Tow car and caravan

[ProfJohnL]

Hi

I've spent the last few weeks researching and researching the best way forward to move from camping to having a tourer caravan for my wife and two children, everywhere says do lots of research before, that I've certainly done and will continue to do, I actually really enjoy that side of things to be honest.

Anyway, I've currently got an i30 with a tow limit of 1,200kg which doesn't seem to be able to handle much. I'm also on a 1999 licence, but from what I can tell the 3,500kg limit can still work comfortably if I get the right car/caravan combo.

To keep costs down I'm looking at something like buying an older one owner mondeo with a decent towing limit of 2,000kg, kerb weight of 1,600kg. I've looked at towcar.info and found it quite useful but also confusing. I'm thinking of something like the Adria Altea 552 to go with it (or something used we would be happy with but similar weights) and understand the 85% guidance, I consider myself a very sensible yet confident driver and have no issues at the thought of towing. Tow car info gives 87% on this particular mondeo/altea match which seems good enough. The main figures are as follows:
MTPLM of 1,420kg
MIRO of 1,270kg
Actual Gross Train Weight of 3,269kg
Stated Vehicle Gross Train Weight of 4,210kg

Two questions I really would appreciate help on:

1) I think the first 3 figures seems fine, but the last of 4,210kg exceeds the 3,500kg and this worries me, I'm not sure if this figure would make me illegal?
2) With the tow car, as I said my current i30 has a tow limit of 1,200kg, before I sell it am I definitely right in thinking this would give me virtually no towing options caravan wise?

I need 4 berth minimum new or old. We're looking to browse only at the NEC in October, and buy used or new early next year. I'm 100% we will love it though and do it for many years ahead so am considering the long term in my purchase plans, and have thought through all the cons in detail. Main is we can afford it as the youngest of our children is out of full time childcare very soon, along with a much sweeter mortgage rate after a killer 5 year fix nears the end! Please please help, I would be grateful for life, I really don't think I can trust the dealers!

Ian

Hello Ian

Its very wise to look at the data before purchasing.

Lets start with your licence entitlement, becasue I suspect from the information you have supplied, you have misunderstood its implication and how to calculate it.

The Cat B entitlement allows you to drive a car and caravan whose combined Maximum authorised Mass (MAM) does not exceed 3500kg You need to understand that this value is non negotiable, in other word you cant change the value by only part loading the car or caravan.

You tell us the caravan you want has an MTPLM (which is also its MAM) of 1420kg so that means what ever car you go for must have and MAM of 3500 -
1420 = 2080kg or less

The cars MAM is the same as its Gross Vehicle Weight which is for the solo car - which is the second largest figure on the cars data plate.

Provide these two values added together are no greater than 3500 you are entitled to drive it.

Now we come to the matching of the car to the caravan. For starters the i30 with only a 1200 towed weight limit will not a sensible or safe match to the caravan. I must admit I'm a little suspicious of the figures you have provided for the Mondeo. Whilst they are generally rated quite highly as tow cars, You do need to double check the kerb weight , Gross Vehicle weight and maximum towed values.

I'm confident the Mondeo would pull your proposed caravan, but the Combined MAM may exceed your 3500kg limit, and the ratio of MTPLM to Kerbweight may be nearer 90% than the industry recommendation of 85%

Please check your figures

 

[prestwichian]

Thank you for taking the time to reply.

I'm probably being thick, but I'd rather be thick and with the right caravan and car so I;ll just check again if ok. If I have the caravan with a MAM of 1,420kg, this leaves me with 2,080kg for the MAM of the car to play with. And with a mondeo kerb weight of 1,600kg, and load of another say 200kg this brings me to a total of 3,220kg, therefore comfortably under the 3,500kg?

Do you know what the Stated Vehicle Gross Train Weight of 4,210kg from tow car info is by the way?

And to buy the car or caravan first....

 

[VicMallows]

Ian,
I do actually tow with an 'older Mondeo'. Mine is one of the very last Mk2 , a fairly basic 1.8TD.
The relevant figures directly off the plate are 1870kg 3270kg. Of course every variant is different so when considering a used car it is important to check the actual plate if this is critical to your license

On the basis of MY car you (at 1420kg) would be still within your license, but would be slightly over the permissible GTW of the car.

Much more to the point is whether it will tow adequately? My van is a small 2 berth, MTPLM 1100kg, which we certainly do not load heavily. Our Mondeo is adequate, but could certainly do with more power. It got us to southern Spain and back without problem ...... but we were down to 30mph and 2nd gear on some stretches of the motorway! I would not relish pulling 1400kg.

 

[prestwichian]

Thank you Vic

The relevant figures of 1,870kg and 3,270kg. 1,870kg is the MAM of the car and 3,270kg is the MAM of the car and caravan together. Both these numbers you say are on your car plate? Does the 3,270kg mean your car and caravan cannot legally weigh more than that together?

I was thinking of the 2.2 diesel with a good bhp.

 

[ProfJohnL]

Thank you Vic

The relevant figures of 1,870kg and 3,270kg. 1,870kg is the MAM of the car and 3,270kg is the MAM of the car and caravan together. Both these numbers you say are on your car plate? Does the 3,270kg mean your car and caravan cannot legally weigh more than that together?

I was thinking of the 2.2 diesel with a good bhp.

Hello again Ian,

You wondered if the weights are confusing well yes they can be, but it does actually make sense provided if you take time and isolate the various factors and understand them.

I'm reluctant to give you chapter and verse on the subject becasue the figures you have quoted don't feel right from what I know of the Mondeo as a modest family sized car. The 1870kg seems low for the Gross Vehicle Weight (GVW & MAM) This will be found on the vehicle data plate and will be the second largest weight figure on the plate. The largest figure is the Gross Train Weight GTW, and the difference between them will give you the heaviest trailer the fully loaded car is rated to tow. BUT that is for an ideal trailer, and caravan are not ideal, so teh industry recommends the trailers MAM or MTPLM is kept below 85% of the tow vehicles ULW or Kerbweight.

You cannot assume that all models will have the same weight limits across their range, so it is vitally important that you get the correct verified data about the model you are interested in.

 

[prestwichian]

Thank you John, that makes sense, I'll double check the mondeo figures

 

[Nieuwoudt]

maybe a very basic or stupid question: I have a Tuscon and find just different weights on my data plate- what is what ( MTPLM etc)
listed without any explanation is:
2120 kg
4020 kg
1-1280 kg
2-1150 kg

 

[Parksy]

Hi

I've spent the last few weeks researching and researching the best way forward to move from camping to having a tourer caravan for my wife and two children, everywhere says do lots of research before, that I've certainly done and will continue to do, I actually really enjoy that side of things to be honest.

Anyway, I've currently got an i30 with a tow limit of 1,200kg which doesn't seem to be able to handle much. I'm also on a 1999 licence, but from what I can tell the 3,500kg limit can still work comfortably if I get the right car/caravan combo.

To keep costs down I'm looking at something like buying an older one owner mondeo with a decent towing limit of 2,000kg, kerb weight of 1,600kg. I've looked at towcar.info and found it quite useful but also confusing. I'm thinking of something like the Adria Altea 552 to go with it (or something used we would be happy with but similar weights) and understand the 85% guidance, I consider myself a very sensible yet confident driver and have no issues at the thought of towing. Tow car info gives 87% on this particular mondeo/altea match which seems good enough. The main figures are as follows:
MTPLM of 1,420kg
MIRO of 1,270kg
Actual Gross Train Weight of 3,269kg
Stated Vehicle Gross Train Weight of 4,210kg

Two questions I really would appreciate help on:

1) I think the first 3 figures seems fine, but the last of 4,210kg exceeds the 3,500kg and this worries me, I'm not sure if this figure would make me illegal?
2) With the tow car, as I said my current i30 has a tow limit of 1,200kg, before I sell it am I definitely right in thinking this would give me virtually no towing options caravan wise?

I need 4 berth minimum new or old. We're looking to browse only at the NEC in October, and buy used or new early next year. I'm 100% we will love it though and do it for many years ahead so am considering the long term in my purchase plans, and have thought through all the cons in detail. Main is we can afford it as the youngest of our children is out of full time childcare very soon, along with a much sweeter mortgage rate after a killer 5 year fix nears the end! Please please help, I would be grateful for life, I really don't think I can trust the dealers!

Ian

Please change your profile avatar for something more appropriate or delete it.

 

[Damian]

Moderator Note: The original topic posted has been deleted along with subsequent posting from the OP due to the fact that despite being asked to change his avatar pic, has not done so and that picture will NOT be allowed to remain visible.
Totally inappropriate for the site and not even relevant to this country.