Hi all just had a leaflet through the door for caratec caravan servicing has anyone used them or heard of them? as I might try somewhere different for my servicing.
Has anyone heard of Caratec?
- Thread starter AbbeyOwner
- Start date
No I haven't used Caratec, but I have looked on their website.
They list a number of associations such as MCEA (Mobile Caravan Engineers Association), but in my view they don't list some essential accreditations:-
They do not list:-
Gassafe - Every contractor or sub contractor employed to work on gas systems must be registered with Gasafe and ticketd for the systems they work on. ACOPS Gas Certified is not the same thing.
See - http://www.gassaferegister.co.uk/pdf/Who%20can%20legally%20work%20on%20a%20gas%20appliance.pdf
There is no reference to certification for undertaking mains electrical work.
And no reference to NCC approvals which would be needed for service work under caravan manufacturers guarantee schemes.
So I have to ring a note of caution with the omissions listed above.
They list a number of associations such as MCEA (Mobile Caravan Engineers Association), but in my view they don't list some essential accreditations:-
They do not list:-
Gassafe - Every contractor or sub contractor employed to work on gas systems must be registered with Gasafe and ticketd for the systems they work on. ACOPS Gas Certified is not the same thing.
See - http://www.gassaferegister.co.uk/pdf/Who%20can%20legally%20work%20on%20a%20gas%20appliance.pdf
There is no reference to certification for undertaking mains electrical work.
And no reference to NCC approvals which would be needed for service work under caravan manufacturers guarantee schemes.
So I have to ring a note of caution with the omissions listed above.
Damian
Moderator
Quote " Gassafe - Every contractor or sub contractor employed to work on gas systems must be registered with Gasafe and ticketd for the systems they work on. ACOPS Gas Certified is not the same thing."
I must strongly disagree with John L on this point.
First and foremost, privately owned caravans are exempt from Gas Safe regulation.
Secondly, any caravan engineer working on a customers van MUST be at the minimum ACoPS qualified, which is all that is required.
Being ACoPS qualified ensures they will adhere to GSIUR's, Health and Safety and be "competent" to work on caravan gas systems.
The situation is different for vans hired out as part of a business, there the gas operative MUST be Gas Safe Registered.
If your van is still under warranty, Caratec are NOT an Approved Workshop so they cannot mainain your warranty.
I must strongly disagree with John L on this point.
First and foremost, privately owned caravans are exempt from Gas Safe regulation.
Secondly, any caravan engineer working on a customers van MUST be at the minimum ACoPS qualified, which is all that is required.
Being ACoPS qualified ensures they will adhere to GSIUR's, Health and Safety and be "competent" to work on caravan gas systems.
The situation is different for vans hired out as part of a business, there the gas operative MUST be Gas Safe Registered.
If your van is still under warranty, Caratec are NOT an Approved Workshop so they cannot mainain your warranty.
Should still be under warranty as it was purchased in 2010 i'm going to take it to my regular dealer as they valet it for me aswell included in my service.Damian-Moderator said:
Damian
Moderator
Quote " Should still be under warranty as it was purchased in 2010 "]
Whilst under warranty any NCC Approved Workshop can undertake the servicing, but as you seem to get everything from your Dealer, at presumably an acceptable price you are sensible to stick with them.
Whilst under warranty any NCC Approved Workshop can undertake the servicing, but as you seem to get everything from your Dealer, at presumably an acceptable price you are sensible to stick with them.
Yes because if there is any parts that I require I get them direct from the dealer the price is acceptable but it is a bit steep but they do an excellent service.Damian-Moderator said:
Hello Damian,
I am aware that I do not have the latest copy of the GSIUR's and some of the finer wording may have changed a little, In which case my assertion could be wrong, but in your own reply you effectively reiterate my own understanding of the legality.
You state:-
"First and foremost, privately owned caravans are exempt from Gas Safe regulation".
That is only the case if the owner of a private caravan undertakes work themselves. - I stated "every contractor or sub contractor" to differentiate from a private owner. Any other person undertaking work is considered in law to be a contractor or subcontractor to the owner, whether or not they get paid for the work.
Thus as the work is being contracted, the caravan becomes a place of work and is subject to the GSIUR's and fitters must be GasSafe rgistered.
This just shows how silly the private caravan exemtion is, and its about time it was reviewed.
I am aware that I do not have the latest copy of the GSIUR's and some of the finer wording may have changed a little, In which case my assertion could be wrong, but in your own reply you effectively reiterate my own understanding of the legality.
You state:-
"First and foremost, privately owned caravans are exempt from Gas Safe regulation".
That is only the case if the owner of a private caravan undertakes work themselves. - I stated "every contractor or sub contractor" to differentiate from a private owner. Any other person undertaking work is considered in law to be a contractor or subcontractor to the owner, whether or not they get paid for the work.
Thus as the work is being contracted, the caravan becomes a place of work and is subject to the GSIUR's and fitters must be GasSafe rgistered.
This just shows how silly the private caravan exemtion is, and its about time it was reviewed.
hi John, I strongly disagree, if there is an exemption it is there for a reason. mainly for changing bottles and regulators. while it is true that most owners would not undertake major gas refittments, modifications or servicing, the need for owners to do certain things with gas is still there, for example if you change to propane during the winter, or the site does not have the right bottle, the pipe regulator ect, would also have to be changed, if the exemption was removed all gas work would have to be done via a gas safe mobile fitter on site, there is no middle ground,Prof John L said:
I have said before the time will come when bottle changing would have to be done by a proffesional,
this is the case with gas in the home, if I bought a new cooker, it has to be plumbed in by a gas safe fitter, even though the new cooker comes with a bayonette fitting that has just to be inserted after the old one is removed, I am not allowed to fit it diy as it has to be tested and signed off,
removing the exemption as you suggest would bring the above senario above even closer, but more importantly would also encompass other moblie gas uses including patio gas, mobile heaters and blow torches,
no legislative body would go down that route not even the EU,
well not yet anyway but watch this space,
On the subject of caravan servicing in general - so nothing to do with Caratec - I discovered my caravan battery was getting very warm and found it to be bone dry. The 'van had been given it's annual service a fortnight before. Being away from home I visited the closest caravan servicing/spares depot to buy a new battery and commented that I would have expected the battery to have been checked as part of the annual service. I was told that they did not consider checking the battery to be part of an annual service. Nor would they expect it to be carried out elsewhere.
hi Mike, maybe Damian is the one to answer this one, but it could just be that the battery was not part of the original equipment supplied, like the gas bottle or motor mover, this may seem strange on the face of it, but understandable. I would not expect these to be checked or serviced either, some jobs are left to the owner,
I think there is a downloadable PDF file somewhere that shows what is checked on the service this should make things clearer I will post a link later when I have more time. unlees someone beats me to it.
I think there is a downloadable PDF file somewhere that shows what is checked on the service this should make things clearer I will post a link later when I have more time. unlees someone beats me to it.
Damian
Moderator
Quote " That is only the case if the owner of a private caravan undertakes work themselves. - I stated "every contractor or sub contractor" to differentiate from a private owner. Any other person undertaking work is considered in law to be a contractor or subcontractor to the owner, whether or not they get paid for the work.
Thus as the work is being contracted, the caravan becomes a place of work and is subject to the GSIUR's and fitters must be GasSafe rgistered."
John, you are totally wrong on this one.
For a caravan used by the owner alone, and NOT hired or rentsed out as par of a business, the gas operative does NOT have to be Gas Safe Registered as touring caravans (and motorhomes)are EXEMPT from the legislation.
ACoPS is perfectly acceptable proof of "competence" and it is purely being able to demonstrate competence, by virtue of achieving ACoPS certification.
Gas Safe have no input or influence over touring caravans, only GSIURs and H&S
Thus as the work is being contracted, the caravan becomes a place of work and is subject to the GSIUR's and fitters must be GasSafe rgistered."
John, you are totally wrong on this one.
For a caravan used by the owner alone, and NOT hired or rentsed out as par of a business, the gas operative does NOT have to be Gas Safe Registered as touring caravans (and motorhomes)are EXEMPT from the legislation.
ACoPS is perfectly acceptable proof of "competence" and it is purely being able to demonstrate competence, by virtue of achieving ACoPS certification.
Gas Safe have no input or influence over touring caravans, only GSIURs and H&S
Gas Safe DOES have a category approval for LPG - Touring Caravan.Damian-Moderator said:
Some mobile caravan engineers hold this approval.
Damian
Moderator
Quote " Gas Safe DOES have a category approval for LPG - Touring Caravan."
As a Gas Safe Registered Engineer I can say quite categorically that there is no such thing as you state.
Gas Safe is made up of different modules , LPG Cookers, LPG Fridges,LPG Water Heater etc etc etc.
It depends what modules the engineer has which determines what appliances etc he can work on, but they are NOT specifi to touring caravans, it covers all leisure accomodation vehicles
The ONLY touring caravans which come under Gas Safe are those hired out as part of a business,,,,,that IT.
The modules required to work on Hire Fleet units are:
CCLP1 (LAV), HTRLP3, WAHLP1, WATLP2, Cenwat, CKR1,CPA1
As a Gas Safe Registered Engineer I can say quite categorically that there is no such thing as you state.
Gas Safe is made up of different modules , LPG Cookers, LPG Fridges,LPG Water Heater etc etc etc.
It depends what modules the engineer has which determines what appliances etc he can work on, but they are NOT specifi to touring caravans, it covers all leisure accomodation vehicles
The ONLY touring caravans which come under Gas Safe are those hired out as part of a business,,,,,that IT.
The modules required to work on Hire Fleet units are:
CCLP1 (LAV), HTRLP3, WAHLP1, WATLP2, Cenwat, CKR1,CPA1
Damian
Moderator
In reply to Mike and Colin about batteries:
The battery is not part of the caravan inventory at the point of sale, it is an "Extra",,,strange as that may be,,,,,,,,,I know.
However, during an annual service the battery should be checked for electrolyte level, topped up if needed, and given a high discharge test, its on the NCC Service Schedule so should be done,,,if not,,,,,,what else have they missed?
The battery is not part of the caravan inventory at the point of sale, it is an "Extra",,,strange as that may be,,,,,,,,,I know.
However, during an annual service the battery should be checked for electrolyte level, topped up if needed, and given a high discharge test, its on the NCC Service Schedule so should be done,,,if not,,,,,,what else have they missed?
As a holder of ACoPS I can confirm what Damian quotes re Gas Safe and ACoPS are correct, for an engineer to work on a caravan/motorhome that is not lived in full time and is not on hire and reward then ACoPS is perfectly fine and as with Gas Safe the holder of ACoPS will have an identity card and normally carries a certificate with them.
Re. Battery Check during Service.
To Colin and, for info, Damien.
The most recent service check lists are in the 'van and I cannot easily get to them. However previous lists, from a different service agent, do include - Battery - check condition, security, electrolyte level & lubricate terminals. Tyres - Check and record tread depths & pressure, condition, wear pattern (incl. sidewalls & valves) The gas cylinder is only noted for - Check Security.
So while I assumed such checks were included it is not a good idea to take them as given by all service agents. And what else needs to be double checked by the customer ?
To Colin and, for info, Damien.
The most recent service check lists are in the 'van and I cannot easily get to them. However previous lists, from a different service agent, do include - Battery - check condition, security, electrolyte level & lubricate terminals. Tyres - Check and record tread depths & pressure, condition, wear pattern (incl. sidewalls & valves) The gas cylinder is only noted for - Check Security.
So while I assumed such checks were included it is not a good idea to take them as given by all service agents. And what else needs to be double checked by the customer ?
Mike
Those checks are on the AWS paperwork, having said that some engineers use their own paperwork and may not list it.
Those checks are on the AWS paperwork, having said that some engineers use their own paperwork and may not list it.
Damian
Moderator
Quote " Those checks are on the AWS paperwork, having said that some engineers use their own paperwork and may not list it."
Taking Martin's reply there may be the problem.
If a workshop is AWS Approved then the engineer should be carrying out the checks and tests as per the AWS Schedule, if they are using their own paperwork with bits missing then the service is not being carried out to AWS Standards.
If any owner finds this is the case, then report the situation to the AWS Manager at the NCC.
Taking Martin's reply there may be the problem.
If a workshop is AWS Approved then the engineer should be carrying out the checks and tests as per the AWS Schedule, if they are using their own paperwork with bits missing then the service is not being carried out to AWS Standards.
If any owner finds this is the case, then report the situation to the AWS Manager at the NCC.
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