complete newbie - Hello+help with caravan weights!

[martin22]

Firtstly, just joined so hello to everyone!

Anyway i'm a complete novice with the technical sides of caravan weights so need some advice.

I'm trying to work out what the max size caravan we could use based on our current cars and also I'm not sure how much weight to add as'payload' into my calculations.

Can anyone give me an idea of the max weight to look at based on these figures for the cars? (i've put both cars down, the Berlingo is newer and nicer, but i think the A3 has a higher towing ability)

Citroen Berlingo: 1.6 diesel 115bhp
Mass in service 1624
max towing weight 1300
max laden weight 2065
Gross train weight 3065

Audi a3 2.0 diesel 140 bhp
mass in service 1503
max towing weight 1500
max laden weight 1900
gross train weight 3350

We're a family of 4, t adults, one toddler 3 yr old and one baby and no idea how much extra to add in calculations for payload! 300kg? 400kg?

Does this have to include the weight of family members as well?

We've looked at the Elddis Xplore 304 but wondered if we could go for anything bigger so just need an idea of what weight we could two once payload is taken into account as well.

Thanks in advance!!

 

[RogerL]

Your car is likely to be running at, or close to it's maximum weight, with luggage and all the childrens' paraphenalia - if that's the case, the Berlingo can only tow 1,000 kg - the difference between Gross Train Weight and Maximum Laden Weight.

On that same basis, the A3 could tow 1,450 kg but that gives a 96% towing ratio - which is on the high side for a beginner, assuming that you are.

IMO, it's best to assume the caravan will be fully laden, more likely overloaded!, so a 1,300 kg MTPLM caravan, 86% towing ratio, would be a good place to start - Elddis Xplore 434/435 would fit that bill.

 

[martin22]

Thanks, that all makes sense and assuming car is fully loaded then working out how much is left for the caravan MTPLM like you did is loads easier than the way I was trying to work it out!

 

[LizziePope]

Welcome to the Practical Caravan forum, Martin. There's advice about outfit matching in the current episode of our TV show on The Caravan Channel. You can watch the show on Showcase 2, which is on Sky 192 and Freesat 402 – if you don't have Sky, you can watch it live online by clicking here. The next time it's broadcast is tomorrow (Wednesday) at 5pm. Full show details and broadcast times are found here.

 

[ProfJohnL]

Hello Martin,

I agree with Rogers analysis, But i would add that whilst Roger does hint you might actually be in danger of overloading the caravan at 1300kg, you must not overload as that is illegal.

 

[RogerL]

Hello Martin,

I agree with Rogers analysis, But i would add that whilst Roger does hint you might actually be in danger of overloading the caravan at 1300kg, you must not overload as that is illegal.

That's absolutely right - over-loading is illegal and dangerous.

I, and a few others, have admitted on internet forums that when we've been anoraks and weighed all the basic equipment it's come to more than the payload allowance - of course we then institute a cull of items to get the weight back to a legal and sensible position - but I'm very cynical when posters suggest they won't fully load their caravan.

Note - some continental caravans can have their MTPLM uprated by several 100kg, usually involving a different axle, so my cynicism wouldn't apply to them.

 

[martin22]

Yeah one thing I'll be doing is weighing everything we end up taking as at the moment I have absolutely no idea what the average payload for a family weighs. We're trying to get the lightest 4 berth that will be big enough for a growing family, so considering the Elddis Xplore 434, 526, and looking at some of the adria sportline models as well but they're a bit heavier.

The Audi will be the tow car as it can pull more, but it'll be getting replaced in a couple of years with something more suitable.

Thanks for the replies everyone and I'll check out the caravan channel videos Lizzie!

Off to the NEC show next month to have a look at some, and also do the 'have a try at towing' things as this might be the other thing that affects our decision of what to buy as we might think the larger xplore and adria sportline ones are too long.

 

[Craigyoung]

Hi Martin , Have a look at the baileys orion which is what we've got , orion 450/5 , light weight entry van at 1287kg , accommodates 5 , 3 fixed bunks and our double bed which takes seconds to pull out and make up and we are a family of 4 , 4 & 8 year old children , loads of room , your Audi would easily pull it . I think the baileys persuit is a newer version now but still lightweight , hope yous get sorted , happy travels .

 

[Trevormc]

Martin I take it you have a driving Licence that covers towing a trailer, because after a date ( not sure when ) you have to take a driving test to tow a trailer.

Trevor

 

[crazyguider]

Hi Martin, and welcome.
Remember, with a caravan, you only really need to pack enough food/drink in the van for the first 24 hours, then head to the nearest supermarket and stock up. We find this really helps with weight. We keep snacks in the car to throw at the kids when they get restless, and this keeps them happy. I usually put in a precooked spagbol to reheat, a couple of pints of milk, and cereals for the next morning, plus a bottle of wine. The rest I get when I'm there. Takes a bit of practise, but give it a try.

 

[ProfJohnL]

Martin I take it you have a driving Licence that covers towing a trailer, because after a date ( not sure when ) you have to take a driving test to tow a trailer.
Trevor

Hello Trevor,

The change to category B entitlement was end of January 1997. After that date new drivers were only allowed to tow an outfit that did not exceed 3500Kg Maximum Authorised Mass (MAM). To use larger outfits over 3500Kg a new driver needs to take the BE towing test.

Fortunately Martin has already identified his choice of cars and caravan weights and his permitted weight limits are below 3500Kg. So he should be compliant in this instance.

 

[Trevormc]

Thanks for the info Prof.
Not up to date with those new Licence catagories was many moons ago that I past my test.

Trevor

 

[Craigyoung]

And have you seen the price to for upgrading your licence to a B + E licence ! Nearly £1ooo fora 3 day course , I'm gutted because I passed my test 4 days after they changed the ruling ! So I can only pull up to 35oo KG , I've pulled trailers since passing my test so I know what I'm doing , yet I hold my D category for driving a bus for a living - 44 foot long , singled and double deckers weighing up to 1o - 12 ton yet DVLA still say I need to take the B + E test , as you can imagine , not happy !

 

[paws]

And have you seen the price to for upgrading your licence to a B + E licence ! Nearly £1ooo fora 3 day course ,

Edited by paws:...... Ooops..... pushed the wrong button!

 

[paws]

HI Craigyoung,
Don't worry about the cost of £1000.... If you know your stuff and are a safe and knowlegeable tow person, and don't need any training or "brushing up" then you can book the actual test yourself ( without the training) and the fee from memory is "only" about £115

Its still quite a lot but a lot better than £1000......!

Incidentally to extend your B license to B+E the test takes approx 1 hour.....

Compare this with the assessment/test (recommended but not mandatory) for driving a horse and cart on the road..... that takes 2 hours!

Perhaps folks should be grateful for the very short test needed for a Cat B+E extension compared with the considerably more extensive Horse and Cart test/assessment!
Regards to all
paws

 

[Craigyoung]

Morning Paws , thanks for that , I'll look into that . How long ago was that though ! Still about £5o for the medical to before hand !! Money money money !!

 

[Gafferbill]

........no medical is needed but you need to turn up with the correct vehicle and trailer.

See here

 

[Craigyoung]

To apply for an additional category onto your license , you've got to have a medical or had one within 12 months is what I was told by the training company in Gateshead so I will have to reenquire about prices . Thanks .

 

[paws]

Gafferbill is spot on ( as usual!)
No medical is needed.... the training company in Gateshead got it wrong!
Probably they were describing a different type of license....from the B+E we are discussing.

Looks like its all good news.
Regards
to all
paws

 

[ProfJohnL]

To apply for an additional category onto your license , you've got to have a medical or had one within 12 months is what I was told by the training company in Gateshead so I will have to reenquire about prices . Thanks .

Hello Craig,

https://www.gov.uk/towing-with-car/car-trailer-practical-test
B+E category is an extension to B, and the same medical requirements apply as to the standard driving test. The only medical question in the +E test relates to the ability to read a number plate at set distances which is the same as the basic test. On the basis a driver already has the basic licence, no further evidence is required.

You may need a medical for other categories especially those for HGV and PSV. of if you have been ordered to take a retest following a motoring that is medically related offence.

 

[Craigyoung]

Thanks for all that guys .