Why Practical Caravan?
I like the magazine in the format it is in but the name doesn't seem that appropriate these days.
I like the magazine in the format it is in but the name doesn't seem that appropriate these days.
Time for a name change?
- Thread starter ricky_s
- Start date
Mel
Moderator
I agree, what would you suggest. Given the focus on new vans and equipment; how about ASPIRATIONAL CARAVAN.
The unpleasant and cynical part of me would like to suggest; "thinly disguised advertising on behalf of the caravan industry for the purposes of profit for Haymarket". :evil:
But it wouldn't look good on the cover. Plus I keep buying it.
Mel
The unpleasant and cynical part of me would like to suggest; "thinly disguised advertising on behalf of the caravan industry for the purposes of profit for Haymarket". :evil:
But it wouldn't look good on the cover. Plus I keep buying it.
Mel
On sales of £184 million Haymarket last week reported a loss of £2.8million
across their 70 publications. Last year Lord Hezza sold the family silver, Teddington offices for £11.4 million.
Thus with all this in mind perhaps it is appropriate to consider some changes but not necessarily the name.
There have been improvements on technical matters which I do enjoy.
Caravanning is a people pastime. Perhaps our Editor could improve on his current three forum posts in over a yearhmy:
across their 70 publications. Last year Lord Hezza sold the family silver, Teddington offices for £11.4 million.
Thus with all this in mind perhaps it is appropriate to consider some changes but not necessarily the name.
There have been improvements on technical matters which I do enjoy.
Caravanning is a people pastime. Perhaps our Editor could improve on his current three forum posts in over a year
hmy:I'd like to see the emphasis being switched to "Practical" issues...
Its pretty rare to see articles on practical things, repairs, maintenance, fitting out for the season (if there is one!) laying up for winter, resealing joints that may be allowing water ingress, servicing, modifications etc., they do exist but they are very much in the minority
Ten year test reviews might be useful, that could include areas to be looked at carefully on certain models ( known problem areas etc)
There would need to be a modicum of common sense employed to discourage litigious folks from upsetting the apple cart, as a result of the practical articles, and warnings given about the usual areas of Co, LPG and electricity etc and other areas that are best not interfered with unless by experienced and qualified people.,..... and also without upsetting the manufacturers and their agents suppliers!
Its not rocket science... Yachting and boating magazines have been doing this quite satisfactorily for years, and without getting sued to death or facing criticism on the gas/electric issues or other safety issues.
there are some practical articles in the magazine but very few in relation to the all the other stuff
Remember there are many more dangerous areas on using maintaining/ repairing boats than with a caravan...
paws will now don tin helmet and hunker down waiting for the onslaught!
Regards to all and as always.
Happy Caravanning
paws
Its pretty rare to see articles on practical things, repairs, maintenance, fitting out for the season (if there is one!) laying up for winter, resealing joints that may be allowing water ingress, servicing, modifications etc., they do exist but they are very much in the minority
Ten year test reviews might be useful, that could include areas to be looked at carefully on certain models ( known problem areas etc)
There would need to be a modicum of common sense employed to discourage litigious folks from upsetting the apple cart, as a result of the practical articles, and warnings given about the usual areas of Co, LPG and electricity etc and other areas that are best not interfered with unless by experienced and qualified people.,..... and also without upsetting the manufacturers and their agents suppliers!
Its not rocket science... Yachting and boating magazines have been doing this quite satisfactorily for years, and without getting sued to death or facing criticism on the gas/electric issues or other safety issues.
there are some practical articles in the magazine but very few in relation to the all the other stuff
Remember there are many more dangerous areas on using maintaining/ repairing boats than with a caravan...
paws will now don tin helmet and hunker down waiting for the onslaught!
Regards to all and as always.
Happy Caravanning
paws
Paws I think you should be given the Editors job.
I would take out a subscription rather than buy the odd copy if your thoughts were reflected more in the magazine.
I would take out a subscription rather than buy the odd copy if your thoughts were reflected more in the magazine.
With you paws, except there is too much fear in upsetting manufacturers, especially in the new van reviews. A little more honesty is what is needed in the industry. Manufacturers who's new construction methods have also had problems such as panel de lamination needs to be highlighted as a potential problem for example.
I would also like to see the journalists who are being questioned on the forum about their articles on vans, towcars, blogs etc by the readers and on line family to step up to the mark and answer the points we raise.
Without us there is no magazine!!
I would also like to see the journalists who are being questioned on the forum about their articles on vans, towcars, blogs etc by the readers and on line family to step up to the mark and answer the points we raise.
Without us there is no magazine!!
Parksy
Moderator
I must admit that I have at times felt slightly disappointed at the apparent lack of acknowledgement of this forum at Haymarket Towers, but then if we consider the true facts with an open mind I think that we may be wrong so I'm going to add a few comments in defence of the editorial team at Practical Caravan which you are perfect liberty to discuss or to disagree with if you wish.Dustydog said:There have been improvements on technical matters which I do enjoy.
Caravanning is a people pastime. Perhaps our Editor could improve on his current three forum posts in over a year
In light of the regular input from previous editor Nigel Donnelly, who was very much in favour of our forum and was a regular contributor, the relative scarcity of input from Alistair Clements may have given the impression that this forum is not a priority at Practical Caravan.
To be fair however, since Nigel moved on to brighter and better things we have regular (almost daily) input from our excellent hard working Digital Editor Lizzie Pope and also valuable talking points submitted regularly by Digital Content Manager Kate Taylor. Perhaps the task of forum contributions has been delegated to these two stalwart supporters of the forum instead?
They both frequently appear on our message boards and are always on hand to sort out forum issues, besides adding comments for general topics.
Maybe additional content from the magazine editor would seem like an attempt to encroach on the position of fellow Practical Caravan staff?
Martin24 said:
It would be refreshing if an older caravan was used as a long term test caravan for a season or two, a few days in a brand new caravan followed by a quick review is not going to unearth the real issues faced by caravan buyers. :huh:
I agree that more magazine content which deals with the multitude of niggles and problems which crop up with caravans that are not brand new would be welcome, sadly the two previous technical editors who dealt with these topics have passed away after both suffering debilitating illness, so there may probably have been a slight hiatus for the practical side of caravanning in the magazine articles.
The journalists who write the articles have put in occasional forum appearances in the past, but the general overall responses seemed negative and even faintly hostile at times, so I can understand why they appear reluctant to contribute to forum discussions now.
Perhaps when a new technical editor is appointed the forum will hold no terrors for him (or her), and they will feel able to briefly address some of the technical issues raised on this website and on the facebook page even though they would in effect be doing unpaid work for their employer? :lol:
Ever the Romantic Steve :cheer:
Martin hit the nail on the head.
Without us there is no magazine!
Martin hit the nail on the head.
Without us there is no magazine!
hi all.
I'm afraid the publication has not been "Practical" for a very long time, and with the passing of John think in future it will be even less so, tis a shame but there it is, it is merely a advertisement media for the caravan industry and equipment suppliers, no more so than the adopting of the caravan show, which dropped the technical content after the death of John. it is fine to go swanning off for a weekend in a new van and car supplied for the purpose of advertising the product and a nice paid for weekend freebie for the staff, but what as that got to do with the nitty gritty of caravan life very little. and while it may be true that some caravanners can still afford to buy new vans and cars the vast majority cannot, what does the content of the show or the magazine have for them, very little I think.
the forum fairs a little better to the average mr/mrs caravan owner as it is those who make up the member list plus although there are 32,000+ members very few have ever had any input into the publication, it seems to be a poor second cousin who gets an occasional christmas card, but not an invitation to the family do.
yes Steve the present staff do contribute and that is a good thing but it is usually to welcome a new member or post a link to someone blog or a product featured in the current issue, ask a question regarding some technical aspect or ask why the magazine does or does not say anything on the subject of poor quality and the world goes silent.
mr and mrs average used to have something of interest to read but not any more, it is one of the reasons I cancelled my subsciption years ago, cover to cover full of adverts with the odd page of content,
perhaps the the publication should change it's name to the caravan advertiser seems more appropriate.
I'm afraid the publication has not been "Practical" for a very long time, and with the passing of John think in future it will be even less so, tis a shame but there it is, it is merely a advertisement media for the caravan industry and equipment suppliers, no more so than the adopting of the caravan show, which dropped the technical content after the death of John. it is fine to go swanning off for a weekend in a new van and car supplied for the purpose of advertising the product and a nice paid for weekend freebie for the staff, but what as that got to do with the nitty gritty of caravan life very little. and while it may be true that some caravanners can still afford to buy new vans and cars the vast majority cannot, what does the content of the show or the magazine have for them, very little I think.
the forum fairs a little better to the average mr/mrs caravan owner as it is those who make up the member list plus although there are 32,000+ members very few have ever had any input into the publication, it seems to be a poor second cousin who gets an occasional christmas card, but not an invitation to the family do.
yes Steve the present staff do contribute and that is a good thing but it is usually to welcome a new member or post a link to someone blog or a product featured in the current issue, ask a question regarding some technical aspect or ask why the magazine does or does not say anything on the subject of poor quality and the world goes silent.
mr and mrs average used to have something of interest to read but not any more, it is one of the reasons I cancelled my subsciption years ago, cover to cover full of adverts with the odd page of content,
perhaps the the publication should change it's name to the caravan advertiser seems more appropriate.
There have been some interesting points raised so far. It's likely that its a combination of the issues that has reduced the 'practical' content of magazine and the number of forum threads with real interaction with the Magazines staff.
I think there may be four more reasons which may go some way to explaining the reduction in technical projects.
The first is as the magazine has been going for so long, it may well have covered most of the projects at some time.
The second is the caravan manufacturers are incorporating more equipment in standard caravans, which is reducing the number of “how to add....” projects to be undertaken.
The third is what is now used in caravans has fewer owner serviceable parts.
The fourth is whether we like it or not, an increasing percentage of the caravanning hobby is being covered by creeping legislation – which actually restricts what the ordinary person is allowed to do,
and its not likely to go away.
With litigation today, if a magazine suggests or distributes information that might lead an ordinary member of the public to carry out an illegal activity, they could be held responsible. This fear of prosecution may tend to restrict the number 'practical' of projects that can be published.
I think there may be four more reasons which may go some way to explaining the reduction in technical projects.
The first is as the magazine has been going for so long, it may well have covered most of the projects at some time.
The second is the caravan manufacturers are incorporating more equipment in standard caravans, which is reducing the number of “how to add....” projects to be undertaken.
The third is what is now used in caravans has fewer owner serviceable parts.
The fourth is whether we like it or not, an increasing percentage of the caravanning hobby is being covered by creeping legislation – which actually restricts what the ordinary person is allowed to do,
and its not likely to go away.
With litigation today, if a magazine suggests or distributes information that might lead an ordinary member of the public to carry out an illegal activity, they could be held responsible. This fear of prosecution may tend to restrict the number 'practical' of projects that can be published.
Parksy
Moderator
The editorial staff also regularly contribute to this website via blogs and articles, the links are on the blue section via clickable text at the top of the forum page and they participate in their Facebook profile.colin-yorkshire said:
Out of interest Colin, if you cancelled your subscription years ago how do you know what's in each monthly edition of Practical Caravan magazine? :lol:
ProfJohnL said:
Hello John.
interesting perspective but a little short on true content or reason bit like the publication..
yes it is true that years gone by practical issues were commonly covered in the magazine with excellent articles on maintenance and improvements, and by enlarge by now most of these caravans will be no longer used. But there are many other issues that effect caravanners who don't have that 2015 model. the forum is full of them but not the magazine.
it is also true the rolling legislation makes it harder for the average owner to keep legal a subject not covered either.
but what one has to remember and is often forgot legislation is not retrospective, as it is unenforceable,
[slightly off subject but relevant] the owner of a pre 1965 registered car cannot be compelled to wear sear belts [as is the present law] because before that date cars were not required to have seat belts. the same rules apply to caravans.
and say weights.
and lastly I would dispute what exactly it is a caravan owner cannot do, gas regs do not apply to privately owned and used caravans and neither do the electrical regulations, it may be wise not to but it is not illegal to do so, that is without mentioning any other practical jobs one can do, like damp repairs, water improvements, panel changes and servicing it may be prudent to let some else do it BUT.
I do understand you concerns about safety and litigation but most if it is unfounded, if that was the case every writer and publisher of a manual would be liable for the instructions they gave as well as the printer who didn't verify the instructions printed were accurate. we are getting that way, but not yet..
Parksy said:
I spend a lot of time at the doctors these days, Steve. :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
Parksy said:
Steve you are a wise man and your moderation skills are excellent!! No I do mean that.
The editorial contribution via blogs and articles is part of the lack interaction. We get guided to read the blog, respond to the blog be it positive, negative or mixed, and there endeth the interaction.
There is no need to continue a subscription as most of the content of the magazine is on line anyway via, facebook, youtube, caravan channel, the list is too long to mention really but it's all free.
It isn't just PC that face all these problems though, it seems as if pretty much all of the caravan press are no more than mouthpiece for the industry.
Who's local and wants to join me in setting up a real review youtube site, we could take a camera around the dealer forecourts and show how it really is. Until of course we get banned!!
Parksy said
"the editorial staff also regularly contribute to this website via blogs and articles, the links are on the blue section via clickable text at the top of the forum page and they participate in their Facebook profile.
Read more at http://www.practicalcaravan.com/forum/chit-chat/52250-time-for-a-name-change?start=10#Fr3tXZSpeQP991FI.99"
Sadly Steve of the last 10 blogs six relate to cars....hmy:
However all is not lost!
I was given a latest copy of John Wickersham's Haynes Caravan Workshop Manual. Note the word " Workshop". Now this is a true Practical book which has even shown an old dog like me things I didn't know. I can recommend this book to all caravanners.
In regard to safety litigation , can't do this and can't do that, Prof John will be impressed to see at the beginning of the book a very comprehensive warning is given in plain simple English about the perils of dealing with gas and electrical items if not qualified etc. But at least the articles go onto explain everything..
You will recall at the last Woosiefest SirGgagakev had toilet troubleD Fortunately having experienced the same problem a few years ago I carry a couple of spare parts. We fitted them and all was well. This is the type of article that is practical but on the whole never seems to get published.
Colin is on the right track forming his own group. Add me.
Clearly there are some serious problems within Haymarket at the moment and indeed I am sure we are all sensitive to the Employees concerns. about their own positions. I suspect Lord Hezza will be looking to reduce the 70 publications . Who knows which magazines will go??
Increase sales and the mag will survive but not on the back of adverts and blogs etc. Let's have some more John Wickersham style articles.
"the editorial staff also regularly contribute to this website via blogs and articles, the links are on the blue section via clickable text at the top of the forum page and they participate in their Facebook profile.
Read more at http://www.practicalcaravan.com/forum/chit-chat/52250-time-for-a-name-change?start=10#Fr3tXZSpeQP991FI.99"
Sadly Steve of the last 10 blogs six relate to cars....
hmy:However all is not lost!
I was given a latest copy of John Wickersham's Haynes Caravan Workshop Manual. Note the word " Workshop". Now this is a true Practical book which has even shown an old dog like me things I didn't know. I can recommend this book to all caravanners.
In regard to safety litigation , can't do this and can't do that, Prof John will be impressed to see at the beginning of the book a very comprehensive warning is given in plain simple English about the perils of dealing with gas and electrical items if not qualified etc. But at least the articles go onto explain everything..
You will recall at the last Woosiefest SirGgagakev had toilet troubleD Fortunately having experienced the same problem a few years ago I carry a couple of spare parts. We fitted them and all was well. This is the type of article that is practical but on the whole never seems to get published.
Colin is on the right track forming his own group. Add me.
Clearly there are some serious problems within Haymarket at the moment and indeed I am sure we are all sensitive to the Employees concerns. about their own positions. I suspect Lord Hezza will be looking to reduce the 70 publications . Who knows which magazines will go??
Increase sales and the mag will survive but not on the back of adverts and blogs etc. Let's have some more John Wickersham style articles.
Hello all,
Apologies that this is one of my rare posts, but as Parksy points out we have a very capable Digital editor and Digital content manager who are on here very regularly in my place!
Some very interesting points raised here, and many very valid ones... Key among them is that we have been lucky enough to have two very capable technical 'gurus' since my arrival, but tragically have lost them both to long-term illness - Doug in my first week, and John just before Christmas.
It has always been my intention to give a balance within the magazine - travel, van reviews, tow cars and advice - but there is no doubt that the latter has suffered, mainly due to the difficulty of getting hold of the right expertise to write them. We now have the challenge of finding a new contributor to fill the void left by John, and work alongside the likes of our 'DIY Mechanic' Nigel Hutson to ensure that there is enough 'Practical' content to live up to the name.
Parksy raises the interesting question of pre-owned long-term test vans. We do currently have a Bailey Pageant (owned by managing editor Sarah Wakely) and Nigel's Lunar Clubman, but I am also thinking of running reports from long-time contributor Andy Jenkinson on his Bailey Ranger if that might be of interest?
Please bear with us, we hope to have a new technical expert on board very soon...
Alastair
Apologies that this is one of my rare posts, but as Parksy points out we have a very capable Digital editor and Digital content manager who are on here very regularly in my place!
Some very interesting points raised here, and many very valid ones... Key among them is that we have been lucky enough to have two very capable technical 'gurus' since my arrival, but tragically have lost them both to long-term illness - Doug in my first week, and John just before Christmas.
It has always been my intention to give a balance within the magazine - travel, van reviews, tow cars and advice - but there is no doubt that the latter has suffered, mainly due to the difficulty of getting hold of the right expertise to write them. We now have the challenge of finding a new contributor to fill the void left by John, and work alongside the likes of our 'DIY Mechanic' Nigel Hutson to ensure that there is enough 'Practical' content to live up to the name.
Parksy raises the interesting question of pre-owned long-term test vans. We do currently have a Bailey Pageant (owned by managing editor Sarah Wakely) and Nigel's Lunar Clubman, but I am also thinking of running reports from long-time contributor Andy Jenkinson on his Bailey Ranger if that might be of interest?
Please bear with us, we hope to have a new technical expert on board very soon...
Alastair
Dustydog said:
Hi DD,
Although it is a brilliant idea it wasn't "mine" credit must go to "Sir outnumbered WC 4to1" I will of course subscribe to it,
I am glad Alastair found the time to respond, and I wish him luck finding a technical expert replacement for John and Doug, it will be a tough job finding someone to fill their shoes. we all remember the passing of Rob Jackson and said there would never be another like him, sadly this was correct.
while it is true that the caravan industry has moved on since the early days, there is still an interest in older vans and in owners keeping theirs in good shape rather than trading up to a newer one which sadly is the way publications seems to push their readers, perhaps some "wheeler dealers" type articles spread over several issues taking a wreck of a van and restoring it, the sort of article Practical Caravan used to do in just about every issue. you never know the magazine could again become popular as well as practical.
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