Battery discharge - Senator Wyoming S5

[KiwiCaravaner]

I have a Bailey Senator Wyoming S5. I have had intermittent problems with the leisure battery going flat if off power for a few days (caravan unused). I always suspected that the fridge had been left on and the light was operating, or something similar. However, I spent some time checking the problem today with a multimeter. There is a .5 amp discharge from the battery with the fridge turned off. I then pulled every fuse out to try to isolate the problem, but still have a .5 amp discharge.
Does anyone have any ideas that can help me solve this problem?

 

[SirRogerFFS]

You could have one of several problems here so to begin with if you have a radio fitted then remove the front as the memory in the radio takes loads of power from battery.
Secondly and not knowing your caravan your alarm or tracker may drain the battery .
Thirdly if you have any other form of electrics in the van then turn them off ie power unit under beds etc .
Im sure one of these three will be you problem but start at the radio
Good Luck
Sir Roger

 

[Damian]

A 0.5a drain is normal as the fridge has a permanent 12v supply for the electronics and there will be a back feed to the PSU.
If the battery is only lasting a couple of days I would suspect the battery is failing as 0.5a should take around 150 hours to drain the battery.
The only way to stop the battery losing power is to remove the terminal connectors when not in use, but it will still self discharge over a period os time.

 

[Dustydog]

Damian
Does that power drain continue even if the fridge is switched to off and the 12 volt main power switched to off?
My Wyoming has been in storage for periods of up to 6 weeks and the battery can still work the mover ok. I would be very surprised, and very disappointed , if the battery flattened in 6 days when not in use.

 

[DeliDave_]

I've had similar problem on S6 Indiana,put Avtex tv drawing 1.25Amp on and it lasted about 2hrs on 110 A battery.Have replaced with Elecsol battery which is lower and am looking at fitting a disconnecting terminal like this http://www.ahead4healeys.co.uk/BATTERY-CLAMP---BRASS--ISOLATOR-SWITCH--id1792.html to save having to clip/unclip leads.But as stated it should last a good while on minimum drain but fridge ,alarm tracker etc take their toll.I understand that if battery id discharged below 10volts it gets damaged and according to Elecsol,no longer warranted although how thay check this I dont know.My old battery had got down to 8 volts,have fitted a digital 0-20 volt meter to keep an eye on solar panel.

 

[Damian]

In reply to Dustydog, it all depends on how the system has been set up.
Earlier models do not shut down everything and this is where problems arise.
It also depends which make of units are installed as some do not have total isolation but that has ben addressed in later models.
Lots of other things can also affect battery life, very cold temperatures and very hot temperatures as you know.
Lastly there is the actual components used inside the battery and the cheapness of manufacture, correct electroyte strength etc etc.

 

[ChrisUK]

Its odd and concerning that you have a .5a drain even with the fuses removed. This is saying that you have an unprotected feed to something. Are you sure you have found all the fuses? I would also say check the radio, mine take .5 amps on standby. My alarm only takes about 10mA.
I bought from Maplins for just under £10 a device that plugs into a fuse holder to measure current, I find this very useful, also useful for measuring the current supplied by my solar panel.
My Elddis has a simple isolator switch on the control panel which takes off all supplies except the alarm.

http://www.maplin.co.uk/automotive-current-tester-217879

 

[Beehpee]

Depending on how old your caravan is, if you have the factory fitted tracker it will be drawing either 1 to 2 milliamps or around 15 milliamps, depending on which model of tracker you have, if you have .5 amp drain then you still have another 485 miliamps being drawn from the battery by something else whether that is by one or more items you will only find out by disconnecting and measuring the drain each time you have disconnected something, how good is your multi meter and I assume it does actually measure in milliamps as I have seen some cheap meters that don't and your only going to get a totally accurate reading if it's set to milliamps, even then the manufacturer will probably specify a plus or minus 10% accuracy in the reading which could account for another 50 m/amps.

 

[xtrailman]

Depending on how old your caravan is, if you have the factory fitted tracker it will be drawing either 1 to 2 milliamps or around 15 milliamps, depending on which model of tracker you have, if you have .5 amp drain then you still have another 485 miliamps being drawn from the battery by something else whether that is by one or more items you will only find out by disconnecting and measuring the drain each time you have disconnected something, how good is your multi meter and I assume it does actually measure in milliamps as I have seen some cheap meters that don't and your only going to get a totally accurate reading if it's set to milliamps, even then the manufacturer will probably specify a plus or minus 10% accuracy in the reading which could account for another 50 m/amps.

My immediate thoughts on reading the OP, was the same, a drain from the tracker.

I would locate the tracker and try to isolate it, they could be a fuse adjacent.

 

[Beehpee]

If the battery has a current draw of either 1 to 2 or let's say it's the earlier version drawing 15 milliamps and the battery has a drain of 500 milliamps why would you say isolate the tracker?

 

[xtrailman]

If the battery has a current draw of either 1 to 2 or let's say it's the earlier version drawing 15 milliamps and the battery has a drain of 500 milliamps why would you say isolate the tracker?

To locate the source of the discharge?

 

[ChrisUK]

Are you measuring this .5 Amp discharge at the battery terminals with a mulimeter? I presume you are.

 

[Beehpee]

When measuring current draw you can't measure it at the battery terminals, and I mean this in the word terminals being plural, you can only do it at the one terminal, I think things are as is often the case, being made more complicated than they actually need to be, as someone has said earlier if you have a .5 amp discharge which you have measured correctly at one of the battery terminals then if you have an 85 amp hour battery in good condition it should take in a perfect world 170 hours to discharge, as we don't live in a perfect world if you were to only get 120 hours giving you around a 33% drop because of temperature, age of battery and any other factors that are going to influence the discharge your battery should still last 120 hours or 5 days, I think it's quite safe to therefore be fairly certain that you have a knackered battery, if it's going flat after a couple of day with a discharge of 500 milliamps then your battery is something like 25% as efficient as it should be, ok 500 ma might be more than it should have as current drain but none the less it's pretty safe to say your battery needs replacing, if you have a 110 amp hour battey then obviously it's in even a worse condition because with the same discharge on a healthy battery you are looking at it lasting around 9 days, if you still want to find the 500 ma discharge then I think you should start by looking for some thing drawing more than the 15 ma your tracker is pulling out.

 

[Beehpee]

Another thing I meant to mention was removing the radio front will make no difference either as the radio memory is still retained even with the front panel removed.

 

[ChrisUK]

"When measuring current draw you can't measure it at the battery terminals, and I mean this in the word terminals being plural, you can only do it at the one terminal"
Excuse my grammer, you can measure current drain at "either" terminal.

 

[Beehpee]

Lol I know I just wanted to make sure it was being done right and can be done at either singly but not at same time, wasn't being funny just thought things starting to get a little confusing unless the OP is fully aware of how it's done, it's like always on here if the original person isn't as competent as the people who are doing the answering they can sometimes be more confused than before they asked the original question.

 

[Dustydog]

If the battery has a current draw of either 1 to 2 or let's say it's the earlier version drawing 15 milliamps and the battery has a drain of 500 milliamps why would you say isolate the tracker?

To locate the source of the discharge?

I thought the Tracker had its own dedicated power supply so it shouldn't affect the leisure battery

Sorry if I have that wrong but it seems an essential fail safe to use its own supply for obvious reasons.

 

[Beehpee]

It does have own supply but indirectly depending on circumstances it can affect the leisure battery, I don't think it's best thing for me to go into every detail in an open forum as to how it's supplied tho, but the figures I quoted are what it will drain from the leisure battery in worst case scenario.

 

[xtrailman]

If the battery has a current draw of either 1 to 2 or let's say it's the earlier version drawing 15 milliamps and the battery has a drain of 500 milliamps why would you say isolate the tracker?

To locate the source of the discharge?

My understanding is that the tracker has two back up power sources, as one is a rechargeable battery i assume it gets its own secret supply, which has to be from the leisure battery?
As the dealer service men get tracker training, its location isn't a secret, i know were mine is on the Valencia.
RAY

I thought the Tracker had its own dedicated power supply so it shouldn't affect the leisure battery

Sorry if I have that wrong but it seems an essential fail safe to use its own supply for obvious reasons.

 

[Beehpee]

I think I will give it a miss discussing how or when and why a tracker will have an effect on the leisure battery, I can give you certain facts tho, the figures I quoted as to a trackers effect on a leisure battery are totally accurate, the tracker does have it's own supply tho you are correct on that point and is not reliant on the leisure battery.

 

[ChrisUK]

OK mines an Elddis and it is an alarm not a Tracker, but I would imagine the circuit to be the same. The handbook shows a 5amp fuse feeding the alarm which I believe keeps a small rechargable battery in the alarm charged. So once the alarm battery discharges the caravan battery will also discharge. However on my alarm this is only about 10mA.

 

[KiwiCaravaner]

Thanks to everyone for their ideas and suggestions. I think I will be busy this weekend trying them all out. I'm certainly leaning towards the suggestions that the battery is failing. It's four year old 110AH battery.

 

[Beehpee]

Hi Kiwi, what part of the uk are you in? Assuming your not in NZ!

 

[xtrailman]

I am still using a 7 year old cheap battery.
While ever its showing 12.6 volts, and operating the mover, i don't see a reason to change it.
Have you checked the electrolyte level?