have contact the dealer to get the work done under warranty. And I'll also guess the dealer did not ask if you wanted it done under your Consume Rights Act rights or the Manufacturers warranty. The important difference is that the CRA rights make it the dealers sole responsibility to put right, and it does not require the manufacturers say so. The Dealer's will almost always not mention this as it costs them! where as with the manufactures warranty , the parts and most of the work is paid for by the manufacturer. - which is why you have been told to contact the manufacturer.
There is nothing stopping you even now instructing your dealer to undertake the same work under your rights afforded by the CRA. Then they must start the work with minimal delay and at no expense what so ever to you - including the collection and re delivery of your caravan. The Finance house will be acting under teh CRA not the manufactures warranty.
I suggest you look up the CRA on Which? or Money Saving Expert
Hi,
We bought a new Swift Siena 6TD (dealer special, based on Sprite Major 6 TD) in March, and as we don't have this issue would also say it isn't normal.
We bought a new Swift Siena 6TD (dealer special, based on Sprite Major 6 TD) in March, and as we don't have this issue would also say it isn't normal.
I've just had a quick look through the electrical drawing for any obvious signs of possible causes ...
The electrical drawing on page 15 of your Technical Handbook shows the pressure switch connected directly in series with the pump, so no software to interfere there. Also, the lighting circuits are very simple and conventional with the switches in series with the luminaries, rather than the switches providing an input into the EC600 to trigger software controlled relay outputs to the luminaries.
Out of curiosity, I'd be interested to learn whether or not the lights still flash if you open a tap (de-pressurise to start pump), and then stop the pump by removing its fuse (No.6 as shown on page 86 of Caravan Owners Handbook.) rather than allowing the pressure switch to stop the pump.
Any chance you can try this OP ?
Thanks.
The electrical drawing on page 15 of your Technical Handbook shows the pressure switch connected directly in series with the pump, so no software to interfere there. Also, the lighting circuits are very simple and conventional with the switches in series with the luminaries, rather than the switches providing an input into the EC600 to trigger software controlled relay outputs to the luminaries.
Out of curiosity, I'd be interested to learn whether or not the lights still flash if you open a tap (de-pressurise to start pump), and then stop the pump by removing its fuse (No.6 as shown on page 86 of Caravan Owners Handbook.) rather than allowing the pressure switch to stop the pump.
Any chance you can try this OP ?
Thanks.
Hi thanks for the info I have an engineer coming out to have a look at the all the faults I have on behalf of the finance company, so I will be connecting the water up at some point this week.
I will try the things you have mentioned and let you know.
I will try the things you have mentioned and let you know.
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