Plastic "TYRE SAVERS"

[brian_c]

Hello all. Has anyone got experience of using Tyre savers. These can be used when leaving the caravan for a period without use.
I spotted them in the Tow Sure showroom at Sheffield and thought the idea sounded ok. The sales blurb states thats the plastic supports are shaped to distribute the load over a larger area of the tyre which helps the tyre through prolonged inactivity.
I suppose the down side of them would be that the van would have to be jacked up to allow the supports to be slid under. and likewise to remove them. (Although my motor mover may drive the van on and off I would have to try it)
I didn't want to bother if the general feeling from the forum was a bit negative.
My van is probably only inactive for a couple of months ie: December - January
So I would appreciate anyones thoughts.
Regards Brian

 

[RogerL]

They're probably a good idea for caravans on a seasonal pitch or only used for one trip a year but that's all.
If you're going to do anything during the winter - rest the suspension as recommended by Alko, so raise the caravan securely onto axle stands and remove the wheels, storing them in the dark to reduce the UV deterioration.
Winter wheels, which bolt to the wheel hubs, allow the road wheels to be taken off but don't allow the suspension to be rested.

 

[Lutz]

Tyres won't suffer even if they get a flat spot after standing idle for some time. It will soon be 'ironed out' after a couple of miles of use. Think of all the cars and caravans standing around at dealers for months on end without 'tyre savers', and yet no worse for wear. The only possible advantage is that they may reduce possible slight shake for a short time until the flat spot disappears.

 

[colin-yorkshire1]

if you increas the pressures of the tyes up to or just below the recommended max stamped on the tyre you wont get a flat spot.
just rember to reduce them before use,
as Roger suggests the best course of action is to rest the suspension by jacking up and placing on axel stands, thats how mine is now has been since the last trip in october although I do not remove the wheels as it is in a garage, and does not get UV light, and of course no flat spots,

 

[brian_c]

Thank you everyone for your replies. I won't bother with the supports. The point regarding new and second hand vans standing for months in dealers yards without problems says everything. Had I thought of it I could have answered my own question. Now also I am reminded about the method of increasing the tyre pressures whilst the van is inactive I have previously read that somewhere and it had left my mind. I think increasing the pressure will be my method for this season and I will set myself up with suitable axle stands for next year. I really must re-read the information pack I received with the van I hadn't picked up on the ALKO advice before.
I appreciate everyone who has taken the trouble to reply with excellent advice.

Best regards Brian

 

[Gafferbill]

I agree with RogerL who has given the definitive answer.......buy axle stands.

Tyres can put up with a lot of abuse and that is what I personally would call Lutz's approach.
Tyres on single axle caravans are more highly stressed as compared with tyres on cars and vans or twin axle caravans.
I think they warrant extra care to avoid any hassle when I least want any.

My caravans tyres are raised off the ground with the caravan on axle stands all year round whenever the caravan is not in use for periods longer than 1 week.
Most would call this excessive......but then I am expecting the tyres to perform trouble free with 3000 towing miles this February/March........and that is just the first trip planned for next year

 

[Surfer]

They're probably a good idea for caravans on a seasonal pitch or only used for one trip a year but that's all.
If you're going to do anything during the winter - rest the suspension as recommended by Alko, so raise the caravan securely onto axle stands and remove the wheels, storing them in the dark to reduce the UV deterioration.
Winter wheels, which bolt to the wheel hubs, allow the road wheels to be taken off but don't allow the suspension to be rested.

Do you or any one else on the forum follow Alko's recommendation? Not sure why you would need to rest the suspension if you have shock absorbers. When the caravans are in storage waiting sale by the dealer, I wonder if they jack them up. Surely UV is a lot lower in the winter and the effect is negligible?

 

[Lutz]

Tyres on single axle caravans are more highly stressed as compared with tyres on cars and vans or twin axle caravans.
I think they warrant extra care to avoid any hassle when I least want any.

I see no evidence in support of a theory that tyres on a single axle caravan are any more highly stressed than on cars, vans or twin axle caravans. Agreed, the loads may be higher, but then their load rating is appropriately higher, too. Their design and construction take the more severe conditions into account. Hence, the stresses won't be any higher despite higher loads.
I have yet to hear of reports that anyone has had problems after taking delivery of a caravan that has been standing on a dealer's lot for several months.

 

[david_rachel]

...and just adding to what Lutz has wriiten - there are no loads to speak of on a stationary caravan; the loads come when the caravan is driven at normal speeds over pots holes and the like. The only time to worry about a stationnary caravan (or car for that matter) is if you have cross plies fitted. You won't even get a temporary flat spot with a radial.

 

[RogerL]

Do you or any one else on the forum follow Alko's recommendation? Not sure why you would need to rest the suspension if you have shock absorbers. When the caravans are in storage waiting sale by the dealer, I wonder if they jack them up. Surely UV is a lot lower in the winter and the effect is negligible?

Yes - I do seek them out and follow Alko's recommendations - can't speak for others.
Dampers (aka shock absorbers) have no effect on the "spring" element of any suspension, rubber in our case - nor do they play any part when the caravan's stationary.
Dealers can't be expected to have long-term interests in caravans they sell, other than to charge for subsequent rectification work !
UV is lower in winter due to the shorter days - the lack of sunshine doesn't reduce UV very much.

 

[colin-yorkshire1]

Do you or any one else on the forum follow Alko's recommendation? Not sure why you would need to rest the suspension I allways rest the suspension over the winter as a matter of course, the reason for this is that the alko chasis, does not have springs like the older caravan chasis used to have, but indespension units. all one of these units is, is basically a square bar inside a square tube with a rubber insert at each corner the unit works by squashing the rubber insert and over time can stress the insert "like squashing a "O" ring" relaxing the load allows the insert to regain it's shape, I learned this at my cost a few years ago when a suspension unit colapsed on a boat trailer I had, the new unit clearly stated that the unit should be rested between each use and not left to carry the full load,
one other point to this is that when the van is stored over winter whats in the van stays in the van, so its allways nearer the MTPLM than the MIRO ie fullyloaded resting the suspension takes all the weight off. like resting your feet after a long walk.
if you have shock absorbers.
shock absorbers or dampers have no effect on the suspension load as they do not assist it (unlike spring assisters that do) but you cannot fit these to a indespension unit. exept for a coil over all dampers do is take out the quick movement that is exerted on the stub axel through road undulations and stiffens the motion caused by them,in either direction
When the caravans are in storage waiting sale by the dealer, I wonder if they jack them up.
probably not but there could be several reasons for this, one would be that vans stored pre PDI would weigh no more than the MIRO or even less as some of the equipment would not yet be fitted, in the case of pre owned vans most are sold as seen so there would unlikely be any combacks from suspension problems suffered by the new owner over time as this would be down to fair wear and tear.
Surely UV is a lot lower in the winter and the effect is negligible?
this would depend on the position the van is stored at mine yes it's in a garage, but consider this if the van is stored east to west during the winter one wheel will be in perminant shade while the other is in whatever sun there is all day every day the sun shines. if the van is stored in the same position year after year after (5 years) the difference will be noticable.

 

[Lutz]

When the caravans are in storage waiting sale by the dealer, I wonder if they jack them up.
probably not but there could be several reasons for this, one would be that vans stored pre PDI would weigh no more than the MIRO or even less as some of the equipment would not yet be fitted, in the case of pre owned vans most are sold as seen so there would unlikely be any combacks from suspension problems suffered by the new owner over time as this would be down to fair wear and tear.

The difference in MIRO and a fully laden caravan is only about 10 to 20%, a difference which the tyres will hardly notice. I have never taken the weight off the wheels of my caravan although I've had it laid up on occasions for more than a year without using it. Only the tyre pressure was raised during storage. I can't say that I've ever noticed any problems when towing it again after even such along period.

 

[colin-yorkshire1]

hi Lutz, Good morning and merry christmas.
I have no Doubt that what you say is true, and in fact there are probably some vans out there now 20/25 years old still in good condition that have never been rested and still have the original tyres fitted at the factory. but that is not the point
the fact that Alko recommend resting the suspension during lay up and changing the tyres every 5 years wether there is anything wrong with them or not means something,
may be it is just a preventitive measure but as the Tesco ad says "every little helps"

 

[Gafferbill]

These three leaflets contain
information on this subject.

I think everyone that owns a caravan
should read them.
The Caravan Club leaflet is the best if you only want to read one!

http://www.tyresafe.org/images/campaigns/caravan_tyre_safety_leaflet.pdf

quote from the above Tyresafe
advice leaflet..............

Check
your tyres regularly but particularly when the caravan

has
not been used for some time. Vehicles such as caravans

or
trailer tents, which are not used normally during winter,

should
be thoroughly inspected prior to re-use during the

summer
months. Look particularly for any sign of age

deterioration
in the tyres such as sidewall cracking and

carcass
deformation. Tyres on a stationary vehicle, particularly

if
parked in coastal areas, always age more quickly than

those
in regular and frequent use. If your caravan/trailer tent

is
going to stand for any length of time, it is wise to cover the

tyres
and to shield them from direct sunlight and if possible

jack
the weight off the tyres.
If in doubt about the

condition
of your tyres, have them checked immediately

by
a tyre specialist.

There
is no known technical data that supports a specific

tyre
age for removal from service. However, in the interests

of
safety a number of vehicle and tyre manufacturers

recommend
that tyres (including spare tyres) that were

manufactured
more than a certain number of years

previously
be replaced with new tyres, even when they

appear
to be usable from their external appearance and

the
tread may not have reached the minimum wear out

depth.
It is recommended that any such instruction be

followed.
Consumers should note that most tyres would

have
to be removed for tread wear-out or other causes

before
any prescribed age is reached. A stated removal

period
in no way reduces the consumer’s responsibility

to
replace tyres as needed.

…...................................................................................

http://www.caravanclub.co.uk/media/1022844/caravan-tyres-and-wheels-mo.pdf

quotes from the above Caravan Club
technical help leaflet........................

If
the caravan is not used for a significant length of time, it is
recommended that the wheels and tyres are removed and stored at
normal inflation pressure in a cool, dry place and protected from
direct sunlight, sources of heat, ozone concentrations and fuel/oil
spillages. They can be covered with a natural material (eg. hessian)
for protection, but not plastic. If wheels must be left on, rotate
them regularly, so that the caravan‟s weight does not rest on one
area of the tyre all the time.

…......................................................................................

http://www.campingandcaravanningclub.co.uk/

quote
from the above Camping and Caravan Club technical help
leaflet........................

Tyres
– these do not like standing around on the same piece

of
tread for long periods. Consider turning the wheels, say every

six
to eight weeks, to alleviate any problems, and ensure

pressures
are correct. Ideally shield the tyres from sunlight to

help
prevent degradation of the rubber but avoid using plastic

bags
that seal the wheel and bearings and may cause

condensation
in the hub. Winter wheels (special clamps instead

of
wheels) can be used, but they do not meet the required

criteria
for some caravan insurance policies.

 

[Surfer]

These three leaflets contain
information on this subject.

I think everyone that owns a caravan
should read them.
The Caravan Club leaflet is the best if you only want to read one!

http://www.tyresafe.org/images/campaigns/caravan_tyre_safety_leaflet.pdf

quote from the above Tyresafe
advice leaflet..............

Check
your tyres regularly but particularly when the caravan

has
not been used for some time. Vehicles such as caravans

or
trailer tents, which are not used normally during winter,

should
be thoroughly inspected prior to re-use during the

summer
months. Look particularly for any sign of age

deterioration
in the tyres such as sidewall cracking and

carcass
deformation. Tyres on a stationary vehicle, particularly

if
parked in coastal areas, always age more quickly than

those
in regular and frequent use. If your caravan/trailer tent

is
going to stand for any length of time, it is wise to cover the

tyres
and to shield them from direct sunlight and if possible

jack
the weight off the tyres.
If in doubt about the

condition
of your tyres, have them checked immediately

by
a tyre specialist.

There
is no known technical data that supports a specific

tyre
age for removal from service. However, in the interests

of
safety a number of vehicle and tyre manufacturers

recommend
that tyres (including spare tyres) that were

manufactured
more than a certain number of years

previously
be replaced with new tyres, even when they

appear
to be usable from their external appearance and

the
tread may not have reached the minimum wear out

depth.
It is recommended that any such instruction be

followed.
Consumers should note that most tyres would

have
to be removed for tread wear-out or other causes

before
any prescribed age is reached. A stated removal

period
in no way reduces the consumer’s responsibility

to
replace tyres as needed.

…...................................................................................

http://www.caravanclub.co.uk/media/1022844/caravan-tyres-and-wheels-mo.pdf

quotes from the above Caravan Club
technical help leaflet........................

If
the caravan is not used for a significant length of time, it is
recommended that the wheels and tyres are removed and stored at
normal inflation pressure in a cool, dry place and protected from
direct sunlight, sources of heat, ozone concentrations and fuel/oil
spillages. They can be covered with a natural material (eg. hessian)
for protection, but not plastic. If wheels must be left on, rotate
them regularly, so that the caravan‟s weight does not rest on one
area of the tyre all the time.

…......................................................................................

http://www.campingandcaravanningclub.co.uk/

quote
from the above Camping and Caravan Club technical help
leaflet........................

Tyres
– these do not like standing around on the same piece

of
tread for long periods. Consider turning the wheels, say every

six
to eight weeks, to alleviate any problems, and ensure

pressures
are correct. Ideally shield the tyres from sunlight to

help
prevent degradation of the rubber but avoid using plastic

bags
that seal the wheel and bearings and may cause

condensation
in the hub. Winter wheels (special clamps instead

of
wheels) can be used, but they do not meet the required

criteria
for some caravan insurance policies.

After reading that lot, how can caravanning be an enjoyable pastime or hobby as far too many hassles? Might as well pack it in and give up now. No such hassles booking holiday cottage or hotel.

 

[Gafferbill]

Surfer.........a legitimate point of view but it is still important to know what best practice is so that you can decide what is or is not for you if you own a caravan.

 

[colin-yorkshire1]

After reading that lot, how can caravanning be an enjoyable pastime or hobby as far too many hassles? Might as well pack it in and give up now. No such hassles booking holiday cottage or hotel.

you think caravanning is a hassle you should try owning and using a boat? or any of the other hobbies or pastimes,
by nature a hobby is time consuming thats the point most also cost a large wedge of cash for little gain exept the pleasure one gets out of it, if you cannot see that it my well be time to pack it in and use hotels.

 

[FrintonMike]

If you use the caravan all year the problem.is solved
This month we have been to Kingsbury Water Park and next week we are off to Ferry Meadows.
Wife has not told me where we are off to after that. I just do the driving ????????

 

[Lutz]

If you use the caravan all year the problem.is solved

What problem? Has anyone actually experienced a problem?

 

[Gafferbill]

What problem? Has anyone actually experienced a problem?

.......we have had that discussion before over 4 years ago......see here

 

[Lutz]

I've just had a look at that old thread and I can't find an answer to my question anywhere.
Considering the vast majority of caravans stay on their wheels while in storage one would have thought that the problem, if there really is one, would have come to people's attention long ago. One would also expect complaints from customers taking delivery of stock (both caravans and cars) which has been standing around at the dealers for months on end, especially if the dealers were taking no action.

 

[RogerL]

It's possible, perhaps likely, that this "precaution" from the 1960s when caravans had cross-ply tyres and were literally only used for one holiday / year.
If you think of tyres in engineering terms, the contact patch always approximates to flat, even when rotating, and is constantly changing from round to flat and back when going along which must introduce far more stress into the steel/cord/canvas elements of the tyres.
I go along with Lutz's point that there's no evidence of tyre damage on cars or caravans while in the distributor/dealer supply chain - some of them being there for years.

 

[colin-yorkshire1]

I've just had a look at that old thread and I can't find an answer to my question anywhere.
Considering the vast majority of caravans stay on their wheels while in storage one would have thought that the problem, if there really is one, would have come to people's attention long ago. One would also expect complaints from customers taking delivery of stock (both caravans and cars) which has been standing around at the dealers for months on end, especially if the dealers were taking no action.

hi Lutz, (red bit) it is a problem that has been known about for years, well to me anyway

, the suspension colapse happened in 1996 on a trailer that was about 10years old and had been kept out in the open all it's life with a motor boat sat on it?. prior to the colapse the wheels had to be taken off most times before use, because they were either flat or out of shape, I did have a couple of spares that were rotated from time to time. I changed the indespension unit and immediately noticed that the trailer sat lop sided by about 1in (25mm) on inspection the stub axel was at a different angle from the new one because the insert rubbers had been squashed by about half their thickness, so I had to change the other one as well

on reading the care and maintenance leaflet on the new units it clearly stated that the suspension units should be rested when not in use. after that I jacked up the trailer and stood it on blocks, whenever it was parked at home, after that I had no further trouble with either suspension or tyres.
similar story with the motor home, it was to big to use as everyday transport so it spent a lot of time just parked up, but I allways tried to use it at least once a week to charge the battery run the engine and rotate the wheels.

(blue bit) I assume you have forgotten about the PDI inspection that is given to cars/caravans before the customer collects the vehicles, yes it may have been stood for months before being sold but evey one would have been moved, cleaned, serviced, battery charged, and wheels checked possibly (in cars MOT' tested as well) well before the customer acctually collects it so it is unlikely that there would be any complaints of this nature to report.

 

[Lutz]

You are not honestly suggesting that a possible flat spot on a tyre can cause the suspension to collapse, are you? There must have been something seriously wrong with it beforehand for a minor issue like a not quite round tyre to result in damage like that. Irregularities in the road surface are bound to contribute a lot more to loads in the suspension than a flat spot on the tyre.
And do you really believe that dealers will check for possible flat spots on tyres during a PDI inspection? I think that would be a bit naive.
It still doesn't answer the question why one never hears of problems when people pick up their caravans out of storage after resting for months on end on their wheels, or if there are problems, any evidence that these are directly attributable to the tyres having flat spots.
When I'm not using my towcar for an extended period I do notice a slight rumble during the first few miles, but it soon disappears. There is no reason to assume that the caravan would be affected any more than that and it would be difficult to detect when sitting in the car anyway.

 

[Gafferbill]

Lutz.........you have in the past posted that you could only find one make of tyre that had the performance required by your caravan as to the weight loading.
Would you accept that single axle caravan tyres operate at around 90% of their load range (if inflated correctly)?
Would you accept that cars tyres operate at around 50% of their load range (if inflated correctly)?
Would you accept that single axle caravan tyres work harder than car tyres because of this?

If you do not accept this, then you do not accept that tyres are doing work by just supporting a given weight even when stationary......and you will not see a problem.

I believe most of the work a tyre does in its lifetime is the work of supporting weight.
The work the tread does is finite and when the compound has had enough it is jettisoned ( tread wear)
We can cope with tread wear .......we just buy a new tyre.
This is what happens with cars........side wall deterioration does not have enough time to present itself as a problem.
The work a tyre side wall does and its weakening because of the work it is doing is not so obvious and it takes much longer than tread wear to manifest itself. Caravan dealers do not concern themselves with caravans standing around because it will not cause a problem in the first few years of a tyres life.
This side wall weakening is not an exact science........ we deal with it by recommending tyres be replaced before they are 5-7 years old as a blanket measure.
If this tyre replacement is done then I think you would agree that the tyre would likely be more reliable in year 1 than in years 5-7.

When the caravan is stationary for long periods rotating the wheels or taking the weight off them helps to keep their reliability performance more like that of a younger tyre.

You rightly say that most owners do not bother with this hassle.

This insurance company, in business to make a profit, offers this advice presumably to save itself the cost of carrying out costly repairs.

http://www.caravanguard.co.uk/news/check-your-caravans-tyres-2893/