Carver Cascade MK1 Controller

[shmbry]

Hello

Does anyone know if a cascade MK2 controller can be used on a MK1 cascade?
I have refurbished my MK1 but it will not run. I have a 10.8 volt supply and water and gas connected. I have checked the continuity of the 6 core cable and all is ok. The original heater had a controller with a rocker on/off switch 3 led lights and a rotary knob. The heater I have bought and refurbished has a controller which has a sliding on/off switch 1 led and a rotary knob. Neither controller lights up nor the heater will not light. Also I cannot hear the solenoid or the spark generator.

As MK1 controllers seem scarce, are it possible to use one from a MK2, is there any difference between them?

Any advice would be welcome.
Read more at http://www.practicalcaravan.com/forum/new-members-say-hello/49473-carver-cascade-mk1-controller#6A9Fzc3lSUJsym5r.99

 

[Damian]

With a 10.8v supply it will not work anyway, they must have a minimum of 12v

 

[ProfJohnL]

Hello shmbry,

The Cascade 1 and Casade 2 heaters are entirely different, and I think you may be somewhat confused based on what you have written.

As Damain points out 10.8V is not what they expect . They need a full 12Vdc to operate reliably. If you only have 10.8. then it suggests you battery either needs charging or has expired.

The Cascade (1) heater (1979 to 1984) has a mushroom shaped copper tank which sits above the floor, and the burner assembly sits below the floor. All the control circuitry is in the wall switch, which on the earliest models (1979 to about 1982) was a white square switch plate with three LEDs, on/off switch and rotary temperature control. There was a second version of the controller (1982 to 1984) in a beige rectangular box, with a single LED. Both versions should be compatible with the heater. A visually similar controller was used for the Carver Caravelle 4 heater. The Caravaelle controller is not compatible with a Cascade.

The Cascade 2 uses a horizontally mounted fire extinguisher shaped tank, and the heater fits through the side wall of the caravan. All the logic control circuitry is contained in the Burner control module which sits under the tank. The C2 wall switch is basically just that a switch with fuses and a low voltage sensor in a beige rectangular box.
Later versions of the C2 ( known as the Rapide) used a square panel switch with push buttons. Neither of the C2 controllers are compatible with the Cascade 1

Refurbishing Cascade 1's
The youngest Cascade 1 (1984) will be 30 years old, For reasons of safety unless you have specialist knowledge of the heater it is not wise to attempt to refurbish them. The heater has a number of safety devices which if they are not properly assembled or maintained, the heater will not function properly. The failure to operate could also be due to a number of safety devices having been tripped. There is usually a good reason for the safety devices to operate and that should be taken as a warning of something seriously amiss with the appliance.

With such an old appliance there are several parts that will have significantly deteriorated and unless you have access to OEM parts repairs should not be attempted. Very few parts are available so in most cases these days repairs are simply not possible.

Very few spare parts will be available. The burner bar and furnace box are most subject to corrosion as they are under the caravan, and a doubt any of these parts are available. The heat exchanger is pretty unique and relies on a two stage vapour transfer heat pipe. If this has failed then the heater will not heat water and will constantly trip out on its over-heat stat. The water connections and NRV being plastic will deteriorate, and on older products do fail.

As a general note you should only work on caravan gas appliances if you are competent to do so,and have access to all the regulatory test equipment to confirm the safe operation of gas systems. Generally this not something a DIY owner would not have access to or knowledge of.

 

[gary]

OP says neither switch is showing any lights so although 10.8v is not enough to run the heater, it certainly is to show a green LED light?!
First then, is this 10.8v reaching the switch?

Unsurprisingly I otherwise find myself in nearly full agreement with John, only disagreeing with availability of spares, plenty of new bits still available... if you know who's got them and although surely unaware, I'm equally sure you know the brothers well John??!!

 

[shmbry]

Many thanks for the replies John & Gary.

I did not find any major problems in refurbishing the MK1. Luckily they used brass nuts. I replaced the main & temp sensor 'O' rings. The burner box is in good condition. Some dirt in the gas filter which I cleaned out. The solenoid is in very good order and working. The bi-metal heat exchanger over temp sender shows no sign of corrosion. No signs of leaks from the exchanger. Both the igniter probe & temp sensing probe are in good order. I also cleaned out some muck from the pressure relief valve and renewed the hose clamps.
The van is suffering some earth faults at the moment, and I am in the process of renewing a junction box.

I will try the heater direct off the battery and see what happens.

Gary can you send me details of the spare source you mentioned.

Many thanks

 

[ProfJohnL]

Unsurprisingly I otherwise find myself in nearly full agreement with John, only disagreeing with availability of spares, plenty of new bits still available... if you know who's got them and although surely unaware, I'm equally sure you know the brothers well John??!!

Sorry Gary
I accept what you say about the availability of parts, but they are not generally advertised on the web. So these days I don't know where you would get them from, I do know you carry some spares, but it must be a limited range, and getting smaller.

I don't know the "brothers" you allude to, but i'm now intrigued to know who and where they are.

 

[shmbry]

I have connected the heater directly to a good battery (13 volts) but still response. an I assume the controller is the problem?

 

[gary]

It would certainly point to a control switch problem, if you like you can send it to me and I'll test it but I'm away next week so can't help till after the 16th of June

 

[shmbry]

Hello Gary
Many thanks for that, if I may I would like to send both controllers for testing. Please can you send me a PM with the address. Also with 12 volts connected can I put a test light on the solenoid, ignitor and safety devices without doing any damage?

 

[Parksy]

Hello Gary
Many thanks for that, if I may I would like to send both controllers for testing. Please can you send me a PM with the address. Also with 12 volts connected can I put a test light on the solenoid, ignitor and safety devices without doing any damage?

Unfortunately this forum doesn't have a PM system but you can contact Gary at Arc Systems