BMW X5 or Landcruiser LC5

[Brum1]

Hi everyone, Just been talking over the pros and cons of these two tow cars.
The air suspension on the Toyota is very tempting but also the BMW is appealing.
What views or experience can anyone share?

Thanks.

 

[Martin24]

Probably upset people but do you really want the image that goes with the BMW. Landcruiser would be my choice out of those two!

 

[seth1]

Which would be what Martin24?
3.0litre diesel.
240hp/390lbs ft of torque.
4 wheel drive.
3500kg tow wieght.
I would presume everything a towcar should be primarily.
And?

 

[OmOnWeelz]

Could somebody tell me what the BMW image is please.
We think the new spec X5 is currently top of our list to replace the dreaded Discovery 4.
If you're just towing and on the odd patch of grass and not off roading with your caravan the X5 is the car as far as we're concerned, iI's a quick road car and fun to drive and has great flickability for a large car, nothing much wrong with Toyota's apart from a raft of recalls for the brand.
Whatever the beeemer image is, I don't really care, getting away from the image of LR dealerships is all we need. Beemer Diesel is brilliant and low on emmisions, good 34mpg plus solo and goes like off a shovel with bags of grunt for towing or a quick sprint down the autobahn that will leave the thirstier Toyota back in another county.

 

[seth1]

someone will be along soon to tell us,im stumped as well thinking what it is.

 

[MichaelE]

The cars are like chalk and cheese,it depends what type you want and what driving you do?
We test drove lots of 4X4's when we bought this year,the new X5 is really great and it is as close to a normal car handling wise as you can get and it is the benchmark,they tow very well with a powerful and very very quiet diesel.£200 road tax and 5 year servicing for around £500 is excellent too.You wont be able to go mud plugging but it will get you off a muddy field,tyres are on road biased so this doesnt help the cause really.
The LC5 is still the traditional 4X4,it isnt in the same handling league as the X5 and no matter what the salemen says it rolls in the bends , engine very gruff but will tow all day.Would put in the Shogun league.
Build quality is very good on both and both are roughly the same price.And both have stacks of kit,even the BMW does now!
The BMW looks quite aggressive which maybe some people dont like,i think the image comes from people who have never owned one,? so maybe a hint of the greened eyed monster? ok indicators are an optional extra lol.
In the end its your choice i would have had an X5 but BMW's leasing plans are just plan silly so bought another ML which runs the X5 very close.

 

[Dustydog]

Brum
If you go for the Beemer make sure it comes with the extra engine cooling system specifically required if the car is used for towing

There were a few posts on this subject a couple of months ago.

 

[RobertP]

I live mainly in the Middle East, where both cars are extremely popular and I travel in both extensively. In accordacne with other posts they are very different vehicles and both have the right albeit different type of image. I have a 5 series and would love an X5 and often have a sit in the showroom model X5 when my 5 is being serviced. The other car to consider is the Audi Q7. For long distances in the Middle East and in Europe; the BMW's offer exceptional comfort and refinement.

 

[OmOnWeelz]

Someone else seems to have been taken in by the spin doctors. If you buy a new or used X5 with factory fitted tow hitch they come with a larger capacity cooling fan. According to a BMW trouble shooter techy they do not have some large capacity rad or auto box cooler despite what some would have you believe. So no problem with factory fit tow hitch.
If you fit after market tow bar BMW could try and get out of a warrenty issue if it could be attributed to a cooling issue. And that would be pretty hard for them to prove. The larger cooling fans should bring the drive unit quicker cooling in extreme temperatures when towing. In reality even towing very heavy twin axles in 100F plus on the continent on hills friends have never had any over heating problems without the factory fit spec.
BMW techy also services his friends 180000 mile + ex demo 3.0D auto that was fitted with an after market tow bar. It has towed a heavy business trailer unit all over the UK and Europe for nearly five years and has never had a cooling problem with the standard cooling fan.

 

[Collin]

Hi Brum,
If you are looking at the BM, I agree with Michael E that the Mercedes ML is another good alternative. All big 4x4s suffered excrutiating depreciation after the lashing not so long ago by the Ken Livingstone brigade, and if you are buying second hand you can get a lot of car for quite a good price.
I opted for the ML four years ago (at the time Autocar for one reckoned it bettered the then X5 and nowhere could I find a negative criticism of it). I have just reluctantly traded it in to a Mercedes main dealer following the sale of my Fleetwood Heritage 560 (only towed it about 10 times!).
I would have loved to have seen my ML go to a caravanner as it had a factory fitted towbar and towed effortlessly with its three litre diesel and seven speed gearbox. It was immaculate with just about every extra you could imagine. Only done 34,000 miles and never been off road.
Expect it will be turning up soon on Merc’s Approved Used car programme. Somebody will be getting a damn good car for around the £20k mark, with a two year MB guarantee to boot!
Anyway, the ML was all I ever wanted in a tow car. Huge kerb weight meant it could handle just about anything. Not an off roader in the sense of a Land Rover, but then again it was a smooth vehicle solo and it did stay on the road all of the time, only needing garages for fuel and routine servicing!

 

[Dustydog]

Someone else seems to have been taken in by the spin doctors. If you buy a new or used X5 with factory fitted tow hitch they come with a larger capacity cooling fan. According to a BMW trouble shooter techy they do not have some large capacity rad or auto box cooler despite what some would have you believe. So no problem with factory fit tow hitch.
If you fit after market tow bar BMW could try and get out of a warrenty issue if it could be attributed to a cooling issue. And that would be pretty hard for them to prove. The larger cooling fans should bring the drive unit quicker cooling in extreme temperatures when towing. In reality even towing very heavy twin axles in 100F plus on the continent on hills friends have never had any over heating problems without the factory fit spec.
BMW techy also services his friends 180000 mile + ex demo 3.0D auto that was fitted with an after market tow bar. It has towed a heavy business trailer unit all over the UK and Europe for nearly five years and has never had a cooling problem with the standard cooling fan.

It's nothing to do with spin doctors moreso technical facts that a prospective X5 purchaser should be aware of. This subject has featured in a number of magazines and web sites. It is noteworthy that the "towing" fan retrofitted is £700.00 including fitting I believe.
http://www.caravantalk.org.uk/topic/31970-bmw-x5/
One for BMW or the Engineering experts to explain.

 

[OmOnWeelz]

Very SORRY Dustydog but your posts are a little misleading.
When you buy a new X5 with optional tow bar from BMW the cooling fan upgrade is added at NO extra cost. If you buy a second hand X5 that was purchased with a factory fit tow hitch the cooling fan upgrade was also a standard NO extra cost addition.
If you want to retro fit a tow bar to an X5 you then would pay extra if you wanted to have BMW fit an upgraded fan. £700 from a main dealer at todays hourly rates is probably pretty reasonable if you look under the bonnet of an X5 and look at what needs removing before you can get to the fan, some dealers wanting to sell a used X5 would proabably swallow a fair bit of the cost according Beemer my mate.
Following your link Dustdog a number of the posts also say that there have been no problems when towing without the uprated fan. If anyone is buying an X5 outside the BMW warranty period aand retro fitting a to bar an additional cooling fan from Kenlowe could do the same job at a fraction of £700 if cooling was an issue.
Dealer quoted £285 for a cooling towing uprade for a Volvo, that was 15 years ago so £700 isn't bad today. Cooling upgrade covers BMW for all markets and extreme heat.

 

[MichaelE]

There has been stories not of over heating but of the cost and recommendation, i think you will find that BMW charge £1200 to fit a towbar plus upgrade the fan, they will not fit the towbar without the fan upgrade,whereas a standard towbar fitter will as all his warranty insurance will cover is the towbar, so if over heating does occur then its not his problem.
As BMW make the cars and would not recommend the fan upgrade without a reason i would suggest that it is valid?

The Q7 is too long and too wide with a shallow boot, and also still has tyre issues

 

[OmOnWeelz]

NO
BMW charge £895 for factory fit "fully electric" towar and the towing upgrade is automatically fitted at no extra charge!

This is a really simple subject, if you order a new X5 with a tow bar there is no issue as the upgrade is done part of the package. if you buy second hand X5 that had a factory fit tow bar the coolling fan upgrade was done.
The only issue comes with retro fit tow bar. Is there something hard to understand about that? if so please tell me as I have a quote for a new X5 and we test drove a BMW staff car that will be up for sale, it comes with factory fit tow bar and that means it has the 'towing' upgrade.

 

[otherclive]

As others have said they are two totally different cars and much depends on what your usage plans are. One thing that always strikes me is that when you see 4x4s in Africa, Asia or anywhere else in the world the UN, Red Cross, etc and Taliban always seem to drive Landcruisers or Hilux/Surfs, which may say something about Toyotas ruggedness and reliabilty.

 

[OmOnWeelz]

Never seen Red Cross with an awning up BBQ smoking or towing a new Swift on East African rough roads. May be Americans and British should be looking for an Amazon towing a Sterling Elite on route to Jalaabad instead of caves when on the hunt for Osama BinLiner

 

[MichaelE]

Correct it is a really simple subject.
We are talking about fitting a towbar to a car that hasnt got one!!!
A factory fiited and dealer fitted towbar will come with the upgraded fan.
This was investigated by the CC when a reader wrote in to query BMW's desision about retro-fitting one and couldnt understand why he was told he needed an upgraded fan
I can only go on my own experience when i was looking at an X5 this year,they had a model in stock and quoted me £1296.26p to fit one as it didnt have one already fitted.
Now if you bought a secondhand car that didnt have the upgraded fan ie towbar not installed by BMW then if resold by a BMW dealer they would be obliged to upgrade the fan before they resold it.

 

[seth1]

There's no denying Landcruisers are reliable,they should be they,ve been around long enough.They are very industrially built.At one time it seemed they gave exceptional power compared to everything else,which they did and still do.But things have moved on and the Japs although reliable do seem to lag a little bit.Perhaps detuned for said reliability sending them around the world?Yes there is problems with BMW'S 3.0 litre diesel,which one of them is well documented and causes extreme damage and usually renders the unit scrap but I know were i'd rather be sat.

 

[MichaelE]

Not heard of any issues with the BMW 3.0 lt, yes the 2.0lt had some isolated problems about 4 years ago.

 

[seth1]

Out of interest which isolated problems have you heard of,could be the same never know?

 

[MichaelE]

I believe it was an issue with the inlet manifold that had a few failures.

 

[Dustydog]

Very SORRY Dustydog but your posts are a little misleading.

By your own admission all that has been said is factual. On a public forum theOP has an expectation that fellow members will highlight any "peculiarities" that may exist.The X5 cooling issue is one of those peculiarities. That's all.

 

[OmOnWeelz]

SORRY again Dustydog but.
Again you post something that is akin to scaremongering : "The X5 cooling issue" What cooling issue? The car comes with larger fan for quicker cooling when a factory fit tow bar was specified and at no cost.
As your own link showed, there appears to be little evidence of any over heating issues with X5 with retro fitted tow bars and no fan upgrade. When towing a number of issues can arise with any brand of car. Auto gearbox cooling has been a long term issue, suspensions, gear box and clutch, dual mass flywheel, and then there are concerns over towing with the new double clutch style auto box's.
I've been driving 3litre 3 and 5 series BMW's solo for a long time, the 3 litre inline BMW engine is rated as one of the best in the world. On the X5 there were a few problems with cracking exhaust manifolds some time back, those were addressed a while back and the engine gets a revison upgrade version in 2011 as Tri-turbo with 700nm of torque and about 345hp. If there was truly and engine weakness a completely new engine would be the long term cheaper option for BMW.
Used X5 can offer well speced comfortable tow car option and there are quite a lot of people who choose to go that route and with retro fit tow hitches not many seem to bother with cooling fan upgrade nor are there legions of reports of X5's overheating.

For anyone contemplating an older used X5 that hasn't got a tow bar or upgraded cooling fan, there is a good chance they will be going to Towsure or an after market fitter rather than pay Beemer dealer top $, after market additional cooling fan (if they feel it is needed) will cost less than others pay for suspension upgrades on family saloon tow cars.

Re: MichealE, Dealer out of order if it was a NEW car, I was quoted £1095 just for Mercedes Tow hitch and wiring 4 years ago.

 

[MichaelE]

Im confused now ? what has a Mercedes towbar got to do with it?
The quote was to fit a towbar and the larger cooling fan which BMW say must be fitted, they would not fit the towbar without it.

 

[Dustydog]

SORRY again Dustydog but.
Again you post something that is akin to scaremongering : For anyone contemplating an older used X5 that hasn't got a tow bar or upgraded cooling fan, there is a good chance they will be going to Towsure or an after market fitter rather than pay Beemer dealer top $, after market additional cooling fan (if they feel it is needed) will cost less than others pay for suspension upgrades on family saloon tow cars.

e: MichealE, Dealer out of order if it was a NEW car, I was quoted £1095 just for Mercedes Tow hitch and wiring 4 years ago.

Woof woof

. I suspect you must be on BMW's payroll

.Th eonly scaremongering is that of BMW themselves. It is a material fact a BMW designed alteration is required on the cooling system if towing is envisaged. That's fact not fiction

Personally I have no comment on the X5 itself.
The answer is simple . Are you prepared to publicly underwrite the replacement cost of an engine failure, where the new owner has ignored BMW's advice and followed yours?