Hi Can anyone tell me if it is better to have a lightweight caravan or a heavy caravan for towing or does it not make any difference as long as the 85% rule is adhered to. It is just that we have a Coachman Amara which is a heavy van - towed by a 3ltr diesel 4x4 I must add. I just always have the fear that as the van is so heavy it may pull the car over or may snake due to the weight. Or maybe I just worry for the sake of it.
LIGHTWEIGHT OR HEAVYWEIGHT
- Thread starter IRIS_374301519
- Start date
Parksy
Moderator
Hi Iris
Before anyone else jumps in and posts that the 85% is a guideline and not a rule I've just done it ;0)
I'm sure that the more technically minded forum members who have engineering backgrounds will be able to back up their statements with facts but my own understanding is that as long as your caravan is correctly loaded, safe and roadworthy and with good tyres inflated to the correct pressure any caravan or trailer will be safe to tow provided the towcar is legally and mechanically capable of towing the outfit.
You need to adhere to speed limits and take into account road conditions as would be normal whether towing or driving solo but I would say that there is no major difference in the likelihood of a snake, possibly less so with a heavier caravan.
I might be wrong about the final point but I'm sure that Lutz would be able to provide evidence either way.
Before anyone else jumps in and posts that the 85% is a guideline and not a rule I've just done it ;0)
I'm sure that the more technically minded forum members who have engineering backgrounds will be able to back up their statements with facts but my own understanding is that as long as your caravan is correctly loaded, safe and roadworthy and with good tyres inflated to the correct pressure any caravan or trailer will be safe to tow provided the towcar is legally and mechanically capable of towing the outfit.
You need to adhere to speed limits and take into account road conditions as would be normal whether towing or driving solo but I would say that there is no major difference in the likelihood of a snake, possibly less so with a heavier caravan.
I might be wrong about the final point but I'm sure that Lutz would be able to provide evidence either way.
Whether a caravan is a lightweight or a heavyweight, is not, in itself a criterion of stability. There are too many other important variables affecting stability that one can pinpoint weight as a cause of a snake. It's not a cause, but it can make instability, in case it does occur, worse. Even then, I emphasise the use of the word "can", not "will". However, because so many factors are involved, there is no factual evidence that there is any direct correlation between weight and accident rates (maybe because there is too little data to go by). It can only be a contributing factor if other mistakes are made.
Well just for the synics who realy should know better as they should be showing us how to conduct ourselves, here's my ten peneth.
The 85% so called rule is a myth. End of!!
Wether or not you tow a caravan/trailer to the maximum tow capacity of your car or if you tow a small luggage trailer no bigger than a wheel barrow, balanced loading is the key factor to a safe tow. Here on PC we have covered this extensively and the mag runs a very good loading guide line. Keeping the heavey items on the floor of the van and over the axle is by far the best job.
Having the tow car in a good mechanical state is just as essential to safe towing. Both suspension, steering and brakes need to be in A1 condition. Worn shockabsorber's, brakes pulling to one side and worn suspension bushes for instance could render the car unstable and thus have an effect on the trailer.
Personal driving styles also play a role. Someone who brakes into corners, or swerve's violently to take junctions or generally drive's on amission so to speak, could have an effect upon the trailer and cause a sway whitch could develope into a pendulem snake.
I have in the past towed trailers nearly twice the weight of the tow vehicle (Ifor Williams 3500Kg)and because of attention to loading in a balanced nature, I have had no major problems in 27 years of towing and I guess a million miles of towing.
To get a tow stable I have always worked on a max draw bar nose weight of 75Kgs and if the trailer is below 1000Kgs gross weight I have dropped the weight to 50Kgs. This has stood me in good sted.
You don't have to get the scales out every time you hook up. By having a routine of a place for everything and everything in it's place, once establishing the load plan you can be reasonably sure of a balanced load. Also taking a measurement from under the "A" frame to the road, will also guide you on loading.
I would not be too worried about towing, but having a healthy regard for the loading and vehicle condition points above will ease the stress.
ATB Steve L.
The 85% so called rule is a myth. End of!!
Wether or not you tow a caravan/trailer to the maximum tow capacity of your car or if you tow a small luggage trailer no bigger than a wheel barrow, balanced loading is the key factor to a safe tow. Here on PC we have covered this extensively and the mag runs a very good loading guide line. Keeping the heavey items on the floor of the van and over the axle is by far the best job.
Having the tow car in a good mechanical state is just as essential to safe towing. Both suspension, steering and brakes need to be in A1 condition. Worn shockabsorber's, brakes pulling to one side and worn suspension bushes for instance could render the car unstable and thus have an effect on the trailer.
Personal driving styles also play a role. Someone who brakes into corners, or swerve's violently to take junctions or generally drive's on amission so to speak, could have an effect upon the trailer and cause a sway whitch could develope into a pendulem snake.
I have in the past towed trailers nearly twice the weight of the tow vehicle (Ifor Williams 3500Kg)and because of attention to loading in a balanced nature, I have had no major problems in 27 years of towing and I guess a million miles of towing.
To get a tow stable I have always worked on a max draw bar nose weight of 75Kgs and if the trailer is below 1000Kgs gross weight I have dropped the weight to 50Kgs. This has stood me in good sted.
You don't have to get the scales out every time you hook up. By having a routine of a place for everything and everything in it's place, once establishing the load plan you can be reasonably sure of a balanced load. Also taking a measurement from under the "A" frame to the road, will also guide you on loading.
I would not be too worried about towing, but having a healthy regard for the loading and vehicle condition points above will ease the stress.
ATB Steve L.
Hello Iris,
I will go a little further than some of the other respondents.
It is always better to keep the trailer (caravan in this case) as light as possible. 85% is one suggestion but in fact offers no guarantees of safety.
But all the other factors that have been mentioned also apply such careful loading, nose weights driving style
I will go a little further than some of the other respondents.
It is always better to keep the trailer (caravan in this case) as light as possible. 85% is one suggestion but in fact offers no guarantees of safety.
But all the other factors that have been mentioned also apply such careful loading, nose weights driving style
iris
the 85% is a guide for the novice caravaner, but is also a sensible guide for the experienced.
I can think of no advantage to having a heavy van, other than perhaps resisting being blown over by high winds?
Towing light, will benefit from extra fuel economy, less brake wear,easier hill starts, easier man handling, and so on the list is quite long.
In summary, good is light, bad is heavy.
the 85% is a guide for the novice caravaner, but is also a sensible guide for the experienced.
I can think of no advantage to having a heavy van, other than perhaps resisting being blown over by high winds?
Towing light, will benefit from extra fuel economy, less brake wear,easier hill starts, easier man handling, and so on the list is quite long.
In summary, good is light, bad is heavy.
Obviously a 60% weight ratio is going to be more favourable than 85% and 85% more favourable than 100% (all other conditions remaining equal), but it is a sliding scale. There is no level at which things suddenly go wrong. One must therefore decide for one's self what one feels confident with, always taking the absolute limits that the manufacturer's specify into account.
Hi,
My old (1957)Land Rover, towing my 750kg ULW trailer carrying my 1500kg of boat, tended to get a bit wobbly at 50mph. Solution? Don't exceed 45mph. Lets face it, you could probably tow 10 tons safely, provided you did it slowly enough.
What amazed me was the people who borrowed my trailer to carry similar boats behind their family saloons. But they drove sensibly, and had no problems. Well, none they told me about.
But what I did find ,last time I used my trailer, 100miles, prior to seling the boat, was that it no longer had any brakes. Tends to concentrate the mind.
My first question to you is, do you have a B livence, or B+1?
602
My old (1957)Land Rover, towing my 750kg ULW trailer carrying my 1500kg of boat, tended to get a bit wobbly at 50mph. Solution? Don't exceed 45mph. Lets face it, you could probably tow 10 tons safely, provided you did it slowly enough.
What amazed me was the people who borrowed my trailer to carry similar boats behind their family saloons. But they drove sensibly, and had no problems. Well, none they told me about.
But what I did find ,last time I used my trailer, 100miles, prior to seling the boat, was that it no longer had any brakes. Tends to concentrate the mind.
My first question to you is, do you have a B livence, or B+1?
602
As 602 has explained!!....
The heavier the trailer/caravan the more important to have well maintained brakes on that trailer/caravan.
The heavier the trailer/caravan the more important to have well maintained brakes on that trailer/caravan.
Hello gaffer,
A rhetorical question.
If it is more necessary to have well maintained brakes on a heavy caravan, how much less important is it for a lighter caravan?
and ultimately as the weight of the vans becomes lighter when can maintenance be set aside completely?
I think we all know, regardless of the weight of car or caravan it is very important to ensure all maintenance is carried out properly and in a timely manner for all vehicles and weights.
A rhetorical question.
If it is more necessary to have well maintained brakes on a heavy caravan, how much less important is it for a lighter caravan?
and ultimately as the weight of the vans becomes lighter when can maintenance be set aside completely?
I think we all know, regardless of the weight of car or caravan it is very important to ensure all maintenance is carried out properly and in a timely manner for all vehicles and weights.
JohnL....
I have a caravan and my towcar is a large 4x4.
I also have a 750kg max weight trailer..
It is fully legal and is not fitted with any braking system!
Thus the Dept of Transport sets 750kg or below as the point when brake maintenance can be set aside completely. (Nothing to maintain)
You are right about the importance of braking system maintenance.
However, Iris the OP, expressed fears about towing a heavy caravan with a large 4x4
To quote Iris....
"I just always have the fear that as the van is so heavy it may pull the car over or may snake due to the weight".
Previous posters, including yourself, had offered comprehensive advice to allay her fears but had missed out often overlooked brake system maintenance.
A heavier caravan (relative to the towcar) will obviously exert greater forces on the towcar especially under braking than a lighter caravan.
Since caravans have an overrun braking system to neutralise these braking forces it is more important that this is well maintained on relative heavier caravans, so that the towcar can remain in control.
I have a caravan and my towcar is a large 4x4.
I also have a 750kg max weight trailer..
It is fully legal and is not fitted with any braking system!
Thus the Dept of Transport sets 750kg or below as the point when brake maintenance can be set aside completely. (Nothing to maintain)
You are right about the importance of braking system maintenance.
However, Iris the OP, expressed fears about towing a heavy caravan with a large 4x4
To quote Iris....
"I just always have the fear that as the van is so heavy it may pull the car over or may snake due to the weight".
Previous posters, including yourself, had offered comprehensive advice to allay her fears but had missed out often overlooked brake system maintenance.
A heavier caravan (relative to the towcar) will obviously exert greater forces on the towcar especially under braking than a lighter caravan.
Since caravans have an overrun braking system to neutralise these braking forces it is more important that this is well maintained on relative heavier caravans, so that the towcar can remain in control.
Hello gaffer,
Please note my opening line about a "rhetorical question"
I was trying to point out the absurdness of the statement about heavy weights requiring greater care.
There are others that I might highlight in the future.
However I feel I must defend some specifics that you raise.
On this thread I have not give extensive advice, I have however supported others who have done so.
With regards to the maintenance of brakes, I have always referred to the maintenance or condition of both car and caravan. Proper maintenance includes braking systems.
I must question your last point though, If the brakes on a trailer are working correctly, then the force with which the towbar pushes against the car is not directly proportional to the weight of the trailer, because as the trailer begins to push the brakes begin to act and thus reduce the pushing force.
The same is not true under acceleration where the tension in the tow hitch is dependant on the weight of the caravan.
Hi,
As a matter of interest only, Freedom sell (or did) a caravan with an MAM less than 750kg, which has no brakes. At least thats how I read the advert.
I presume the only benefit was the cost. Unless you have a B-licence, and a car built before whenever max towing weights were invented.
602
As a matter of interest only, Freedom sell (or did) a caravan with an MAM less than 750kg, which has no brakes. At least thats how I read the advert.
I presume the only benefit was the cost. Unless you have a B-licence, and a car built before whenever max towing weights were invented.
602
There are quite a few cars with a max. permissible towload of under 750kg. The old Astra 1.2 is just one example.
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