Air conditioning

[Sparky214]

Hi,
Recently installed dometic fj2200 to our bailey Pegasus rimini. Just removed the kitchen heki and dropped it in. Will let you know if it performs ok in the south of france in September !!

 

[otherclive]

Can you let us know the site and dates, then we can go elsewhere for some peace and quite .
Hope you get enough site amps too!

 

[Sparky214]

Hi Otherclive,
The unit is very quiet and the soft start enables current draw of around 5 amps so most sites should cover that. Maybe you should look into getting one ??

 

[otherclive]

Hi Otherclive,
The unit is very quiet and the soft start enables current draw of around 5 amps so most sites should cover that. Maybe you should look into getting one ??

Why?

 

[Hutch]

Because two 12 inch fans and damp towels are not enough. Enjoy it, I tend to find an airconditioned bar.

 

[ProfJohnL]

Hi Otherclive,
The unit is very quiet and the soft start enables current draw of around 5 amps so most sites should cover that. Maybe you should look into getting one ??

Hello Sparky
The choice of fitting an A/C unit is of course up to you, and I'm sure you'll have fun using it. But there is a serious side to Otherclives comment. I have yet to hear a totally unobtrusive compressor driven A/C unit. And whilst you might be happy with the sound it produces because you know the job it's doing, others around you may not perceive it in the same way.

Caravans are not good at containing noise, and in some cases they can amplify a vibration. So please be considerate about when and how you use it.

 

[Sparky214]

We appreciate that but caravans have come on a bit and are quite well insulated. We were surprised how quiet it was and even slows down during night time operation to really quiet. Of course once the temperature has been achieved the compressor does not come on. Will of course be considerate to others but cannot bear to be cooked inside our nice caravan !!

 

[otherclive]

Whilst my comment was made TIC it was based on a previous experience that I had I France. I had fitted a small computer cooling fan behind the fridge in order to aid airflow on the hotter area. It was thermostatically controlled but late one evening there was a knock on the caravan door when my neighbour asked me to turn off the fan. They had got their windows open as the weather was warm even late at night. Even though the fridge was not running so much as during the day the intermittent operation of a small computer cooling fan clearly disturbed them. Yet it was “inaudible” to us. But I’ve been used to sleeping in conditions wherevvent fans run continuously and people are working 24/7 around me.

 

[VicMallows]

I am particularly concerned with the growing popularity of 'split' A/C units for caravans and motorhomes (where the compressor unit sits outside the 'van and only the evaporator unit is inside.

As anyone who have lived with permanently installed A/C in a house knows, the internal unit makes no more noise than an electric blower heater, whilst the external unit makes considerable noise. The problem is that this will further insulate the 'owner' from the noise. In some cases this may make them even more oblivious to the nuisance they are causing to others.

 

[Dustydog]

32kgs mounted on the roof raises my eyebrows. An erosion of my payload. :woohoo:
And will such a heavy high weight adversely affect the caravans stability.
Even Dometic in their literature warn about noise intrusion and being considerate. But they don’t quote the decibels hmy:

 

[otherclive]

32kgs mounted on the roof raises my eyebrows. An erosion of my payload. :woohoo:
And will such a heavy high weight adversely affect the caravans stability.
Even Dometic in their literature warn about noise intrusion and being considerate. But they don’t quote the decibels hmy:

32kg for air con, 35kg for mover, 22kg for battery, 10 kg for one Calorlite 99 kg of payload used up. Given a lot of vans sometimes have less than 150 kg there isn’t much left. Need to get a Transit van or a Hobby/Hymer.

 

[Sparky214]

Sorry to hear of your bad experience. This does not stop people having mobile ac units in their caravan with hoses coming out of windows. Pretty sure someone is not going to be happy, maybe all caravans with ac need to be placed away from everyone else ?

 

[Sparky214]

Hi Dustydog,
New to all this so really appreciate all the concerns. We do have motormover,ac unit and battery but no solar panel. The caravan is a bailey Pegasus rimini and the car is a vw tiguan. We are concerned about the weight issue but think that we are ok. Anyone think to the contrary please say. Tony

 

[otherclive]

Hi Dustydog,
New to all this so really appreciate all the concerns. We do have motormover,ac unit and battery but no solar panel. The caravan is a bailey Pegasus rimini and the car is a vw tiguan. We are concerned about the weight issue but think that we are ok. Anyone think to the contrary please say. Tony

The only real way in which you can be assured on weights is to take your laden van and car to a weighbridge. It’s neigh on impossible to advise you if you are okay as no one except yourself knows what goes into your outfit. What I do know is that you have to be very disciplined on stuff that you take and it’s surprising how it mounts up. One recent poster a very experienced caravanner took his outfit for weighing and from memory I think he was 35kg over and then stripped out something like 55kg!

 

[Sparky214]

Ok, will have to find a local weighbridge. Bought a nose weight gauge so at least will get that about right. Thanks for the advice.

 

[Dustydog]

Ok, will have to find a local weighbridge. Bought a nose weight gauge so at least will get that about right. Thanks for the advice.

What type is it?

 

[Sparky214]

Milenco I think

 

[Hutch]

Hi Dustydog,
New to all this so really appreciate all the concerns. We do have motormover,ac unit and battery but no solar panel. The caravan is a bailey Pegasus rimini and the car is a vw tiguan. We are concerned about the weight issue but think that we are ok. Anyone think to the contrary please say. Tony

The only real way in which you can be assured on weights is to take your laden van and car to a weighbridge. It’s neigh on impossible to advise you if you are okay as no one except yourself knows what goes into your outfit. What I do know is that you have to be very disciplined on stuff that you take and it’s surprising how it mounts up. One recent poster a very experienced caravanner took his outfit for weighing and from memory I think he was 35kg over and then stripped out something like 55kg!

I think that may have been myself. I removed all the none essential items, ie, the spare blue and pink chemicals the two extra chairs, for outside guests, the spare disposable BBQ , in case the Cadac failed then I couldn't get enough nose weight. :woohoo: when we done our last 6 week trip to the south of France the AC unit would have been lovely but we stay in smaller sites with maybe 10 amp power, and the thought of really watching everything you put on load. And when taking everything else with you, the weight really loads up. Rethink and just take care . Enjoy.

 

[ProfJohnL]

32kgs mounted on the roof raises my eyebrows. An erosion of my payload. :woohoo:
And will such a heavy high weight adversely affect the caravans stability.

Hello Dusty,
The simple answer is yes!" It does affect stability. in much the same way as end loading,It increases the vertical moment of inertia. Whether it will degrade the stability to the point where it the outfit become unstable is dependant on a lot of other factors, the most significant being speed, and driving style, all of which are down to the driver.

 

[Icaru5]

32kgs mounted on the roof raises my eyebrows. An erosion of my payload. :woohoo:
And will such a heavy high weight adversely affect the caravans stability.

Hello Dusty,
The simple answer is yes!" It does affect stability. in much the same way as end loading,It increases the vertical moment of inertia. Whether it will degrade the stability to the point where it the outfit become unstable is dependant on a lot of other factors, the most significant being speed, and driving style, all of which are down to the driver.

As Prof correctly says the simple answer is yes, particularly when mounted at such a height, although there really isn’t any such thing as “vertical moment of inertia” to which Prof refers, as by definition, the directional component of a moment of inertia must be represented by an angle, and not a linear dimension, since a moment of force is axial, but I do understand what he is trying to say; Being at mounted at such a height, when considering roll, the force applied by the weight of the AC unit is acting at a considerable distance from the fulcrum, and so its effect will be substantial.

Being aware of just how flimsy the roof of my caravan is, I would be equally concerned about the additional forces that this would put on the roof structure and surrounding joints.

 

[Craigyoung]

Our friends we were thinking about buying one , they were going to go for the roof mounted one but were advised not to as it would not take it. So they have since bought a one one that goes or attaches to their window like a filtration system and is quite small but does the same kind of job . Have a look at the truma website I think for different air con ideas .

Craig

 

[Dustydog]

Our friends we were thinking about buying one , they were going to go for the roof mounted one but were advised not to as it would not take it. So they have since bought a one one that goes or attaches to their window like a filtration system and is quite small but does the same kind of job . Have a look at the truma website I think for different air con ideas .

Craig

What intrigues me Craig is that even Truma do not quote the decibel rating. They do say when in sleep mode it is quiet :silly:
Night time tends to carry the sound. Other Clive summed it up very well earlier on. I don’t think I ‘d like to be sleeping next to a single harmonic hum

 

[Craigyoung]

Loads off different versions

https://www.coolmycamper.com/

 

[ProfJohnL]

Decibel ratings omitted form specifications, for equipment like this sets alarm bells rings. But in practice even if the manufacturers were to quote values, they wold be almost meaningless unless the product is totally silent.

Just consider the appliance manufacturer has no way of knowing how many different wall or roof constructions the product may be used in, and how its mounted will affect how much noise is emitted from the device and its supporting structure, becasue its will work just like musical instrument sound box, and in some installations the small amount of vibration these units inevitably produce will be just right to excite the body into vibrating and thus amplifying it's noise. Some on board water pumps are perfect example of this, they can be heard across a caravan site!

For consistency the measurement of the sound pressure would almost certainly be carried out in an acoustic chamber, which bears no relationship to a caravan, so the measurement wold only allow a comparison between units, and not represent the reality of a real installation.

But I also come back to the effectiveness of AC units in caravans. The power available to drive them is limited and when you look at what its trying to do, and compare it to the AC in a car the it begins to show the difficulty it is facing.

The maximum driving power available in a caravan is about 3kW, and that is expected to deal with a whole caravan which will have a vast surface area and volume which provides heat gain from the outside air and sun, yet the systems fitted in cars are typically rated these days between 10 and 12kW, and yet they have a much smaller surface area and volume to contend with. Even allowing for the slightly better insulation in a caravan, the power to volume of a caravan system is much smaller that that of a car, so its not going to be any where near as effective as the system in your car.

 

[otherclive]

Decibel ratings omitted form specifications, for equipment like this sets alarm bells rings. But in practice even if the manufacturers were to quote values, they wold be almost meaningless unless the product is totally silent.

Just consider the appliance manufacturer has no way of knowing how many different wall or roof constructions the product may be used in, and how its mounted will affect how much noise is emitted from the device and its supporting structure, becasue its will work just like musical instrument sound box, and in some installations the small amount of vibration these units inevitably produce will be just right to excite the body into vibrating and thus amplifying it's noise. Some on board water pumps are perfect example of this, they can be heard across a caravan site!

For consistency the measurement of the sound pressure would almost certainly be carried out in an acoustic chamber, which bears no relationship to a caravan, so the measurement wold only allow a comparison between units, and not represent the reality of a real installation.

But I also come back to the effectiveness of AC units in caravans. The power available to drive them is limited and when you look at what its trying to do, and compare it to the AC in a car the it begins to show the difficulty it is facing.

The maximum driving power available in a caravan is about 3kW, and that is expected to deal with a whole caravan which will have a vast surface area and volume which provides heat gain from the outside air and sun, yet the systems fitted in cars are typically rated these days between 10 and 12kW, and yet they have a much smaller surface area and volume to contend with. Even allowing for the slightly better insulation in a caravan, the power to volume of a caravan system is much smaller that that of a car, so its not going to be any where near as effective as the system in your car.

I have a caravan with the dreaded Flojet water pump mounted at the front of the caravan under the bed. It’s noisy and pulsates and at night we have a container of water for hand washing in order to not disturb the sleepers in the caravan, and our neighbours and the site benefit too.