Towng with different-sized spare on van

[Kiwimike]

Hi all

We've purchased a new to us van with 175/70 R14's on it - but the spare is a 195/70/R14.

I don't want to needlessly buy a new spare wheel - so what would be the impact of this spare on the handling / safety / braking etc? Obviously ideally it would be the same size spare - but are we talking a noticeable difference?

Thanks

 

[otherclive]

I wouldn’t consider it as caravans can be unsteady trailers if the basics aren’t addressed. Is the spare the same load index as the road tyres, what age are the road and spare tyres. Black circles are selling budget tyres same size as your road tyres for just over £50 inc delivery and fitting. The last thing you want on a motorway are concerns over the integrity of tyres. If the road tyres are five years or older I’d change them anyway.

 

[otherclive]

I wouldn’t consider it as caravans can be unsteady trailers if the basics aren’t addressed. Is the spare the same load index as the road tyres, what age are the road and spare tyres. Black circles are selling budget tyres same size as your road tyres for just over £50 inc delivery and fitting. The last thing you want on a motorway are concerns over the integrity of tyres. If the road tyres are five years or older I’d change them anyway.

PS I should have said that if all you have a available to you in the event of a puncture then providing it meets load index it could be used to get you out of a fix, and taking it steady. Check wheel arch clearance if you had to use it.

 

[birdman101]

195 is the width of the tyre so is a bit wider than the others. As long as there is enough clearance at the sides of the tyre 10 mm each side it should be OK. Just check the rating load on it though ,to make sure it is not lower rated,

 

[audiorob]

If you want to check the tyre age look for a ‘lozenge’ shape on the side wall. 4 digits so as an example 0423 was manufactured in the fourth week of 2023. As noted above the recommendation is to change the tyres after 5 to 7 years regardless of the appearance as they degrade before they wear. Your caravan insurance may specify as a requirement or in a catch-all like ‘ensuring the caravan is well maintained’. Also reported by my AWS service technician on my service record.

 

[otherclive]

195 is the width of the tyre so is a bit wider than the others. As long as there is enough clearance at the sides of the tyre 10 mm each side it should be OK. Just check the rating load on it though ,to make sure it is not lower rated,

With it being wider but the same aspect ratio as the road tyres its rolling diameter will be greater. Hence the reason I recommended to check wheel arch clearance. Also I had a van where its offside axle suspension dropped which reduced arch clearance. So fitting a spare with an increased diameter might have prejudiced the remaining clearance. Just things the OP needs too be aware of. Hopefully the OPs suspension is ticketyboo

 

[GUMPY]

We've purchased a new to us van with 175/70 R14's on it - but the spare is a 195/70/R14.

Which is the correct size?
Could be that a previous owner bought two cheaper tyres to replace the 195's when they wore out and left the spare.
I would check as to exactly what size tyres should be fitted then fit what's needed to make them all the same. Don't forget the loading either as car tyres generally won't do.

I've just done a quick scan of tyre sizes and the one that came up most often was 185 R14 with no aspect ratio. 195/70R14 will have about the same rolling radius so would match. 175/70R14 are quite a bit smaller and cheaper😲

 

[otherclive]

Which is the correct size?
Could be that a previous owner bought two cheaper tyres to replace the 195's when they wore out and left the spare.
I would check as to exactly what size tyres should be fitted then fit what's needed to make them all the same. Don't forget the loading either as car tyres generally won't do.

I've just done a quick scan of tyre sizes and the one that came up most often was 185 R14 with no aspect ratio. 195/70R14 will have about the same rolling radius so would match. 175/70R14 are quite a bit smaller and cheaper😲

The 185 R14 is probably the "C" rated tier with 80% aspect ratio, which I used to fit as if they are good enough for White Van Man they will meet my gentler needs.

 

[Kiwimike]

195 is the width of the tyre so is a bit wider than the others. As long as there is enough clearance at the sides of the tyre 10 mm each side it should be OK. Just check the rating load on it though ,to make sure it is not lower rated,

The spare rating is 96, the fitted tyres are 88 - or 560kg. The van was originally plated for 1000kg, then uprated to 1200kg by the last owner.

It has a MiRO of 820kg - it's had movers added (+32kg) so still has 268kg to match the tyre maximum. I think that's plenty for a 2-berth

 

[GUMPY]

Sounds a good payload, what van is it?

 

[GUMPY]

The spare rating is 96, the fitted tyres are 88 - or 560kg. The van was originally plated for 1000kg, then uprated to 1200kg by the last owner.

If the tyres are rated at 560kg each that's only 1120kg, fine at 1000kg but below the 1200kg MTPLM.

What does the handbook say about tyres?

 

[Kiwimike]

Sounds a good payload, what van is it?

1990 Cotswold Windrush 132 - bit of a retro find.

 

[RogerL]

1990 Cotswold Windrush 132 - bit of a retro find.

How on earth can anyone upgrade the MTPLM on an old caravan like that? The original manufacturer has long since disappeared - owners can't upgrade their own caravan!

 

[Kiwimike]

How on earth can anyone upgrade the MTPLM on an old caravan like that? The original manufacturer has long since disappeared - owners can't upgrade their own caravan!

Seems it's remarkably easy to do, and doesn't involve any sort of engineer's inspection: https://www.primaleisure.com/inspiration/be-inspired/caravan-weight-plate-upgrades/

Don't know what the previous owner did - maybe took it to a Swift dealer, as Swift purchased Cotswold?

All a bit academic for us, as there's exactly zero storage rear of the axles, so no chance to stuff heavy things anywhere apart from the shower cubicle. It's already beyond 100kg noseweight without any food/luggage, just the awning. So I'll be carrying all that and the gas in the back of the car anyway to get it more like 75.

 

[Dustydog]

Kiwimike,
Is this yours?

 

[Kiwimike]

Kiwimike,
Is this yours?

Looks identical, but no - ours lived in Scotland its whole life. It also has new movers 😎

 

[RogerL]

Seems it's remarkably easy to do, and doesn't involve any sort of engineer's inspection: https://www.primaleisure.com/inspiration/be-inspired/caravan-weight-plate-upgrades/

Don't know what the previous owner did - maybe took it to a Swift dealer, as Swift purchased Cotswold?

All a bit academic for us, as there's exactly zero storage rear of the axles, so no chance to stuff heavy things anywhere apart from the shower cubicle. It's already beyond 100kg noseweight without any food/luggage, just the awning. So I'll be carrying all that and the gas in the back of the car anyway to get it more like 75.

You can purchase a weight upgrade from Prima for a modern caravan - but only if the manufacturer makes them available

 

[Hutch]

How on earth can anyone upgrade the MTPLM on an old caravan like that? The original manufacturer has long since disappeared - owners can't upgrade their own caravan!

These people "might" be able to do it. Especially if you have fitted a higher rated axle to the van.
Van weight eng.

 

[AndrewAventura]

Which is the correct size?
Could be that a previous owner bought two cheaper tyres to replace the 195's when they wore out and left the spare.
I would check as to exactly what size tyres should be fitted then fit what's needed to make them all the same. Don't forget the loading either as car tyres generally won't do.

I've just done a quick scan of tyre sizes and the one that came up most often was 185 R14 with no aspect ratio. 195/70R14 will have about the same rolling radius so would match. 175/70R14 are quite a bit smaller and cheaper😲

As has been pointed out, there is a difference in rolling radius of the two tyres (175/70 and 195/70). The actual difference in diameter is over an inch - that is a lot, and quite unacceptable even as an emergency compromise, I think.

 

[Buckman]

I doubt very much if caravans of that era came standard with a spare so maybe an afterthought by the previous owner? I am wondering if the wheel would actually fit onto the caravan?

 

[ProfJohnL]

Hi all

We've purchased a new to us van with 175/70 R14's on it - but the spare is a 195/70/R14.

I don't want to needlessly buy a new spare wheel - so what would be the impact of this spare on the handling / safety / braking etc? Obviously ideally it would be the same size spare - but are we talking a noticeable difference?

Thanks

With the exception of space saver spare wheels, I have not seen or heard of anyone advising or using wheels with different sized tyres on the same axle on any vehicle. The main difference would be the rotational speed of the wheels, but as trailer wheels are not linked to a transmission system, the differnt RPM's are unlikely to cause a problem.

The different width of the tyres might cause an issue with clearances to chassis and body work.
If you are running tyres of different sizes, the ideal inflation pressures may be differnt. Whilst I can't see any mechanical issue with such asymmetry on a caravan.

I believe in france and possibly some other countries you are required to have the same size, make and model of tyre in the sam axle. And whilst not an issue with a caravan, but some vehicles with locking differentials its important to match the tyre wear across the system.

I can't approve of having different tyre sizes on the same axle.

...It's already beyond 100kg noseweight without any food/luggage, just the awning. So I'll be carrying all that and the gas in the back of the car anyway to get it more like 75.

In the UK and probably the EU also the regulations concerning the transport of vapour take off LPG cylinders require the cylinder to be secured in an upright position, with high and low level ventilation. There are some very good reasons why these regulations should be adhered to. I have seen the results of an LPG leak and ignition inside a car. It was very lucky no one was in the car!

It is incredibly dangerous to carry an LPG cylinder inside a vehicle unless it is in a compartment specifically designed for the purpose. It's far safer to use the compartment in the caravan to transport the cylinder.

 

[Buckman]

Regarding transporting gas cylinder agree 100% with post 21! Very dangerous.

 

[otherclive]

As has been pointed out, there is a difference in rolling radius of the two tyres (175/70 and 195/70). The actual difference in diameter is over an inch - that is a lot, and quite unacceptable even as an emergency compromise, I think.

If in an emergency I’d use the larger rolling diameter tyre providing it met the Load Index and didn’t compromise wheel arch clearances. Obviously keeping speed down, and limiting distance to the absolute minimum. I had a 2010 XC70 where Volvos space saver was around 50 mm less diameter than the road wheels. Didn’t half look a funny posture when fitted.

 

[Kiwimike]

In the UK and probably the EU also the regulations concerning the transport of vapour take off LPG cylinders require the cylinder to be secured in an upright position, with high and low level ventilation. There are some very good reasons why these regulations should be adhered to. I have seen the results of an LPG leak and ignition inside a car. It was very lucky no one was in the car!

It is incredibly dangerous to carry an LPG cylinder inside a vehicle unless it is in a compartment specifically designed for the purpose. It's far safer to use the compartment in the caravan to transport the cylinder.

How I’ve survived an adult lifetime driving 20 miles to buy new gas every few months, I’ll never know. Maybe I’m dead and I just don’t know it. I drove a car with an LPG conversion for five years too. Yiiiiikes.

I don’t want to start yet another How To Carry LPG Safely thread, as the last one I looked at had moderators stepping in. There are clearly strongly held views on either side of ‘Under No Circumstances’ through to ‘Everyone Does This All The Time’.

 

[otherclive]

Th

How I’ve survived an adult lifetime driving 20 miles to buy new gas every few months, I’ll never know. Maybe I’m dead and I just don’t know it. I drove a car with an LPG conversion for five years too. Yiiiiikes.

I don’t want to start yet another How To Carry LPG Safely thread, as the last one I looked at had moderators stepping in. There are clearly strongly held views on either side of ‘Under No Circumstances’ through to ‘Everyone Does This All The Time’.

There are instances where it’s necessary to carry gas and not in a caravan locker. I’ve used to do it fetching exchange refills for my caravan cylinders, or Campingaz, or patio gas for the bbq. Always carried them in the cars luggage area ( cars have been hatchback or estates since year dot), kept them vertical and well supported so they could not fall down and with rear windows open. Agreed I failed to dot all the “i’s” and “cross all the t’s” all the times, but life’s not perfect.