Warning from Spain

[RayS]

For anyone already in Spain or about to come. The Guarda Civil now use unmarked road cars, despite many assurances that they do not do so. If you are spotted the first you will know is a car behind flashing its lights and a reverse lettering red Guarda Civil sign coming down from the sunvisor position (reverse lettering so you read Guarda Civil in your mirror. The spot fine for even the most trivial offence is now 105 euros i.e. about £100 with the choice of paying or challenging which - if lost - means double the fine.

If this happens, be sure you get the second copy of the ticket and that it is signed by both the officers. Also, since they use a no-carbon paper that your copy is actually legible, since they don't seem to press very hard.

There has been a marked increase in GC road activity this year, particularly in the Andelucia / Mojacar area. It is difficult not to wonder if the falling revenue due to falling tourist numbers is not being recovered by other means.

 

[Lutz]

I'd recommend taking out a legal fees insurance, at least for the period of a holiday on the Continent, to make it easier for you to challenge what you might consider to be an unfairly imposed on-the-spot fine. Most people over here on this side of the Channel have such an insurance and therefore have no reservations about threatening legal action.

 

[Guest]

Or better still, tell the donkey rider's to shove there country by going elswhere.

 

[ScouseIan]

But what are these 'trivial offences' you speak of?

If we are towing, surely its not speeding. I myself travel at 67/68 which is an actual 61/62/63. If I got caught for 2 mph over then I would accept it. But what else is there?

I'm thinking, GB sticker?, overloaded? any others?

 

[ValA.]

No 'long vehicle plaque' (for example on the back of a bike rack), no 'yellow plaque on an outfit over 12m), or a 'we've just had a bit of a boring day and want to stop someone, and will find something wrong when we do....'!!!! Tyres a little more worn than they (the police) think they should be, perhaps - believe me if they want some money they'll find something wrong.

The problem is, how do you argue back? We were stopped in Italy, and at the end of the day there was nothing we could do but pay the outrageous fine imposed for everything from 'your car is overloaded' onwards! The more we protested the more they found wrong, and the more the fine went up and the 'tickets' kept being issued. It was amazing how good their English was at explaining our errors, but how little they understood when we tried, for instance, to explain that our car was a Citroen with hydraulic suspension, and had 'gone down' because we'd already been half an hour arguing about the level of the fine.

Believe me, with two children in the back, and two police with drawn pistols, it's a scary experience, and not one I'd want to repeat.

 

[ScouseIan]

It would make me absolutely mad.

I would have to follow this up from home. I'd get the caravan and car weighed, tyres checked independently and write to the Italian Embassy in London or the police force who issued the ticket.

I am going to Italy this year and I think I will get one of those plaques. My car is 5 metres I think and the caravan is 7.23 metres. I may prepare some papers stating the weight of car and caravan before I left. Maybe find my local public weighbridge.

What else can I guard against.

Thanks Val

Ian

 

[ValA.]

We did take it up with the Italian Embassy. I must admit this was quite a few years ago - when everything had to be done by mail. After we phoned the Embassy they asked us to put everything in writing, and unfortunately given the circumstances, we hadn't taken down the names of the details of the two policemen involved. We also contacted the police station in the local town, but needless to say no 'official' receipts had been issued - so what do you do next. The real problem is that there is absolutely nothing you can do without being fluent in the language of the intimidators!

 

[Lutz]

Maybe a case for considering a holiday in Germany. I have yet to come across anyone who had serious problems with the German police without a reasonable cause. I have always found them to take a very pragmatic approach in the case of minor offences and are generally quite friendly so long as they aren't provoked.

 

[Jennifer2]

we are supposed to be going to spain in september, I am beginning to change my mind now.

 

[ValA.]

I have to say we've been to Spain five or six times now, both towing and not, and on the toll-autoroutes and on the ordinary roads, and not had a problem with Spanish police - just Italian!

 

[RayS]

Interesting comments. My main point in posting was to advise others that GC now use unmarked cars despite many assurances to the contrary, and the very high level of on the spot fines. Since first posting I have been told of one unlucky soul who tried to argue, causing GC to go through the car for spare bulbs, hig vis jackets MoT etc. etc. and then adding up the individual fines for the non compliances found, reaching more than 1000 euros !

The main problem with any callenge - apart from the risk of increasing the penalty - is that of language. Unless you are fluent or approaching it, this is very difficult, as even a little knowledge is taken to mean you have complete understanding. It is also difficult sometimes to know what is and is not mandatory e.g. signalling a right turn when leaving a roundabout.

I guess there must be a Spanish equivalent of our own dear Highway Code but i have yet to identify it.

Oh and despite all this I have booked to return to the site next year for the 7th time - the sun is still worth it.

 

[Lutz]

The advantage of a legal aid insurance in case you wish to challenge what you consider wrongful penalty is that all you have to do is to get in touch with them and they handle everything. No need to know the language.

 

[valinspain]

Hi all

With regard to speed limits when towing in Spain, the Caravan Club Europe gives the limit as 80km per hour on motorways and 70-80km per hour on single lane open roads (not built up areas where there will be signs giving the speed limit as in the UK. 80km per hour equates to 50mph NOT 60mph.