Noseweights on Euro cars

[Rod_374231824]

Hello from sunny Melbourne, Australia. What's a crummy Australian doing on your forum? Well I'm very confused with the ratings of towbars fitted to European cars and I'm hoping someone may be able to explain.

I've got my eye on the Peugeot 307 2.0L HDi Touring as a family/towcar - big boot, big torque, big economy. And it's towing capacity is about 1500kg, which is plenty. So what's the catch? The Peugeot supplied towbar has a max. ball weight of about 80 kg - and every 'van in Australia, apart from some really tiny ones, has a dry ball weight of considerably more than this. For example my Jayco Eagle camper weighs about 950 kg and has an empty ball weight ( I think you guys call it noseweight) of about 100 kg. And that makes it illegal for me to tow my van with the Peugeot, and just about every European car you can think of.

Here in Oz it is drummed into us that you should have about 10% of the van' total weight "on the ball" - much more and the cars rear will sag, much less and it's prone to sway. Thus an average 1400kg 16 ft van would have about 140kg "on the ball". An experienced Aussie vanner would never tow a 1400kg van with only 75kg on the ball - he'd think it crazy. Towbars here are rated accordingly - my Holden Commodore has a "light duty 'bar":1200kg total capacity/120kg ball weight, the heavy duty bar is rated at 1600/160.

So why, why, why? Why this incompatability between Aussie vans and Euro cars?

Rod H.

 

[Angus1]

Hello, sunny Melbourne.

Can`t really answer your questions in an absolute fashion, only to say that 7% is the accepted `target` over here for nose- weight.

No doubt this figure is as a result of a number of studies blah,blah,blah..........

Suffice it to say that the European roads aren`t exactly littered with overturned `vans, but I can`t comment on engineering differences between the two hemispheres.

Depending upon the build of the `van (i.e suspension, length of drawbar, axle position etc.) there may be fundamental reasons why the nose-weight is higher, also is it as a result of Aussies traditionally towing with `utes`, which normally have a greater loading capacity on their rear suspension?

 

[Lutz]

The relatively low noseweights in Europe (or high ones in Australia, whichever you want to look at it) has historical reasons. European cars have never been designed for high noseweights so we've become used to towing with less. In order to give us Europeans a chance to tow with what we've got, we make do with lower noseweights than down under.

As Angus says, we don't have any major problems despite this.

 

[Rod_374231824]

I think you've got it there, Mr Lutz ( or would you prefer"Lutzy"). The traditional Oz family car has a big 6 cyl. or V8 up front, weighs a ton and is built tough. Thus van manafacturers aren't really bothered about how much weight is up front - just plonk it on the towball and drive off into the suset. And big 4WD's, which a lot of people use for towing, probably helped the trend for increasing weights.

Also load-levelling hitches have become a necessity to keep the car's rear from dragging on the ground. Even my little Jayco needs them.

It's going to be a problem in future for us Aussies with the cost of fuel skyrocketing people are looking for alternatives to big 4wd's and traditional Aussie cars. The current diesels from Citroen, Peugeot, VW etc would seem to be ideal but none of them currently can legally tow a normal van in Australia. Sad.

Thanks for the replies,

Rod

 

[Steve L]

Lutz has basically got it right. The auzzie cars are basically built like brick dunnies. They come with suspension to cope with the tracks once the blacktop runs out.

A pommy or euro car will not be so capable, but so long as you don't intend to go "bush" then they will tow a caravan. I tow a 1365Kg twin axle 20 foot caravan behind my 2 Litre petrol Renault Laguna without any major drama's. Hills can be a bit slow but no more than a laden truck can do.

I have a 75Kg max hitch weight which is quite acceptable to tow with.

By loading your van to get the hitch weight of around 75Kgs and ensuring your hitch is well greased to enable the brakes on the van to work correctly then you should be fine.

Fuel economy should be a massive improvement and with a diesel you could be looking at upto 50miles per gallon for the solo car and about 30mpg towing.

Euro cars will need a safari filter pack to cope with dusty conditions and you will more than likely need to have added cooling fans for the radiator to cope with your high 30 Deg C summer temperatures.

I certainly have fun showing our 4X4 friends just how capable my little 2 Litre 2 wheel drive is.

Cheers

Steve.

 

[MalcolmL]

Lutz has basically got it right. The auzzie cars are basically built like brick dunnies. They come with suspension to cope with the tracks once the blacktop runs out.

A pommy or euro car will not be so capable, but so long as you don't intend to go "bush" then they will tow a caravan. I tow a 1365Kg twin axle 20 foot caravan behind my 2 Litre petrol Renault Laguna without any major drama's. Hills can be a bit slow but no more than a laden truck can do.

I have a 75Kg max hitch weight which is quite acceptable to tow with.

By loading your van to get the hitch weight of around 75Kgs and ensuring your hitch is well greased to enable the brakes on the van to work correctly then you should be fine.

Fuel economy should be a massive improvement and with a diesel you could be looking at upto 50miles per gallon for the solo car and about 30mpg towing.

Euro cars will need a safari filter pack to cope with dusty conditions and you will more than likely need to have added cooling fans for the radiator to cope with your high 30 Deg C summer temperatures.

I certainly have fun showing our 4X4 friends just how capable my little 2 Litre 2 wheel drive is.

Cheers

Steve.

Does "a bit slow uphill" not mean that your Laguna is not truly capable? Not being funny but a friend who had a Laguna had a terrible job keeping within weight guidelines.

Malcolm

 

[graham_5040474]

Lutz has basically got it right. The auzzie cars are basically built like brick dunnies. They come with suspension to cope with the tracks once the blacktop runs out.

A pommy or euro car will not be so capable, but so long as you don't intend to go "bush" then they will tow a caravan. I tow a 1365Kg twin axle 20 foot caravan behind my 2 Litre petrol Renault Laguna without any major drama's. Hills can be a bit slow but no more than a laden truck can do.

I have a 75Kg max hitch weight which is quite acceptable to tow with.

By loading your van to get the hitch weight of around 75Kgs and ensuring your hitch is well greased to enable the brakes on the van to work correctly then you should be fine.

Fuel economy should be a massive improvement and with a diesel you could be looking at upto 50miles per gallon for the solo car and about 30mpg towing.

Euro cars will need a safari filter pack to cope with dusty conditions and you will more than likely need to have added cooling fans for the radiator to cope with your high 30 Deg C summer temperatures.

I certainly have fun showing our 4X4 friends just how capable my little 2 Litre 2 wheel drive is.

Cheers

Steve.

Most caravanners in the UK would kill for towcar with an 80kg noseweight capacity!

Cheers

Graham