Name the worst car maker for rust?

[Dustydog]

This surprised me . Sorry for the screen dump

Why do Toyota trucks rust so bad?
I worked for a major trucking company that had the contract to ship new frames to dealers to be replacements for failed and recalled trucks. Almost all were in the northeast, with a small number also going to Minnesota. Big culprit is the chemicals used to keep roads ice free in the winter. Maine, Massachusetts, New York and Vermont was where the largest number was shipped to. Dropped directly on the dealers lots, a flat bed trailer could carry 12 frames. Usually divided between 3 to 5 different dealers. The parts dept. had to wait until the frame was delivered to order all the additional parts that Toyota included in the no cost to customer reframe. In talking with parts management at various dealerships, this became a huge profit driver for them. 2 men, usually not top bracket mechanics in a month or two, got in a good flow of doing the changeover, and could reframe 2 to 2.5 trucks a week. With Toyota picking up the parts cost, and paying the them a set fee per truck, dealers actually made more profit on reframes vs selling new cars. The frames were brought across the Mexico-USA border at Laredo. There they were reloaded onto flatbed destined for Kentucky. Staged in Louisville KY, then were stacked in order so they were taken off the truck in the order of the Dealer specified on the trip list. The sad part of all this!? The replacement frames lacked the coating in the exact location that the originals did. Destined to fail, this was very surprising to me that Toyota let this quality issue continue.

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Dan Levi
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Former Aircraft Maintenance Management at United Technologies (company) (1991–2011)
· Mar 17

 

[Jcloughie]

Are the tippers! 😛

John

 

[Mel]

I thought the Toyota flatbed was indestructible as evidenced by the original Top Gear years ago.
mel

 

[RogerL]

These seem to be Mexican-built Toyota Tacoma's for the North American market so there may be no connection with Japanese-built Toyota Prado (sold in UK as Landcruiser) or the Thailand-built Toyota Hilux for the UK market - although I'm surprised Toyota missed the importance of the "snow belt" in the North American market.

 

[Mr Grumpy]

Always used to be Vauxhall at one time. Closely followed by Ford!

Then Datsun, now Nissan, particularly the tops of McPherson struts!

 

[RogerL]

Always used to be Vauxhall at one time. Closely followed by Ford!

Then Datsun, now Nissan, particularly the tops of McPherson struts!

I think Fiat and Lancia led the field for quite a while.

 

[otherclive]

I think Fiat and Lancia led the field for quite a while.

Until the Tipo arrived and knocked the socks off of the opposition’s offerings. The fact is in the 60/70s corrosion was a fact of life, and waxoyl or Ziebart were unknown. Weekends seemed to involve mixing and applying Cataloy over expanded mesh, then painting, with occasional trips out or tending the allotment.

 

[Dustydog]

There was a road bridge across the M1 near Nottingham years ago
Old Fiats never die, the just rust away.😜

 

[Gafferbill]

....my Dad bought a brand new Ford in 1962 kept in central Hampshire so not near the sea.
It had to be scrapped in 1972 due to structural rust.
I currently have a 14 year old Ford with absolutely no sign of any rust.
Don't understand why cars were so rubbish back then.

 

[Buckman]

In the seventies the country got a fleet of Toyota Corolla vans that were imported direct from Japan. The company I worked for acquired about 200 of these vans. many were then sold to various business consumers.

I moved down to Durban at the coast where high humidity etc was very prevalent. My new boss had a Toyota Corolla panel van as his company car. It was about 2- 3 years old. One day he got into the vehicle and the seat nearly collapsed onto the roadway. The rim or mounting that the seat was bolted onto had rusted through completely.

Cars on the Natal coast suffered badly from rust and needed to be washed at least twice a week especially the Japanese cars, followed by Fords. In later years towards the nineties, the issue was not so prevalent amongst the newer cars.

 

[RogerL]

....my Dad bought a brand new Ford in 1962 kept in central Hampshire so not near the sea.
It had to be scrapped in 1972 due to structural rust.
I currently have a 14 year old Ford with absolutely no sign of any rust.
Don't understand why cars were so rubbish back then.

Pre-WW2 and immediately post-WW2, cars were built using a separate chassis made from heavy-gauge metal with a (usually) steel body on top - but as car makers switched to integral/monocoque construction the structural stiffening added to bodyshells to replace the strength of the chassis was lighter gauge pressed steel and no real thought was given to preventing water ingress.

Unlike USA where annual volumes were high enough to justify annual facelifts and upgrades, in Europe including the UK, volumes were much lower so facelifts and upgrades only appeared after some years as car makers fully utilised the cost of their tooling. On top of that some car makers were poor at continuing development and long-term reliability testing once a model was in production.

Even the initial imported Japanese cars suffered from rust in the British climate but they swiftly rectified the issue by rustproofing cars for export as the lack of salt used on roads in Japan meant that rust wasn't an issue in their home market.

 

[Beachball]

My uncle had a Morris Minor he kept it for some years until the rust started on the interior floor panels and nearly everywhere else on the car and decided to move on and brought a Austin mini .

 

[Dustydog]

Cars of the 50s and 60s usually had +ve earthing. Was that relevant to rusting? A friend last year suffered a broken front wishbone on his Audi A3 12 yrs old . Rusted through!

 

[otherclive]

My son has just had his 2008 Freelander 2 HSE reproofed by a specialist company in LLandow. His recent MoT advised signs of corrosion on areas of the front subframe, a pressed steel front cross member and side members just behind the front wheels. It was in for a week and areas of corrosion were taken down to bare metal and treated and then the whole car was rust proofed underneath, in hollow sections and doors etc. It has a 10 year guarantee providing it is reinspected annually at a cost of £80 which includes treatment of any areas of concern. The company could have fitted new parts if required, or made any not available as they specialise also in car restorations. In all other respects the car is immaculate and drives well. He bought it a LR approved at three years old and it has been trouble free apart from a rear diff whine, which LR sorted as it was a know problem in some FL2s. He recently thought about changing it and took a three year old Quashqai for a test drive. He liked it, but then decided it wasn't for him and why spend so much just to change when the FL2 does everything required of it.

RustProofing.Wales - RustOust South Wales Rust & Underbody Sealing Treatments

 

[ProfJohnL]

There have been some horror rust stories over the years.

I suspect many of the cars produced just after WW2, were still affected by material quality and shortages which ravaged the economy until the late 50's. Then during the 60's the independent UK manufacturers were mostly swallowed up into the just four large groups, all of whom (management and Unions) put finances in front of quality resulting in penny pinching which deprived most models of life saving rust protection.

From cars we've had in the family and my own we have seen how

When we saw the first Japanese products arriving, Japan was an eager exporter to the UK, their home products were already RH drive, and of a physical size not too dissimilar to our native offerings. But they hadn't fully considered the UK climate, and a lot of the early imports rusted terribly - even worse than the UK manufactured products.

Apart from the lack of effective rust prevention, many imported vehicles seemed to use thinner gauge steel, and this wouldn't last as long after rust had taken hold as most UK products.

Thankfully legacy car makers do seem to have improved their rust prevention, but I admit to being concerned about the raft of new brands coming from China.

We are seeing glowing reports about the vehicles the Chinese have so far presented, and how they seem to have identified the market area to target. They do seem to lack some of ride and handling of the legacy marques. What hasn't yet been reported are the levels of reliability (becasue they are all to new) and whether they will stand up to the climate and environmental conditions we have.

I have seen one report that conclude the panel thickness of one Chinese model was very thin as it bucked just closing the boot. Have they also forgotten the rust proofing?

 

[Buckman]

Even the initial imported Japanese cars suffered from rust in the British climate but they swiftly rectified the issue by rustproofing cars for export as the lack of salt used on roads in Japan meant that rust wasn't an issue in their home market.

Salt not used on roads in SA, but Japanese cars suffered from rust or corrosion due to the high salt content in the air. I must admit I still miss the smell of the sea on a hot summer's day.

 

[otherclive]

Salt not used on roads in SA, but Japanese cars suffered from rust or corrosion due to the high salt content in the air. I must admit I still miss the smell of the sea on a hot summer's day.

Grey imports from Japan would not have the corrosion proofing that European makers used. My 1995 Pajero was such an import, and because it was bought for off roading I took it to a place in Malvern who gave it the full Dinitrol treatment. But even so after each outing where there was mud I would spend a while hosing it down and pushing the hose into the chassis cavities. Amazing the amount of mud/silt that would finish up on the drive.

 

[Jcloughie]

We had a nice holiday in Angleley 50 years ago when the kids were small. My newish Opal was not drivable due to faults later rectified. So a friend lent me his very large old Mercedes auto. We felt quite special.

It had seat belts which were very new to us so we used them religously.

Before returning we gave it a very good clean. That is when I discovered that the seat belt retension points were only held in by the carpetsl, no substance left below that.

John

 

[Buckman]

Grey imports from Japan would not have the corrosion proofing that European makers used. My 1995 Pajero was such an import, and because it was bought for off roading I took it to a place in Malvern who gave it the full Dinitrol treatment. But even so after each outing where there was mud I would spend a while hosing it down and pushing the hose into the chassis cavities. Amazing the amount of mud/silt that would finish up on the drive.

These were definitely not grey imports as came straight from Toyota factory. They were testing the market and later built the Toyota manufacturing plant at Prospecton in Natal. Toyota then becamne the number one selling car in South Africa within 5 years mainly due to reliability. Apologies for the quick history lesson. LOL!

 

[Dustydog]

All current Volkswagen vehicles are fully protected during manufacture against through corrosion for 12 years from the date of first registration.

A good boast and one that attracted me. But there are strict terms to be observed,

The small bash last year was repaired by the TP Insurers own approved repairer. It comes with a life time guarantee as long as I still own the car.
Why I ask can’t caravan manufacturers progress in the same direction 😄😄😄

 

[Mel]

Back in the seventies when I bought my first car, standard testing procedure for buying a motor was to kick the sills, to see if they caved in. My Austin Allegro was largely held together by chicken wire, plastic padding and the odd empty drinking chocolate tin, that my Dad had plastered in for additional strength. Happy days.
mel

 

[Dustydog]

Back in the seventies when I bought my first car, standard testing procedure for buying a motor was to kick the sills, to see if they caved in. My Austin Allegro was largely held together by chicken wire, plastic padding and the odd empty drinking chocolate tin, that my Dad had plastered in for additional strength. Happy days.
mel

Austin Aggro and quartic steering wheel🤮

 

[ProfJohnL]

...... quartic steering wheel🤮

It cant have been all bad, as several new cars are actually moving towards them again.

 

[Buckman]

It cant have been all bad, as several new cars are actually moving towards them again.

I thought that the one spoke steering on the Citroen DB 20 was very nice. I wonder why it was never followed on?

 

[Dustydog]

It cant have been all bad, as several new cars are actually moving towards them again.

https://www.carscoops.com/2021/09/questionable-design-trends-squared-steering-wheels/amp/

It seems the latest trend is rectangular.
What happened to the old phrase “Reinvent the wheel “?