Re. Letter, "Take your seats" C.C. Magazine Feb 2010

[Gareth111278]

Has anyone else seen this letter in the february edition of the magazine?

The authur writes to tell us all about how he's asked everyone from the Queen down if its OK to tow his caravan with 3 seats removed from his MPV. It seems its OK. Thank goodness for that, i can sleep at nights now.

Am I missing something or is it a touch of the 'Top Gear Syndrome' ,answering the questions that no-one is asking?

Seroiusly though, could there be a problem with removing 'removable' seats & towing?

cheers Gareth

[Driver of a Chrysler Voyager with removeable seats]

 

[Sproket]

All he wanted was some more room for the kitchen sink .....

If they just unclip & lift out cant see there being a problem, thats why they call them removable, and it gives you a bit more extra space.

 

[Gareth111278]

Agreed, but why ask NASA if its OK?!

If it wasn't OK to remove the seats they wouldn't be removeable.

Maybe he just wanted to get some post!

 

[JTQ]

We have just casually folded the unused rear seats without a second thought that we were "modifying" the car and thus screwing up the insurance and moving into illegal use of our car.

I am not admitting I do, but if I have put a CD in the cars player, could that get me in trouble?

 

[Gareth111278]

JTQ, If I were you I'd hand my-self in now!

You think you're in trouble, you should see the list of modifications on my Voyager!

I'm leaving the country LOL

 

[Icemaker]

Although it appears to be a silly question and i agree the guy may have gone a little over the top in his requests for clarification he does actually have a valid point, if you remove the seats especially those in the old style galaxy or vw sharan / seat alhambra and those in the voyager then you are actually removing quite a chunk of kerb weight.

Although not theoretically making the outfit illegal you could be making a marginal outfit over 100 % !.

our new style ford galaxy has seats that fold flat in to floor so i have no worries although my towing days are now very numbered as i have posted else where due to cost.

 

[Clive-Cardiff]

I keep the removable seats for my Landcruiser in the loft. I think I have only used them twice since I've had the car. If there was any likelihood of stability problems I don't think they would be made to be removed.

On this same point I have thought a few times of removing the middle row of seats to give me more luggage space in the car for the trips down to Portugal. I think the weight of the seats I remove would be more or less equalled by the extra luggage

 

[marlot]

I keep the removable seats for my Landcruiser in the loft. I think I have only used them twice since I've had the car. If there was any likelihood of stability problems I don't think they would be made to be removed.

On this same point I have thought a few times of removing the middle row of seats to give me more luggage space in the car for the trips down to Portugal. I think the weight of the seats I remove would be more or less equalled by the extra luggage

I'm the same - the 3rd row seats for my landcruiser also live in the loft, and only come out when we take friends and their children away with us. Apart from anything else, you can't use them with the dog guard (not enough room for any feet), so although it takes moments to put the seats in, there are some allen bolts to undo to remove the dog guard.

 

[Surfer]

I read the article and think it is a totally wind up and the writer is a bit thin on the brain cells.

 

[Dave_374330759]

I agree with Ian, some of the questions that get asked are just so thick that they are beyond my comprehension. However over the years I have actually met some of these people and they really and truly don't have a clue. I can't understand it but neither can they so in the end you have to be very patient with them and then go and bash your own head against a brick wall.

 

[Steve_374341117]

I agree that on this occasion the gent was over the top. However we all know insurance companies will use anything to prevent paying up if they have to, even if it has no bearing on the circumstances. They may well construe removing removeable seats as a modification, just as they regard fitting a towbar after purchase of the vehicle as modification and wish to be notified.

 

[Surfer]

If the vehicle has the facility to remove the seats, I can't see how that can be a modifaction. Many cars that have 7 seats allow you to completely remove two of them. If you have to un-bolt them to remove them, then it may be different but probably still not a modification.

 

[Johnnie70100]

Maybe the correspondent was highlighting the issue that if you remove mass from the towcar (in the form of removeable seats), you might end up with at best, a towcar/caravan mass ratio that is less favourable than you might want and at worst, a towcar that is lighter than the caravan.

If that was his intention, it seems he didn't explain it as well as he might. Ho hum.

 

[ProfJohnL]

Not quite the same issue, I recall there was an estate car that had a set of folding rear (3rd row) seats. The manufacturers instructions stated that when towing the the third row of seats were not to be used.

 

[Lutz]

Which estate car was that, John? It doesn't make sense. If it were a matter of payload, then you could have the same amount of weight in the back of the car with the seats folded down as if there was someone sitting on them.

I seem to recall, however, that the old 7-seater Peugeot 504 estate had a significantly lower maximum permissible towload than its saloon counterpart.

 

[Gareth111278]

Peugeot 504 7 seat Estate, now we're going back in time!

I had one when I was in College, [well, it belonged to the family coach hire business] What a motor! I never paid for a drop of petrol as all my mates paid for lifts to & fro. Also a very comfy back seat.......

I don't remember if it even had a tow bar to be honest though.

 

[ProfJohnL]

Which estate car was that, John? It doesn't make sense. If it were a matter of payload, then you could have the same amount of weight in the back of the car with the seats folded down as if there was someone sitting on them.

I seem to recall, however, that the old 7-seater Peugeot 504 estate had a significantly lower maximum permissible towload than its saloon counterpart.

Hello Lutz,

I think you may be right. You have jogged my memory. There was a question posted about towing with a 7 seater (and it probably was the 504). In essence the owner had bought a the vehicle under the impression that the towing limit was the same as the 5 seat version, and was surprised to find after the purchase the 7 seater was actually lower, and to low for their caravan.

They were wondering if they could tow the bigger van if they removed the third row of seats. We concluded that as the weight limit is applied to the VIN number of the car, it was not legal.

 

[Lutz]

By the same token, how about the following letter?:

"I understand that kerbweight includes a full fuel tank. Is it all right to tow on half a tank of petrol?"