Preventing water in Aquaroll freezing

[james108_374227417]

To prevent water in the Aquaroll from freezing I am thinking of buying a tropical fish tank water heater and dropping it into the Aquaroll, or should I say lowering it in gently, with the pump. As these heaters come with an inbuilt thermostat it will cut out when the Aquaroll is empty so there should be no problem with it burning out, also, the thermostat can be set at any temperature so a low temperature setting should be adequate to prevent freezing.

It so happens that on my van there is a 240 volt external socket outlet located next to the water intake so no problem with power supply.

Obviously this system can only be used when on a site with EHU.

If this idea is thought to be a no-no I do have a large roll of bubble wrap in the garage.

Has anyone used this method or has anyone got any comments to make about the idea ?

 

[JeremyClarksson]

They both sound like good ideas - particularly the fish tank warmer.

I would make sure the 240v electrical connection is not exposed to moisture and should have RCB protection.

 

[Val & Frank]

I think I am correct in saying that the heavy freezing takes place at night time ?? If thats the case why not put the aqua roll in the car at night or even fit an inboard tank. You must be thinking about serious winter vanning if your looking at the Aquaroll freezing. Do the fish tank heaters transform down to a low voltage ??. Hope it all works out for you. Sure some experienced winter vanners will be along soon !!

Val & Frank

 

[Rod_5041370]

I have kept tropical & marine tanks for many years and can assure you that when the heaters become exposed due to pump failures emptying the tank, they invariably fail and at times with the glass fracturing.

I wouldn't go there!

What could work would be stand the aquaroll on something like an upturned milk crate with a low wattage greenhouse tube heater in it. I believe these are around 100 watts per foot.

I use these inside my caravan when in storage with an additional greenhouse thermostat set at 5 degrees.

 

[Rioja]

A simple solution might be to have a tennis ball floating inside !

 

[john_5040735]

Hi James - why not just buy a purpose made insulated aquaroll cover, and pump cover, from "bags 4 everything". Have had one years and it does the job really well. Never had a frozen tank! I suspect the limit is somewhere around -6/7 degrees.

John

 

[Rioja]

OK, seriously, where are you thinking of going, and for that matter what do you need the water for ?

The reality is that the water in your aquaroll is unlikely to freeze in an overnight frost, only if you have very prolonged severe minus degree temperatures.You can buy an insulating jacket but I wouldn't bother.

I would think the most vulnerable part is the pump and water inlet.You could insulate them, remove the pump even.

You can defrost them both by making sure you keep a supply of water to boil in the kettle.We only use the aquaroll for showering and washing up water,we keep a seperate container in the van for drinking water and cooking.

My old Lunar Clubman had a water inlet sited in the shower/toilet. It was a selling point for winter caravanning at the time but you could neither shower nor use the toilet with an aquaroll there. I never even tried to use it as it was never necessary.

Fitting an onboard water tank is expensive and, in my opinion not really of much value.

 

[Surfer]

I think I am correct in saying that the heavy freezing takes place at night time ?? If thats the case why not put the aqua roll in the car at night or even fit an inboard tank. You must be thinking about serious winter vanning if your looking at the Aquaroll freezing. Do the fish tank heaters transform down to a low voltage ??. Hope it all works out for you. Sure some experienced winter vanners will be along soon !!

Val & Frank

Have you tried lifting a full 40 litre aquaroll into the back of your vehicle?

 

[Val & Frank]

Have you tried lifting a full 40 litre aquaroll into the back of your vehicle?

Do they not make half full ones from where you come from !!!

Val & Frank

 

[BigAl1]

Do they not make half full ones from where you come from !!!

Val & Frank

I could only get an half empty one which of course is much heavier.

 

[crusader_5040706]

james, as water in the aquaroll (or any water infact) freezes from the top downwards it is really only the top that neads a "hat" .in the two winters that we have vanned all i use is an old waterproof coat( an old work one with inbuilt padded liner)and i put the pump through one of the sleeves, works for us, jim

 

[Val & Frank]

I could only get an half empty one which of course is much heavier.

Hey Ian you must be a bit of a wimp. Can't lift a half full/empty Aquaroll ??? Suggest you build a lttle ramp to get one into your car.

Val & Frank

 

[trucker]

We had a heavy frost last week whilst out in the van, the water in the aquaroll did freeze about 2mm on the top of the water. I was more woried about the connectiion from the aquaroll to the van more than the aquaroll so I removed it for the night seamed to do the trick.

Should I turn the pump switch off whilst no water hose conected, we have an inboard pump??

Kevin H

 

[james108_374227417]

Thanks very much for your suggestions. And I thought it was a good idea! but obviously it wasn't.

I think I will go down the `old coat` route but you never know, Father Christmas might bring me an insulated cover from Bags 4 Everything.

Thanks once again to all for taking the trouble to reply - very much appreciated.

Oh, and also the clutch of comedians.

 

[Steve L]

What I do for my frost protection is to first of all erect our scenic proch awning at the aqua roll point on the van. This gives wind chill protection. Then I wrap the aqua roll in a houshold hot water cylinder jacket and put some grey pipe insulation over the pump pipe.

By using my other 29litre aqua roll as the carrier I can leave the main one in situ and then just top up on a daily basis as required.

My waste water exit is also within the porch awning area so tht doesn't freeze either so long as I empty that last thing in the evening.

This has worked well right down to -10 deg C so far.

Also I've got my own shelter so I'm not a "brass monkey" when tending to the water. I keep the beer andwine there too, a bit like having your own cellar.

Mind you so folk take the mick about "he's put the awning on the wrong side", but of coarse they are trundleing back and fore every few hours with their 5 litre bottled water in hand.

If it gets colder I put a 500 watt halogen heater in the awning which has it like a green house.

Steve.

Steve.

 

[JeremyClarksson]

Steve in Leo = Scott of the antarctic?

 

[Steve L]

Naa just bloody mad getting stuck in skipton late January.

The van was very warm but the car had all the doors froze solid and a duff battery.

Winter caravanning is great so long as you prepare for the worst and then things only get better.

Steve.

 

[RayS]

You could always add some "antifreeze" - try Bells or Famous Grouse.

 

[JeremyClarksson]

I have not tried it but adding a kettle of hot water before bed has to help stave off freezing for a little longer.

We use seperate drinking water so I can not see a problem with this.

Also on this tack if you want to defrost your windscreen and windows boil HALF a kettle of water and then fill it up with cold and pour over the windows.

One kettle clears all the windows and mirrors on our Alhambra in seconds and the conducted heat clears the inside of the windows as well.

I have not used scrapers etc for years now.

A kettle of boiling water could crack the windscreen if not diluted with cold.

 

[Guest]

We winter in a warmer climate but have winter caravanned in Freezing Germany,Switzerland, France, Belgium and Scandinavia. Our water tank takes up a fraction of the underbed space, a second CAK tanks supplied water tank now fills the remaining space along side after re arranging the pump equipment. I think the water tanks supplied by the Caravan builders are based on basic needs.

It's also great in summer once filled and we've had no trouble with freezing inside the van,same space as the tanks is the heating pipes running through so the storage area keeps quite warm.

The aquaroll just gets used to fill the inboard tanks.

No need for tennis balls or heaters but make sure your drainage pipes do not sag underneath the van as they will hold water that will then freeze and make sure you protect the drainage tap from your water tank as that can do the same.

 

[BrianStAlbans]

Garry, interesting point about adding hot water but in fact hot water freezes faster than cold water. Strange but true. ;O)

 

[JeremyClarksson]

Brian

"hot water freezes faster than cold water"

I think you mean cools faster - this is true because it is cooled by the surrounding temperature, a bit like putting a cup of hot water in the freezer, but hot water can not freeze at normal atmospheric pressures.

If you put milk in a cup of tea straight away it will be warmer after 5 minutes than if you would have put the milk at the end of the 5 mins.

My point of putting hot water in the aquaroll is that it would probably only raise the temperature of the water in the aquaroll by a couple of degrees but tha surrounding temperature has to drop that couple of degrees before it starts from the original temperature and it could help.

 

[BrianStAlbans]

Google " hot water freezes faster than cold water "

and see what comes up. :O)

Brian

 

[David_374224952]

Hi

we got our insulated aquaroll and pipe jacket thingy from www.bags2cover.co.uk

Works a treat, and is really well made.

We looked at others but this was easier to fit as you don't have to lift the aquaroll up as the base is seperate to the main jacket which fits using velcro fastening. Takes about a minute to fit!

Cheers

 

[JeremyClarksson]

Google " hot water freezes faster than cold water "

and see what comes up. :O)

Brian

It appears you are right, If that would have been a pub argument I would probably have bet some silly amount of money on the answer.

I was particularly interested in Mpembas story on this link - Sect II(roman).

http://math.ucr.edu/home/baez/physics/General/hot_water.html