Myths

[Val & Frank]

I copied this from disabled parking, I think it deserves a thread on it's own.

Colin ( bridgend wrote " Incidently in today's Daily Mail is a report of over £1 million child benefit handouts being sent overseas by our so called immigrant workers. Why on earth should a foreigner to this country who has not contributed to the system be given British tax payers money to send home to their country.

The myth here is because you contributed in the past, you think you have more call on the system than someone who has just joined !!! The NI payments and Tax collected last week or last year has been spent. In London they don't have a box with Colin's or Frank's payment made to date, which we can draw on in the future.If an immigrant is working and paying tax he/she has as much entitlement as anyone else who pays into the sysytem.

That is the system.

Frank

 

[colin(bridgend)]

Frank - the posting you have made above gives me great concern. The point I was making, and still am, is that these foreign workers come into this country and milk the system for all its worth. Thankfully both my wife and self are both reasonably comfortable regarding finance and health, we could be better but compared to others we think that we are OK. However there are British residents who have paid into the system and many have even served their country in wars who are denied this help when they deserve it. Why should the immigrants milk our finances having not contributed to the country in either finance or work having only just enetered here. The Gherkas (excuse spelling) who have fought along side British troops and at one time were part of the British Empire are being denied the pensions from their army days and these five minute scroungers are being given every thing on a silver plate. What the hell is happening to the politics of this country where this can happen? Would we get the same benefits if we went to their countries? - no way. It is once again the so called b****y do gooders interfering in our country's policies. Prime Minister Howard of Australia has the right policy and if I was younger I would not hesitate to get out of this rat hole and emigrate to either Australia or New Zealand. I have told both my children that this country has had it under the present political regimes and to get out to either the above named countries or Canada.

There obviously is no money box ear marked for me or you but the benefits should be ear marked for British subjects who have, and still are, working for or defending this country. The budget for the department controling benefits has this year overspent by

 

[DeliDave]

you would have hoped you would have to have a qualifying period before you could claim ,I also saw in local surgery that non EU people would be charged

 

[WilliamTups]

Adding fuel to the fire,

As a couple in our 30's we now have two young children and the family allowance is a small income boast (but we sound in our rights), however we both paid money to the state for nearly 12 years before given anything back (both of us have been fortunate enough to have never been unemployed or needed assistance), but what really gets me is people that come to the UK and after just a few months of paying taxes came claim money from the benefit system (e.g. Claiming child benefit when the children are not even in the same country)

Also as an employer, I have employed people from this new states and I must admit some of them would be put UK workers to shame with their work ethic, BUT when you get talking to them, I often hear the same thing which is that the family has clubbed together to pay travel tickets and a starter fund. They get to the UK, find work, send money home and once they have done their 12 months under the WRS scheme and their restrictions are removed they then bring the rest of the family over to the UK, who then as family can claim everything and anything (I've seen this happen with housing, pension tax credits, income support etc) Some of these workers have even admitted to faking illness at GP's in order to get a prescription and then send home the medication for a relative.

Now what is fair in this......

 

[Moderator2_5083849]

This part of the forum is:

Chit-chat

For non-caravan issues: jokes, trivia, gossip.

The emphasis being on Jokes (suitable for for a mixed readership including children) Trivia,and Gossip.

It is NOT for political , religious or ethnic discussion as these topics always draw extreme reactions.

Before this topic ends up as a problem, be warned that it will be removed if it heads in that way.

 

[GrahamPonty]

Frank, Sorry mate but I have to agree with colin, David, and William.

Graham (Ponty)

 

[BrianStAlbans]

You can't blame them for looking after thier families . If you don't agree with it blame the system not those that use it.

 

[colin-yorkshire]

for mod 2

if political debate cannot be made in chit chat where else?????

mod 1 and steve remove threads that are in the wrong place.

I thought chit chat was for non caravanning issues including having a good old ding dong on politics.

is it just me or is this site getting a little too PC and im not talking practical caravans or personal computers

colin

ps.

maybe this is why we are losing some of our old timers ??

 

[BrianStAlbans]

Or maybe they were just fed up with some of the dross that's posted on here.

 

[WilliamTups]

Frank - the posting you have made above gives me great concern. The point I was making, and still am, is that these foreign workers come into this country and milk the system for all its worth. Thankfully both my wife and self are both reasonably comfortable regarding finance and health, we could be better but compared to others we think that we are OK. However there are British residents who have paid into the system and many have even served their country in wars who are denied this help when they deserve it. Why should the immigrants milk our finances having not contributed to the country in either finance or work having only just enetered here. The Gherkas (excuse spelling) who have fought along side British troops and at one time were part of the British Empire are being denied the pensions from their army days and these five minute scroungers are being given every thing on a silver plate. What the hell is happening to the politics of this country where this can happen? Would we get the same benefits if we went to their countries? - no way. It is once again the so called b****y do gooders interfering in our country's policies. Prime Minister Howard of Australia has the right policy and if I was younger I would not hesitate to get out of this rat hole and emigrate to either Australia or New Zealand. I have told both my children that this country has had it under the present political regimes and to get out to either the above named countries or Canada.

There obviously is no money box ear marked for me or you but the benefits should be ear marked for British subjects who have, and still are, working for or defending this country. The budget for the department controling benefits has this year overspent by

 

[LMH]

What amazes me is that people actually believe what is written in the Daily Mail.

Lisa

 

[colin(bridgend)]

Mr Mod 2 I must take to task on your posting under this topic. In the past I have admired the good work of all moderators of this forum but feel that freedom of speech is being curtailed by your threats.

I agree that any topic that could be libelous to an individual or company should and must be pulled. This topic though at present is generalising rather than being specific to an individual or company. There have been jokes on here which for one reason or another have been pulled - generally crude and offensive. There has been trivia here which has been pulled for a similar reason, however this topic is current regarding how this country is being exploited by certain groups of people and how other in the meantime are being denied their basic rights as British citizens. Also reading the postings from contributers there is not one mention of Labour, Tory, Lib. Dem. or any other political party that could incite the extreme reactions you envisage. As a general discussion topic I therefore think that to pull the plug on it is a serious breach of civil liberties of freedom of speech. I do not wish to cause you or the other moderators any offence as generally you three are doing a stirling job. All I ask for is leniancy on this topic until it becomes personal and then it should be fairly moderated.

 

[colin(bridgend)]

What amazes me is that people actually believe what is written in the Daily Mail.

Lisa

What point is there in having the media if we don't take note of what is either being printed or broadcast. Whatever form of the media you read or listen to it is there for a few reasons: to sell, to impress their views on the reader/listener/viewer and thirdly to incite reactions to the news they have put across. It is only their opinion and they hope you will agree with them. how are we to know what is happening in the country/world without the media.

 

[Moderator2_5083849]

I am sorry if anyone has misread what I posted earlier.

I said that IF this topic degenerates into personal or purely a vehicle to print racist comments then it will be removed.

This is a caravan forum, not a debating chamber, it is open to the whole world to read, not just those who wish to think it is "their" place to vent frustrations or personal dislikes.

There are plenty of other forums where that kind of debate is welcomed.

Whatever views individual people have, under present laws racism is against the law, and will not be condoned here, and so far it looks like that is where it is going.

Unless posters have absolute proof of what they are stating, and not relying on a biased newspaper report then it is worthless and simply provocative.

Freedom of speech went a long time ago, there is no such thing any more, unfortunately, thanks to all the PC brigade, of which I am not one, but have to abide by the Publishers decisions.

Believe me, if I posted what I truly believe, I would be banned form every forum in the world, so it is with regret that unless this stays general it may have to go.

 

[WilliamTups]

Mr Mod 2,

"Unless posters have absolute proof of what they are stating, and not relying on a biased newspaper report then it is worthless and simply provocative"

As said in my earlier post, as an employer and experiences in dealing with UK and non UK nationals, I can prove my point(s) with

1) Work History

2) Reasons for quitting work

3) Benefit claims forms that I have to complete as an employer for various bodies.

4) Work done with various bodies (such as immigration) in order to assist those that are genuine and those that are not.

And this information is on more than one person or group of people. and this is not based a newspaper articles or reports seen on the TV but black & white paperwork from governmental bodies.

In the same way that you face regulation, I do to at work on a daily basis, so I understand your view point, and if I employed as per my own personal views I would be in a court room daily.

However, I have very little doubt in my mind that you will find that this topic has been mentioned today either in the workplace, in some form of media, in the street, on a bus and no doubt on a Caravanning / Camping site and it will be continued to be spoken about tomorrow, next week and so on and on and who knows it may well be the next election decider

But to date I think that the comments posted have purely reflect people's views and this forum I thought was about sharing advice, views, experiences and comments. If we can not do this what's the point of having a forum...

 

[Viking1]

hi Mod2

Can see y shud say the same thing tice.

Mark

 

[Viking1]

hi Mod2

Can see y shud say the same thing tice.

Mark

Missed not out