Using larger Gas bottle Swift Sprite

[Javert]

We have a brand new 2025 Swift Sprite Major 4EB.

We have a seasonal pitch and will be on the same site most of the time with a few excursions. I have 2 6KG gas bottles right now. The other guests on the site are telling me that I should make a hole in the ventilation grid at the bottom of the gas locker, and run a longer gas cable so that I can use 19KG gas bottles from outside the locker, as it’s much cheaper that way (and they can be delivered to your pitch).

Does this make sense and if so how would I make a small hole in that metal grid? Will this cause any issues or invalidate my warranty?

Also is is then ok to travel around with a 19KG gas bottle in my car or in the van when we travel about?

 

[borderbilly]

Don't think I would bother, as the savings will be very slim, I'd rather have my safety than save a few Bob.

 

[Javert]

Don't think I would bother, as the savings will be very slim, I'd rather have my safety than save a few Bob.

They are telling me that it costs about £35 to exchange a 6Kg propane bottle, but only about £48 on the site to get 19KG. That’s a pretty high % saving.

Is it actually unsafe to have a hole there? There is already a metal grid this is open o the elements at the bottom of the locker, presumably to allow the gas to sink out of the locker if there is a leak. My logic is that the only issue you would cause is when there is no cable there, and something small stowed in the locker could fall out through the hole. I may be missing some other safety risk though.

 

[borderbilly]

You could always drill through the metal vent grid for pipe access, then replace grid when flogging it.

 

[toad a caravan]

May get stolen,my son's did outside his sited static

 

[otherclive]

I personally would not travel far with a 19kg gas bottle in the car apart from the unavoidable trip to exchange it. Same goes for the standard 6kg bottle too. Apart from the cars designed air removal system, I’ve yet to have a car with gas drop down vents to disperse propane or butane. The best and safest place for gas bottles is in the caravan gas locker where there are mesh gas drop down holes. That’s where the F&RS expect to find them.

 

[birdman101]

Bottles outside of a caravan have to be fixed to comply with regulations but are still liable to theft

 

[Javert]

I personally would not travel far with a 19kg gas bottle in the car apart from the unavoidable trip to exchange it. Same goes for the standard 6kg bottle too. Apart from the cars designed air removal system, I’ve yet to have a car with gas drop down vents to disperse propane or butane. The best and safest place for gas bottles is in the caravan gas locker where there are mesh gas drop down holes. That’s where the F&RS expect to find them.

So probably if doing this, it would be safer to only do this when on a seasonal pitch and leave the 19KG bottle safe at the pitch when going on excursions. I could then just use 6KG bottles when out and about at other sites.

 

[otherclive]

So probably if doing this, it would be safer to only do this when on a seasonal pitch and leave the 19KG bottle safe at the pitch when going on excursions. I could then just use 6KG bottles when out and about at other sites.

Yes that’s what I would do. But what about security for the 19kg cylinder standing there all alone?

 

[borderbilly]

So probably if doing this, it would be safer to only do this when on a seasonal pitch and leave the 19KG bottle safe at the pitch when going on excursions. I could then just use 6KG bottles when out and about at other sites.

That sounds like a solution.

 

[Beachball]

it depends on the rules of your seasonal site could you leave the 19kg bottle in a storage box with a lock on your pitch .

 

[ProfJohnL]

As others have said you would need to check with your site operator about the use of an external gas cylinder, and storage of same when your touring. Not all sites will have the same arrangements as they are independent companies.

Regards to using an external cylinder with a touring caravan, you may have problems with finding a high pressure pigtail ( the connection pipe with the correct couplings from the cylinder to the gas pressure regulator built into the caravan) that is long enough to reach and external cylinder.

But apart from that the gas should work correctly.

Others have alluded to the dangers of transporting gas cylinders effectively loose inside a car . That is definitely a NO! Just consider some facts. LPG cylinders for caravans are "Vapour Take Off cylinders" This means the gas valve on the cylinder must ALWAYS be at the top of the cylinder, to ensure it only allows gas vapour to be released. If a cylinder falls onto its side that would mean the valve would no only be vertically half way up the cylinder, and it could be immersed in the Liquefied gas content rather than the vapour.

In the event the valve is not fully closed or it has been damaged, instead of just leaking vapour, which is serious enough on its own, the prone cylinder would be leaking liquefied gas. In the process of filling an cylinder of LPG the pressure is sufficient to compress the gas to the point it condenses into its liquefied phase. That is roughly a compression ratio of 260 times. If you leak liquefied gas that liquid will instantly try to boil and convert is self into its vapour phase which means it expands by about 260 times. so a small liquid spill becomes a much bigger gaseous cloud. And in the process of expanding it draws the energy it needs to vapourise from the atmosphere around it. Is temperature will drop enough that if you get liquefied Propane on your skin it will cause a serious frost bight.

Then there is the risk of having a highly combustible fuel lose inside an enclosed space such as a car. Pure gas will not burn becasue it needs to mix with air to gain access to oxygen. Broadly speaking you need a ratio of gas to air in the range of 4 to 15% to support combustion. it therefore does not much of a spillage to produce a combustible mixture inside a car. Also bear in mind there are plenty of electrical sources of ignition within a car. It the mixture ratio optimum not only will the mixture burn it might have the flame speed to be considered an explosive with the associated force to physically blow out windows, not to mention the concussion injuries such an event might impact on anyone in the car.

There is a legal requirement for vapour take of cylinders to kept upright, and to be secured to prevent them falling or otherwise moved, especially when being transported.

When towing your caravan the cylinder(s) must be secured in the gas cylinder locker, and turned off at the gas bottle or disconnected.

 

[Gafferbill]

......if you don't have a 19kgs Calor cylinder then a new full one from Calor will cost around £130.
From then on refills would be cheap if the supplier only charged £48.
The 3 meter pigtail you will need, will cost you a further £25-30.
You would be able to get cheaper gas than 6 kgs by using a 13kgs Calor cylinder and it will fit in the front locker of your caravan although only when the caravan is not being towed.(the security fixings have to be modified for towing).
Your existing pigtail will work with a 13kgs cylinder.
You still need to source a 13 kgs cylinder around £115 full new and £52 for subsequent refills.
Empty cylinders can be purchased from Web/press adverts at lower prices.

 

[Jcloughie]

Consider a cost comparison with refillable bottles. Might be better in terms of initial outlay, cost of use, transportability and security.

John

 

[birdman101]

If you are on a seasonal pitch ,I would think on EHU very little gas would be used. We use our caravan for a minimum of a week in every month for 10 months of the year on full service super pitches only, and 6 kg Calor lasts about 2 years as hardly used only cups of tea and Coffee, and that is mainly Electric kettle use. Cooking when in Caravan is mainly Microwave for quickness and some Oven use.

 

[Buckman]

On a brand new caravan I would never consider drilling any holes. Maybe after 3 years. Just to add we were on a site and some Toerag stole our bottle during the night. We did not hear a thing!

 

[borderbilly]

On a brand new caravan I would never consider drilling any holes. Maybe after 3 years. Just to add we were on a site and some Toerag stole our bottle during the night. We did not hear a thing!

If its drilled in the mesh vent,these are easily replaced.

 

[Javert]

......if you don't have a 19kgs Calor cylinder then a new full one from Calor will cost around £130.
From then on refills would be cheap if the supplier only charged £48.
The 3 meter pigtail you will need, will cost you a further £25-30.
You would be able to get cheaper gas than 6 kgs by using a 13kgs Calor cylinder and it will fit in the front locker of your caravan although only when the caravan is not being towed.(the security fixings have to be modified for towing).
Your existing pigtail will work with a 13kgs cylinder.
You still need to source a 13 kgs cylinder around £115 full new and £52 for subsequent refills.
Empty cylinders can be purchased from Web/press adverts at lower prices.

Hmmm - my impression was that a 13KG canister would not fit in the Sprite front gas locker, but maybe I misjudged it - that would be unfortunate as I just handed in a 13KG one in exchange for the 6KG one!

So you are saying that in theory I could have the locker modified to be able to use 13KG bottles even while towing.

However - if I then towed with 2 x 13KG bottles in the front, I suspect the caravan would be very nose heavy - it’s already pretty nose heavy to start with. I measured 104Kg on the nose before setting out and we don’t even have a lot of stuff in there.

 

[birdman101]

Your maximum noseweight for the Caravan built on a Alko chassis is 100 kg. Start exceeding the weights given in your handbook will invalidate any warranty. Also overweights invalidate insurance.

 

[Gafferbill]

.....I have a Swift 586 with the same locker size as your caravan.
My caravan is modified to carry one 13kgs propane or one 6kgs (You won't fit two 13kgs because of size and weight).
The modifications are to the restraining fittings.

Having said this......I wouldn't modify a brand new expensive caravan until out of all warranties.

 

[Javert]

Your maximum noseweight for the Caravan built on a Alko chassis is 100 kg. Start exceeding the weights given in your handbook will invalidate any warranty. Also overweights invalidate insurance.

Yes so even without doing that I was exceeding the max caravan nose weight by 4%. And this was with just 2 gas bottles and few other fairly light bits and pieces in the front locker. I guess we need to move a couple of KG of internal load a bit further back in the caravan next time. I must admit I forgot about the caravan nose weight limit and was focussed on the nose weight limit of the car.

 

[otherclive]

Yes so even without doing that I was exceeding the max caravan nose weight by 4%. And this was with just 2 gas bottles and few other fairly light bits and pieces in the front locker. I guess we need to move a couple of KG of internal load a bit further back in the caravan next time. I must admit I forgot about the caravan nose weight limit and was focussed on the nose weight limit of the car.

My van was nose heavy so I would add some fluid to the cassette, or place a tool bag to the rear.

 

[Jcloughie]

If its drilled in the mesh vent,these are easily replaced.

It is likely that the vent could come out altogether. Would just need to make sure that vermin could not get in. In some vans, the floor of the locker does not extend to the walls, leaving a gap that might be big enough.

John

 

[Hutch]

You could easily drill a hole in the vent mesh, and then when touring just take a 6 kg gas bottle. The only time I carry two bottles is when one is almost empty and the other is full.

 

[Buckman]

If its drilled in the mesh vent,these are easily replaced.

I would cut a hole rather than trying to drill into mesh?