Weighbridge worries!

[PHOENIXFLIER]

Wanting to get everything set up correctly, we loaded the caravan (Lunar Venus 320/2), as if we were going away (weight over the axle etc), and took it to the weighbridge. The plate on the caravan states MRO 763, MTPLM 905 and above that 0-100kg, 1-100kg, 2-0.
The car is rated at being ok to pull 1100kg.
Weighbridge car + van = 2100kg, Van attached 880kg, van only 960kg.
This is much heavier than I expected, especially as we are putting things like fold up bikes and small awning in the car in due course.
It also works out just above the 85% towing figure, but not by much.
Am I doing something drastically wrong?
Can any of you experts help, as I am getting into a bit of a tangle!
Thx. Simon

 

[JTQ]

Wanting to get everything set up correctly, we loaded the caravan (Lunar Venus 320/2), as if we were going away (weight over the axle etc), and took it to the weighbridge. The plate on the caravan states MRO 763, MTPLM 905 and above that 0-100kg, 1-100kg, 2-0.
The car is rated at being ok to pull 1100kg.
Weighbridge car + van = 2100kg, Van attached 880kg, van only 960kg.
This is much heavier than I expected, especially as we are putting things like fold up bikes and small awning in the car in due course.
It also works out just above the 85% towing figure, but not by much.
Am I doing something drastically wrong?
Can any of you experts help, as I am getting into a bit of a tangle!
Thx. Simon

The plate figures: "0 is the noseweight, can be up to 100 kgs", "1 is the axles capability, 1000 kgs" and "2 is the second axle, if there, but you have not got one"
Your 960 Kgs of van is over the makers MTPLM of 905 kgs. The 880 van weight coupled, suggest by 960 -880, that the difference your noseweight carried by the car is 80 kgs, within the 100 kgs allowance and a healthy figure. for towing at.
Legally you are overloaded by 55 kgs, but technically well within what the axle is able to carry. (1000kgs)

You have to shed some weight or get from the maker a MTPLM weight increased plate; some makers offer this at a cost where like in your case the kit is physically up to being a fair bit higher.

The 85% is just a weight ratio guidance figure for inexperienced towers but unqualified by other factors is a bit pointless and should be of no concern. It's rooted back decades ago when cars were fitted with rudimentary suspension, it is valid today for cars with poor towing characteristics but typically it is very conservative with modern cars, particularly those featuring short hook to rear axle over hangs.

 

[PHOENIXFLIER]

Many thanks.
As we have got hardly any additional weight in the caravan, I think it is possible that the weighbridge could have a fairly large margin for error. It is used by quarry vehicles and although the odd 50kg may not matter to them...it does to me. I have seen sets of scales that go under caravan wheels. Any other advice welcome.

 

[JTQ]

Yes, I would have little confidence in the precision of a quarry weighbridge, but it is giving a realistic value for the noseweight.
Reich do a DIY tool, a roll over scale. They do a 1000kgs and 1500kg version for those needing it. Here is a link but I know from Holland they are cheaper, but can't recall the vendor;
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Reich-Portable-Caravan-Weight-Control/dp/B00LW57Y92/ref=pd_lpo_sbs_263_t_0?_encoding=UTF8&psc=1&refRID=GZ2JGASP0X5YM48F1MVH

The other issue is the MIRO is often quoted with quite high builders tolerance, plus/minus 3 or even 5%, however, the MTPLM is specific. That tolerance can massively eat into what one might assume is the available payload, and with UK vans the payloads are typically unrealistically low to live with anyway. There being a strong marketing advantage to selling vans with low MTPLMs so more buyers cars are suitable. Totally overlooking the resultant payload is unworkable and many owners unwittingly end up illegally overloaded.

 

[PHOENIXFLIER]

Agreed. Trouble is, I worry when there is nothing to worry about! I think my way forward is to go to another weighbridge with the caravan loaded the same. Maybe put items like the solar panel (10kg), spare wheel (20kg), in the back of the car. I have also heard that there is a 20% tolerance on weighbridges anyway. As I have got next to nothing left in the caravan,how do other owners manage? I have to agree that the MTPLM is possibly set low to encourage others to tow with smaller cars and put all their possessions in a matchbox! Anyway, all in all a bit worried about being 55kg over on paper!.

 

[ProfJohnL]

You are correct that public weighbridges have to be accurate to within +/-20kg, and that is tested by trading standards. as a consequence your apparent 55kg overload could be as much as 75Kg if the weighbridge is under reading or as little as 35kg if its tolerance has gone the other way. In practice most weighbridges will be well within tolerance and nearer to +/-10Kg.

Your theoretical payload margin is 905(MTPLM) - 763(MRO) = 142Kg. But as has been mentioned the MRO is not necessarily accurate, so all you can do is be guided by the MTPLM which is an absolute maximum, and that can only be checked by weighing the caravan.

JTQ has correctly identified that based on your current weight result you are 55Kg over loaded, and you do need to loose that much from the caravan.

Its surprising how many little things we decide to take which all add up. Consider things like books magazines and maps, torches, tools, could be carried in the car. also almost everywhere in the UK you are never very far from a shop, so don't overload with food and water, just take what you need for the journey and one night, then get everything else locally at your destination. The weight of an EHU cable can be quite a lot so again carry it in the car. If you have two gas bottles, only take one, again gas can be purchased locally.

I'm certain you'll be able to slim down enough.

 

[PHOENIXFLIER]

Thanks for being so positive and some good ideas.
I will leave the reserve gas bottle behind and the hook up lead, tool box and wheel lock can go in the car. Have already saved 6kg ( cleaning kit), So with a bit of chipping away, I should be able to make it. Do others have the same problem?

 

[ProfJohnL]

The simple answer is yes they do,

Those that take care will look at the problem logically and work through it .

Others that don't are playing a game of roulette of being caught out being overloaded.

 

[Hutch]

Sorry Pheonik, its so easy to overload your van, by the time the dishes, cooking bits clothes e5c. Your150 kg which is normal on a BIG van, has all gone.
Just hve to load the car but not too much,.

 

[PHOENIXFLIER]

Luckily the Dacia has a payload of 521kg which will be more than enough. I never realised that this was such a common problem, especially for small caravan owners. Anyway, by this time tomorrow we will have got it down and book in to another weighbridge>

 

[ProfJohnL]

This is quite a common problem but not for just small caravan owners!

I do wonder how many caravans area actually overloaded but the owners do not know or care. Like others I have seen caravans pull on to site, and then over the next couple of hours masses of equipment bikes, BBQ's chairs wind breaks etc get pulled out of the caravan and assembled out side. How did they manage to get that small towns worth of gear in there?

On on occasion, that sticks in my mind from the 1980's I recall we watched what was obviously a very heavily laden VW caravelle (split screen) with roof box hauling a massive twin axle crawl onto a site. You could imagine it uttering a great sigh of relief when they stopped and unhitched. As described above the city arose around the caravan. I'm convinced it was grossly overloaded.

 

[PHOENIXFLIER]

Well, as planned we removed and weighed everything we could and believe we have now got the weight down to 903kg. Somewhere along the line the figures do not match up. Apart from the TV a few pots and pans, one gas bottle and the waste container thats it. I should have about 150kg to play with, and these items are nowhere near. I am now even more convinced that the weighbridge was wrong, and am going to take my now virtually empty caravan to a different weighbridge. The good news is that I only used up half the cars payload after removiving items from the caravan.....so its not all doom and gloom!

 

[PHOENIXFLIER]

Well, as planned we removed and weighed everything we could and believe we have now got the weight down to 903kg. Somewhere along the line the figures do not match up. Apart from the TV a few pots and pans, one gas bottle and the waste container thats it. I should have about 150kg to play with, and these items are nowhere near. I am now even more convinced that the weighbridge was wrong, and am going to take my now virtually empty caravan to a different weighbridge. The good news is that I only used up half the cars payload after removiving items from the caravan.....so its not all doom and gloom!

 

[ProfJohnL]

I would be very surprised if a public weighbridge was as far out as you are suggesting, it is genuinely is out by the amount you suspect, you should advise the weighbridge operators, seek a full refund of their charges, and report it to trading standards. If its not a public weighbridge then the required standards do not apply, but then whats the point of having a weighbridge?

 

[pensioner]

I found reading this topic and the replies reassuring as I had similar worries when we started just a couple of years ago.
I too used a local weighbridge but the operator did say at the time that loads of less than a ton were not as accurate as the bridge was designed for heavy lorries carrying 15 to 20 ton loads.
What did surprise me more was the reaction on campsites when talking to other owners, some gave me a funny look and said "why" others said they just didn't bother, and similar to ProfJohnL, I've seen units turn up on site and the amount of gear unloaded is just unbelievable.

 

[Dodger524]

I brought a Reich caravan scale from Obelink in order to check the weight of my caravan. It is quite easy to use although you have to find a hard and level surface to do so.

 

[PHOENIXFLIER]

Interesting replies. My plan is to ask the local caravan dealers (Marquis), if they can recommend a good weighbridge. If they are cannot, then I will probably shell out on a Reich at over £200, as I am determined to get this right!

 

[camel]

I think you will find that a Public weighbridge or any weighbridge would be reading zero before you actually pulled on the weighbridge , people who operate a weighbridge have to be licensed, I think any LGV Driver would be very miffed off if he was given an inaccurate weight, I weighed my outfit the other week without cause for concern,

 

[PHOENIXFLIER]

You are probably correct, but I just cannot understand how / why my caravan which is supposed to be a lightweight has transformed into such a lardy when there is next to nothing in it!.

 

[camel]

If you are concerned about the weighbridge you are using phone your local council or look on their web site and you should find a list of 'Public weighbridges',

 

[ProfJohnL]

You are probably correct, but I just cannot understand how / why my caravan which is supposed to be a lightweight has transformed into such a lardy when there is next to nothing in it!.

As we have suggested before, the MRO of almost all vehicles including caravans, is usually more of a guess than a dead cert. The MRO is the caravan in its barest form as supplied for the manufacturers factory. Everything the dealer or you adds compromises the loading margin. That includes things like gas bottles and battery are not part of the MRO.

 

[PHOENIXFLIER]

In that case, there must be an awful lot of overloaded caravans on the road!.

 

[WoodlandsCamper]

Does your van have a motor mover? If so that's about 40 kg of your payload.

See thread here when I went to the weighbridge.

 

[ProfJohnL]

In that case, there must be an awful lot of overloaded caravans on the road!.

There is strong possibility they're many overweight caravan outfits, but the lack of weighing facilities is not a lawful excuse.

 

[Raywood]

Part of the problem is the manufacturers quote the weight as plus or minus 10% which is a large margin if you have a heavy caravan and can mean some may have very little loading tollerance. I cannot say I have heard of one under the quoted weight although no one would normally complain about that but you do hear of several over the quoted weight.