Using air to obtain fresh water?

[otherclive]

I have just read an advert for a system called Floe which claims to give you improved fresh water. I was somewhat sceptical of the systems use to aid winter drain down but cannot really believe that it does anything to improve drinking water. To achieve this you use it every 2 weeks and use a pump to blow through "stale" water. Given that most people probably use a minimum of 1 Aquaroll per day then the water in the pipe is unlikely to be 'stale'. If you wanted to freshen up the water why not just run the caravan drinking tap, bathroom and shower taps too? I just cannot believe that blowing through for 5 minutes every 2 weeks makes an iota of difference to the quality of the drinking water. Is this the modern equivalent of snake oil?

 

[Damian]

Yoou are quite right, the Floe "thing" does absolutely nothing to improve, or worsen ,the water in the van.

I would say this is misleading advertising and will be reporting it to the Advertising Agency for their take on it.

 

[Gybe]

If this is the gadget ( http://www.practicalcaravan.com/review/accessories/floe-caravan-drain-down-kit ) I just labeled it as a waste of £40 and yet another pretty usless unnecessary piece of caravnning kit for the caravan load. In my opinion.
Should go down well. Practical Caravan forum moderator complains to Advertising Agency about Practical Caravan featured product

 

[Damian]

Quote " Should go down well. Practical Caravan forum moderator complains to Advertising Agency about Practical Caravan featured product

"

I do not really care who writes features or that as a Moderator I am making a complaint about the advert.
If PC or any other caravan magazine do not read the advert by the product manufacurer and actually determine whether or not it is accurate, that is not my concern.

My concern is that people may be fooled into parting with £40 for a glorified bycycle pump which claims to give better quality water,,,,,it may blow out some limescale, but it actually does nothing to improve the water quality.
Using proven sterilising regimes actully does do something, but even that does not "improve" the quality of water, it just improves the clenliness of the pipe system.

 

[DeliDave_]

Good posting Damian well said

 

[otherclive]

I understand that the CC plan some field trials, what a waste of members money, why not ask Floe to produce field evidence at their cost?

 

[Gybe]

Good for you Damian, well done! I saw and read the feature on this PC website a week or so ago. It looks like Floe has some support for their equipment if you read this - http://www.practicalcaravan.com/advice/keeping-your-caravan-water-system-safe

Personally I rate it as spin and a complete waste of money, but it makes me wonder what PC are doing promoting the Floe equipment.
In all our years of caravanning we've never had an issue with water quality. Regular use of Puriclean and a flush through with boiling water works for us.

 

[ProfJohnL]

Late me state at the outset, I have nothing to do with Floe or the system they are offering.

I agree the references to the Floe system keeping the water system safe, or cleaning water are wrong and misleading. However what the system actually does is to help ensure that as much of the water as possible in the pipe work and heaters is expelled. This is a good idea as it will protect the systems from frost damage in freezing conditions.

The article implies the system will dry the pipes, which I don't is realistic, as it would need a substantial air flow to drive out the moisture, This will not be achieved easily and certainly not with a foot pump or the demonstrated electric tyre inflater, which are good at developing pressure but useless at shifting high volumes of air.

It seems a very expensive solution for a few pipes and adaptors, for a problem that does not really exist.

A more practical pump would be and air bed inflater, - modest pressure with high volume.

 

[Parksy]

Click Here to see the article on this website and decide for yourselves.

Like other experienced tourer owners I follow a regular sterilisation regime using sterilising powder tablets available from caravan accessory shops but even though my system is sterilised I don't drink or make drinks from the caravan system and never would.

From what I've seen of the Floë equipment a large part of the expense is because a new water inlet pipe and end connector is part of the kit, and APT Innovations who market the Floë kit say that they commisioned a study by the Biomedical Sciences Research Institue at the University of Ulster which has recently published it's findings.

These findings are reported to indicate broadly speaking that after 14 days water left standing in caravan pipework systems would be unfit for human consumption and after 28 days bacteria will start to develop.
The tests are said to show that even after sterilisation and flushing the stagnant water is diluted but still present.
After the Floë system has been used to purge the system which is then refilled with fresh water the tests are said to indicate 'miniscule or no bacteria'.

I notice that the article doesn't indicate the presence or abscence of bacteria after sterilisation, it simply said that stagnant water is present but diluted, and there is no indication of how harmful any remaining bacteria is but in common with many caravanners I maintain a high degree of scepticism when a 'must have' product costing a fair amount of money is promoted in this way.

I don't feel as strongly as Damian and would like to see and study the published report from Ulster University before trying to prove that there is misrepresentation, but there's no substitute for using a good sterilising product regularly, although I'm sure that the Floë system does a good job in the prevention of frost damage.

With a spare bit of pipe with a tyre valve on the end and a caravan inlet connector I'm pretty sure that the average caravanner could knock a system purger up for far less than the £40-£50 being asked for the Floë kit.

 

[otherclive]

The Executive Summary fails to say what effect the normal re commissioning and filling of a system does in reducing bacteria. I set the system to drain after leaving a site or traveling to a site. When filling I gauge at least two sink fulls of site water are flushed through the cold drinking tap plus 10 liters into the hot tank. Allother hot and cold lines are flushed through too. So any residual bugs or staleness are much diluted. Normally given regular use I only sterilize at the start of the season. Also stating that Legionairres may be a risk is it a good idea to pressurize a system and then stand by a tap to release an aerosol of stale possibly bacteria laden water. I suggest not. We have never had a tummy upset in any of our vans over many years on main sites or CL/CS in Uk or Europe. But if we had how would we have known where it came from?

 

[DeliDave_]

Regarding purging pipes for winter,I take the shower head off and blow down the hose with the taps closedexcept the shower valve and move it from hot to cold a few times and it gets loads out.Remove the whale pump and job done.

 

[oldsnowdrop]

OK folks I am A qualified food hygiene instructor and a health and safety manager. I sterilise my water containers before we set out, using Milton tablets. I used to flush this Milton water through the system but have been told that this can adversely affect the seals in the pipe work, so I now use a proprietary caravan pipe cleaner and steriliser. This treat ment will do as much to keep the water system clean as pumping it full of compressed air and blowing it through. In my opinion.....

 

[Surfer]

OK folks I am A qualified food hygiene instructor and a health and safety manager. I sterilise my water containers before we set out, using Milton tablets. I used to flush this Milton water through the system but have been told that this can adversely affect the seals in the pipe work, so I now use a proprietary caravan pipe cleaner and steriliser. This treat ment will do as much to keep the water system clean as pumping it full of compressed air and blowing it through. In my opinion.....

I am sure that we would have heard before now that Milton damages seals. Somehow I doubt it. Any one experience this?

 

[FrintonMike]

I use a Milton substitute and it does give a warning on the container not to use on anything metalic and I think Milton has the same warning so I only use it in the aquaroll

 

[JohnM20]

As the 'Other Clive' rightly says, any small amount of residual 'stagnant' water in a system would be highly diluted by the fresh supply. I may be wrong but don't water companies introduce a steriliser into the mains water system to keep water bacteria free whilst in their pipes. This, surely, would also kill off any tiny amounts of bacteria which may or may not be in the caravan pipes, assuming that a regular sterilising regime if the caravan has been left standing for any length of time.

I also believe that some CC sites also introduce a steriliser as the water stand pipes are fed from header tanks and not from the mains. Certainly on many sites the water has a very strong chlorine smell and taste.

 

[DaveA1]

As has been said £40 is a waste of money. I sterlise my system once at the begining of the year, then just rinse through with tap water at the the start of each holiday, never had any touble over years of Caravanning. Tap water is a very effective sterliser. I keep Koi,nothing spectacular, but I have to be very careful when performing a water change, I have to treat tap water to remove the Chlorine or Chloramine becuase they will kill the Koi. So, I think, flushing the van system through with fresh tap water will help clean it, (I think) and have much the same effect Use the van tap as we do at home, for making tea and making cool drinks, washing pots. Using the floe system will not make much difference.