Very Sad

[Damian]

According top this month's CC Magazine 16, yes , SIXTEEN, CLs have shut down this month.

Must be a sign of the times and ever rising costs maybe. A recession or depression or whatever . Clearly a loss of 16 CLs in one month is a heck of a lot.

 

[Dustydog]

According top this month's CC Magazine 16, yes , SIXTEEN, CLs have shut down this month.

Must be a sign of the times and ever rising costs maybe. A recession or depression or whatever . Clearly a loss of 16 CLs in one month is a heck of a lot.

My apologies.
The Title is VERY SAD. The Forum wont let me edit my original Grrr

 

[RogerL]

It may simply be that these are all CLs who withdrew at the end of 2011 as an annual review - the magazine no longer gives the reason for withdrawal.

 

[Martin24]

No they don't, I wish they still did, especially when a regular holiday spot closes!! Only found out that one of our regular site owners had died when we wrote to say that my wife died and that then came as quite a shock at a time you could do without it and the family could probably of done without our news too! Just a the simple reason for closure would of saved upset on both sides.

 

[Jim_374334401]

On the faces. of it tat is indeed sad news. We have stayed on numerous CLs over the years of widely different standards. One or two were obviously not up to scratch and needed to be closed down. Others were spectaculary good with great facilities above what you would normally expect from a CL. I agree it would be good to learn if the CL had closed f economic reasons of if they failed to keep to the standards the CClub require of them.

Jim

 

[DavidO]

I would agree with the above, but how many times do you read of complaints re cls and ocupation numbers. CC members are very quick to complain if their expectations are not meet, the CC follows all of these and will close any cl that breaks the rules. You must remember the CC makes no income from CLs. the offer them as a service to the members.

 

[Surfer]

They could be shutting due to high cost of electric and people who abuse it and have fan heaters going in their awnings during the winter months!

 

[graham_somersham]

That's a common sight now isn't it Surfer. I was on a CS this summer and a guy turned up with a campervan who demanded 16A supply as he had taken out all the gas appliances and replaced them with electric only. Unfortunately for him the site owners had put 6A fuses in all the EHU's, you should have heard the fuss he made. Why do some people think they can pay less than a tenner a night including free showers etc and then use £'s worth of electricity.

Having a CL or CS is hardly a money making enterprise and most site owners do it for very little profit. We should be grateful many even bother considering the way they are treated by some caravanners. No shows, rowdy families, dogs out of control, abuse of facilities etc must be demoralising and for so little return.

 

[Damian]

Graham has it about right, as do others, with people abusing the facilities and making it uneconomical to keep running.

Only this summer I was called to a caravan as the electric kept cutting out and when I added up all the appliances they were trying to use at the same time it came to 25Amps,,,,,,,,,,,,and they wondered why the power kept cutting out.

The one item which was unbelievable was a 2Kw fan heater on full, in the awning, with the panels removed!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[DavidO]

I find the comments on this very interesting, because when you mention metering the supply, teddies get thrown out of prams.We have 3 pitches that have a meter on each hook up ,We have used these to monitor usage over the winter. Todate usage per 24 hrs ranges from £1.50 to over £3. Its because of these costs we cannot offer a low season price, as we are finding our costs are higher in winter than summer. I could well see we close over the winter months if we cannot recover this cost.
David

 

[DianneT]

I agree whole heartedly peple take advantage of the free electricity with having fan heaters going all night in the awning for a dog can you believe? two other instances are in the day because the children are playing in the awning, and having visitors on a cool evening sitting in the awning with fan heater going. Why not sit in the warmth and comfort of your own caravan/motor home or have you dog in with you. Awnings leak heat through every orifice. I don't blame David O for his thoughts on closing in the winter. Meters will become fixtures on more CL's I think.

 

[WatsonJohnG]

Its a common idea that the electric is paid for so don't use the gas
But if the electric is paid for by the site owner he has to pass that on to the user
We go every year to Sarzeau in Brittany and people plug in ovens,electric barbecues,heaters etc secure in the knowledge that the pitch fee covers their cost
It gone up to £4.50 a night this year for electric on that site
I don't think that 16 Cls closing out of the hundreds is surprising really and it would be interesting to know how many new ones have opened

 

[easyt]

I agree whole heartedly peple take advantage of the free electricity with having fan heaters going all night in the awning for a dog can you believe? two other instances are in the day because the children are playing in the awning, and having visitors on a cool evening sitting in the awning with fan heater going. Why not sit in the warmth and comfort of your own caravan/motor home or have you dog in with you. Awnings leak heat through every orifice. I don't blame David O for his thoughts on closing in the winter. Meters will become fixtures on more CL's I think.

I don't normally consider using a fan heater in the awning. I did do a few times this year though. The Christmas before last we had a porch awning up. We did see a few vans with heaters burning day and night in the awnings! As it was below - 10C some nights we just used the awning for additional food storage and some veg prep. Also kept the drinks very cool It was nice sat well wrapped up outside the van in the afternoon sun.

This year it was mild but without that lovely afternoon sun. Having been out from about 9am till 2pm I did use a fan heater for a couple of hours in the awning during the afternoon. This was probably on 5 nicer afternoons of the 10 nights e were away. I suspect I used about 50p per afternoon although the heating in the van was only on 500Watts and about 63 degrees. we had a full awning up and rather than trying to heat it all I made sure that at the end of the awning adjacent to the caravan door the awning flaps were weighted down inside with plastic milk bottles filled with water. In that end 6 foot or so of the awning it was very pleasant to sit (with tea shirt, thin sleevless top and thin sweater) to do the crossword and have a drink. Come 4 O'clock fan heater off - into van and turn up the heat with 1KW and just 500W over night.

All in all I suspect we averaged less than 1KW (taking account of fridge and water heater over a 24 hour period - but I suspect that that may cost about £3.

Compare that to some vans using probably 2KW in the awning day and night and probably another KW in the van. Then you are talking closer to £10 a day. As I said earlier I rarely use a heater iin the awning at Christmas and never at other times of the year but seeing heater on day and night in some awnings at winter and used by some extensively in the summer I can see some sites banning there use.

 

[xtrailman]

I'm not sure why everyone assumes the CL's have closed due to abuse of the supply??
Cl's open and close every year.
They don't have to have an electric supply, its a option.
The ex CCC cl i use twice a year has just had another ten supplies added, and knowing the owner he certainly wouldn't be adding extra if he thought there was no profit.
At just over ten pounds last year i consider it a bargain, just hope the expansion doesn't spoil the quite site.
Maybe a reason for closure is down to the 5 van limit.

 

[Sproket]

Have a look at this electric running costs calculator just put the amps req in the top box, how many hours a day usage & how much per uint you pay ...........

With the price of electric so high, the owners will have no choice but to either meter the consumption or lower the amperage available...

£ 10.00 per night might be a bargain for whoever is paying it, but not for the site owner when x-£+ of electric has been used ...

 

[ProfJohnL]

I would agree with the above, but how many times do you read of complaints re cls and ocupation numbers. CC members are very quick to complain if their expectations are not meet, the CC follows all of these and will close any cl that breaks the rules. You must remember the CC makes no income from CLs. the offer them as a service to the members.

Hello David,
Not quite true,
The CC along with other certifying bodies charge the site to complete the certification process, and for access to the sites directory. The organisation has to cover the costs of their inspectors somehow.

 

[DavidO]

John
We have had our CL now some 12 yearsand appart from my CC membership have paid nothing for the CL. However we do subscibe to the 5van,co site, and we do have to meet the requirements of the CC

 

[Shirker]

Sixteen closing is only half of the equation really, how many new ones opened in the same period to give the true loss or gain?

 

[Dustydog]

Sixteen closing is only half of the equation really, how many new ones opened in the same period to give the true loss or gain?

Five. Net loss Eleven.

 

[colin-yorkshire1]

hi all,
while we have been members of the CC a few years it is only last year that we started to use some of the CL's in order to try and keep the cost down, and in all used 6 while we were away because of their very nature CL's vary by a large ammount some are very good others not so. not all in fact only 3 that we used had EHU's and only 2 had showers and only one site that we used had both.
this one charged us £12 a night and while this CL was brilliant from the location and condition point of view it did have 8 vans on it at one point during the w/end, allthough our experience of CL's is very limited I would doubt that the cost of electricity is the major factor in CL's closing down it is probably more due to running costs location and standards.
I know many members on here rave about little gems they have found and use regulary and in general most are quite cheap in comparison to other club sites and while a pitch in someones back garden with a tap and elsan point may be thier idea of heaven it's not mine.
while it is sad indeed that some CL's close each year to the majority of caravanners it will go by un-noticed as they are a under used resource of varying standards not suited to the majority of club members.

 

[RogerL]

while it is sad indeed that some CL's close each year to the majority of caravanners it will go by un-noticed as they are a under used resource of varying standards not suited to the majority of club members.

So where do CC members go caravanning? Last time I analysed their published figures, the average member only uses club sites for about 5 nights/year (based on total club site revenue divided by number of members) - if they don't use CL's much they must be going somewhere.

 

[Lord Braykewynde]

So where do CC members go caravanning? Last time I analysed their published figures, the average member only uses club sites for about 5 nights/year (based on total club site revenue divided by number of members) - if they don't use CL's much they must be going somewhere.

So far we've only booked 8 weeks but broken down they are 1 week- CC CL, 3 weeks-CC main site and 4 weeks at the same private site in Cornwall. We are still members of the C&CC but so far haven't booked any with them so will have to consider whether to stick with them. It depends on what we plan for next year and if we think that it will give us more choice of sites we'll give it another year.

 

[DavidKlyne]

We have not really used many CL's in the 30 odd years we have been caravanning. Probably because we spend more time abroad that we do in the UK so the few times we go away in the UK we tend to use full campsites. Do we know whether the CL's that closed had electric points? If they did not then perhaps the occupancy did not justify then staying open or investing the money for extra facilities. In my view its about time the number of units allowed on a CL should be reviewed and increased to eight or ten units. That would make it much more economic for people to run CL's.

David

 

[Tony_5041742]

Although completely unscientific as a comparison, when I was caravanning with my parents back in the 70s the CC sites directory for the UK was a massive volume, which was several times bigger than the current one. I assume that the reduction in the size of the directory is largely down to the decline in the CL network. I wouldn't be at all surprised if the CL network is now only around one third or so of the size that it once was, and in that context its not hard to see a loss of 16 CL's in a month as part of an unfortunate but long term trend. Perhaps peoples expectations are now so different to what they once were, my parents used to take us to CLs all the time and all we expected was a tap somewhere so we could fill up the water supply and access to somewhere to empty the chemical loo and grey water. Providing this wasn't particularly expensive or complicated for the farmers who ran most of the CLs we used to stop on, so they were happy to accept some very modest sites fees in return. I guess now that people want facilities such as hook ups, showers etc then the cheap and cheerful CL business model doesn't work.

 

[Lord Braykewynde]

When I was caravanning with my parents back in the 70s the CC sites directory for the UK was a massive volume, which was several times bigger than the current one.

The problem back then Tony is paper wasn't invented and it was all written on slate