Towing Novice

[Kevin_374542543]

Hi All

I need some advice, last year was our first year of caravaning and we brought a Bailey Pageant Burgundy with a MTPLM of 1445kg, we tow with a Ford Mondeo 130 tdci estate which is about 93 0/0 instead of 85 0/0.All seemed fine until caught in a cross wind and then it was a case of a very happy tail wagging the dog, which is quite unnerving.

We are know looking at a Kia Sportage because we have changed the van to a Pegasus which as a MTPLM 1480kg which for the Sportage is 83 0/0.My question is should i stick with the Mondeo and just gain experiance towing with that car or go for the Sportage

 

[marlot]

I too started with a mondeo ghia estate, but my cravan was a Bailey Senator (max weight 1500kg). It was actually a pretty good tow.

There may be things you can do to improve the tow with your current car.

Are you loading the caravan up to the maximum. You calculate the percentage based on the actual weight of the caravan - you may not be at 93%.

Also, what nose weight are you running? I found with the mondeo it was really difficult to get the nose weight down to 75Kg - I had to put the gas bottles in the boot - I don't know what the limit is on a sportage, but I found my bailey much easier to tow with a noseweight around 90-100Kg - and If you are going to change, I'd recommend a car with a 100Kg noselimit if you can afford it.

Even with a heavier car, there is always a problem when there's a cross wind. There will be other factors - how fast were you going? Was it downhill? What was the windspeed? Anything else which may have triggered the swaying?

 

[ProfJohnL]

Hello Kevin,

If you experience instability (which can be very unnerving) then the straight forward instant answer is to slow down.

As for the towing ratio, contrary to Timothy's post the ratio is always calculated on the MTLPM of the caravan divided by kerb weight of the car all times 100 to convert it to percent. It is always preferable to keep the percentage as low as possible, but unless you are limited by your licence categories, the maximum actual trailer weight is defined by the car manufacturer in their specifications for the vehicle.

Although towing ratio is often quoted in questions about instability, and it does play a part, there are other important factors that affect it. The major ones are:-

Keeping the trailer as light as is reasonably possible

Weight distribution within the car and the trailer - keep heavier items low down and towards the centre of the vehicle or over the axle,

Nose load - which must not exceed either of the manufactures limits,

Condition of the car and trailer - Properly serviced with special attention to suspension, brakes and tyres.

And probably the most important of all; driving style and reading the road conditions.

A note for Timothy,

Gas bottle must always be carried in properly constructed carriers to keep them upright and fully ventilated. It is exceptionally foolhardy to carry them in the boot of car.

 

[marlot]

This is why I hardly ever bother posting to forums any more.

The caravan club advice is "The Club's advice is to aim for a TOWED LOAD no more than 85% of the car's kerb weight for safety and stability." - ie not MTPLM. I asked this specifically on the caravan towing course.

I do agree on not carrying gas in the car if possible, and I made sure they were properly secured. Also as soon as I could (end of company lease) I upgraded to a car which allowed a noseweight of 100Kg so no longer have to do so - hence part of my advice on noseweights.

 

[ProfJohnL]

Hello Timothy,

All I can say is that the generally accepted practice for the calculation of the towing ratio is based on MTPLM and kerbweight. Whilst this will always be inaccurate because no car ever is driven in its kerbweight configuration and hopefully most caravans are never fully loaded to their MTPLM, the resultant figure is the worst case scenario, and is helpful when trying to match cars and caravans.

In Kevin's case, he calculated his ratio to 93%. By applying the method you were suggesting his ratio figure would be likely to drop to closer to 85%, but that would not change the fact that he had experienced some instability - which ever way you calculate the ratio.

It is actually quite difficult to know exactly how heavy your caravan is, so there are substantial difficulties in applying the method you were told by the CC instructor. - Most people don't have a handy weighbridge.

What Kevin needed was some practical advice on how to reduce the instability- recalculating the ratio would do nothing to help, in fact it would make the problem look worse!.

As I am sure you are aware form reading posts, I am not a big fan of the CC's adherence to 85%, because it give the wrong message to drivers that up to 85% is good and over 85% is bad. It's never that black and white, and the way it is used overshadows the other very important factors that have a significant effect on stability.

Suffice to say I don't agree with having a fixed figure, but I do agree with the principal of keeping trailers as light as possible.

Ps please continue posting {}

 

[Lutz]

I concur with John L. While it is always beneficial to keep the weight of the caravan as low as possible, you'd have to be an experienced tower to be able to detect the difference in the way a 85% outfit handles compared to a 93% one, all other conditions remaining equal. There are many other factors which determine the stability of an outfit and several can be even more important than the weight ratio.

 

[Kevin_374542543]

Thanks Guys

I do appreciate your input.

First there are only two of us and three greyhounds, so we are very if ever loaded to max. The road was straight and level, wind speed gusting between 20mph & 30 mph, travelling at 60mph and yes i did back off the gas and dropped to 50mph to bring it back under control.The Burgundy was fitted with the Al-ko ATC.Is this skittishness always going to be a problem when towing with the Mondeo, and not so much with the Sportage with that car being 300kg heavier than the Mondeo.I do appreciate the importance of weight distribution in the van.So my dilemma is do i stick with the Mondeo which is close to its limit or go with the Sortage which according to everyone (C&C,CCC and Baileys)is the perfect match.Help me make the decision please. Noseweight for the Sportage is 75kg.

Timothy did you load your Mondeo with the noseweight of 90kg-100kg surely this may have affected the chassis and maybe invalidated your insurance.

 

[ProfJohnL]

Hello Kevin,

I have not driven either the Mondeo or the Sportage so I cannot offer any benefit of direct experience, but some general features I think tend lend weight to wards the Sportage.

The Mondeo has earned a formidable reputation as a tow car, but clearly you are not finding it so.

It would be worth reviewing your loading, and to doubly make sure that heaviest items are loaded towards the centre of the caravan over the axle. This could make a very significant difference, and avoid the outlay on a new car.

That said there are two factors that may make the Sportage a better choice:

The first is the weight advantage or the heavier car - this will improve the towing ratio

But the second is the distance between the rear wheels of the car and tow ball. The shorter this is will make it more difficult for the caravan to push the car around.

For those two reasons it is likely the Sportage will provide a more stable tow, BUT, it is still important to watch the loading of the caravan.

 

[Kevin_374542543]

Hello Kevin,

I have not driven either the Mondeo or the Sportage so I cannot offer any benefit of direct experience, but some general features I think tend lend weight to wards the Sportage.

The Mondeo has earned a formidable reputation as a tow car, but clearly you are not finding it so.

It would be worth reviewing your loading, and to doubly make sure that heaviest items are loaded towards the centre of the caravan over the axle. This could make a very significant difference, and avoid the outlay on a new car.

That said there are two factors that may make the Sportage a better choice:

The first is the weight advantage or the heavier car - this will improve the towing ratio

But the second is the distance between the rear wheels of the car and tow ball. The shorter this is will make it more difficult for the caravan to push the car around.

For those two reasons it is likely the Sportage will provide a more stable tow, BUT, it is still important to watch the loading of the caravan.

Thanks John

I must add that the Mondeo is a mk 111 version june o7 plate not the new version.