as i read in recent pc issues mr king "fix it" works on gas appliances . i thought you needed to be CORGI registered to carry out this kind of repair. any comments would be appreciated
neil
neil
working on gas using appliances
- Thread starter neil1
- Start date
So long as the caravan isn't for hire or reward then the repairer does not need CORGI registration. They only need to be competant - how long is a peice of string ? I would cetainly say they should have some form of qualification.
I am a mobile caravan engineer and have done a 5 day, specialist LPG gas course - ACOP - which covers all the necessary regulations and best practices when dealing with LPG. CORGI majors on demostic appliances and natural gas, although it will be of a generally higher standard.
In addition, it would be benficial if the "mr Fix-it" had received training from the appliance manufacturers themselves, - Truma, Dometic etc.
Hope this helps.
I am a mobile caravan engineer and have done a 5 day, specialist LPG gas course - ACOP - which covers all the necessary regulations and best practices when dealing with LPG. CORGI majors on demostic appliances and natural gas, although it will be of a generally higher standard.
In addition, it would be benficial if the "mr Fix-it" had received training from the appliance manufacturers themselves, - Truma, Dometic etc.
Hope this helps.
Hello Neil,
In the most part I agree with Jonathon, though his use of the phrase "They only need to be competent" almost makes it a sound a flippant remark when in actual fact it is a very serious issue.
By law anyone working on any gas appliance or installation in the UK must be competent to do so.
What is competence? Well as Jonathon says how long is a piece of string? Well it is slightly more scientific than that, but unless the basic skills and knowledge are demonstrated and assessed to a satisfactory level, competency has not been achieved.
In my view it highly unlikely that DIY'er will have a satisfactory working knowledge of all the relevant regulations, and access to the necessary calibrated test equipment, and so it is most likely that an amateur fitter will be breaking the law.
Legalities aside, the dangers of inadequate gas installation or servicing work can and do affect others, sadly sometimes very seriously. So if you value your loved ones, don't skimp on gas installations.
In the most part I agree with Jonathon, though his use of the phrase "They only need to be competent" almost makes it a sound a flippant remark when in actual fact it is a very serious issue.
By law anyone working on any gas appliance or installation in the UK must be competent to do so.
What is competence? Well as Jonathon says how long is a piece of string? Well it is slightly more scientific than that, but unless the basic skills and knowledge are demonstrated and assessed to a satisfactory level, competency has not been achieved.
In my view it highly unlikely that DIY'er will have a satisfactory working knowledge of all the relevant regulations, and access to the necessary calibrated test equipment, and so it is most likely that an amateur fitter will be breaking the law.
Legalities aside, the dangers of inadequate gas installation or servicing work can and do affect others, sadly sometimes very seriously. So if you value your loved ones, don't skimp on gas installations.
No offence Legs but there are some inaccuracies in there,as I dont go on your forum much I havent bothered to correct them.If you only check with leak detector for example not a drop test,also the length of time the hoses are OK for.I know you are trying to help but alittle knowledge is not always a good thing.As you may remember I am in Daventry and qualified for caravans with Corgi.
None taken, Dave. I'm sure you have realised that I didn't write that article and that it is written by a Corgi registered member.
If no one bothers to take the time to correct whatever inaccuracies there are "supposed" to be then everyone will take that article at face value. After all, the way it's written and what is written, it seems to make a lotta sense to the majority of us. I'm sure there will always be those who disagree though and have their own way of doing things.
If no one bothers to take the time to correct whatever inaccuracies there are "supposed" to be then everyone will take that article at face value. After all, the way it's written and what is written, it seems to make a lotta sense to the majority of us. I'm sure there will always be those who disagree though and have their own way of doing things.
After we disagreed about dog posts it is somewhat awkward to log on and cticise anothers posting.You are welcome to check the Corgi website for a Daventry fitter to work on caravans and I think you will find me and Skaino.I have no idea whoo Gasgas is and his qualifications but what he posted is not what i was told when i was retested last year.I am happy to update your posting when you have time as I would hate someone to have a disaster and then blame your forum for its bad advice.I have nothing personal in this at all and only have best wishes for you and your forum
Hmmmmm. I distinctly remember you disagreed with a dog post issue but all that was dead and buried on my forum ages ago. I doubt anyone will remember it now if you popped back up. I, personally, wouldn't see it as you criticising someones post but it does sound as if it needs correcting or challenging.
If you don't feel you can post yourself, perhaps you could email me and say what is wrong and I'll post it or email gasgas privately to see what he says.
If you don't feel you can post yourself, perhaps you could email me and say what is wrong and I'll post it or email gasgas privately to see what he says.
will p.m. you on your forum as sadly we are still waiting for Lord hezza to pay up 
no smiley thingies either
no smiley thingies either
Hello legs,
An interesting post on the other forum. There is a lot of basically correct info but some seriously erroneous information!
The descriptive parts about types of appliances are quite good, and there are some perfectly sound tips, abut the light hearted approach to any aspect of gas fitting repairs or servicing give the wrong impression that such work is within the legal capability of most caravan owners.
It is not illegal to do your own gas servicing on a caravan, but the overriding fact is that the regulations still require that ALL gas fitting work must comply with the relevant safety regulations and be carried out by a competent person. There is nothing in the regulations that exempt caravaners from these same requirements. The only concession is that the fitter does not have to be registered.
Ignorance of this aspect of the regulations is rife, and the consequences of ignoring them is not just the knock on the door from the H&SE, but the safety of self loved ones and anyone else in the vicinity when the unthinkable occurs.
Of particular concern is the suggestion that gas tightness testing can be carried out by only using a revealing spray. Using such a method, as the sole indicator is open to errors, where a faulty part may be missed, or not visible.
Despite the forum having a disclaimer, if as a result of such a posting, the forum was cited as the source for information, a civil case might be brought against the forum owners.
An interesting post on the other forum. There is a lot of basically correct info but some seriously erroneous information!
The descriptive parts about types of appliances are quite good, and there are some perfectly sound tips, abut the light hearted approach to any aspect of gas fitting repairs or servicing give the wrong impression that such work is within the legal capability of most caravan owners.
It is not illegal to do your own gas servicing on a caravan, but the overriding fact is that the regulations still require that ALL gas fitting work must comply with the relevant safety regulations and be carried out by a competent person. There is nothing in the regulations that exempt caravaners from these same requirements. The only concession is that the fitter does not have to be registered.
Ignorance of this aspect of the regulations is rife, and the consequences of ignoring them is not just the knock on the door from the H&SE, but the safety of self loved ones and anyone else in the vicinity when the unthinkable occurs.
Of particular concern is the suggestion that gas tightness testing can be carried out by only using a revealing spray. Using such a method, as the sole indicator is open to errors, where a faulty part may be missed, or not visible.
Despite the forum having a disclaimer, if as a result of such a posting, the forum was cited as the source for information, a civil case might be brought against the forum owners.
"Despite the forum having a disclaimer, if as a result of such a posting, the forum was cited as the source for information, a civil case might be brought against the forum owners."
Sorry, I disagree. I have tonight taken advice from a lawyer friend of mine who says that the original poser of that article claims to be a CORGI registered gas installer who knows what he's doing and on the other hand, I know nothing about the subject.
The disclaimer I have states and I refer to point 12 -
[12] Legal ownership - Each message posted is owned by and the opinion of the original poster. Neither Camping and Caravanning Community nor its owners or webmaster are legally responsible for anything posted on these forums. The webmaster reserves the right to remove any or all of your messages at any time and ban you if he sees fit.
I'm assured that this covers me against such posts in that it is "the opinion of the original poster" and not my own. He also states that most cases on forums are of a libellous nature. For example, if someone was slated to be a child molester and that someone asked me to remove the post and I refused, then I could be held liable for maintaining the publishing of a libellous statement.
I would also like to add that the original poster of that article does say and I quote "If you don't know what a 11mm spanner or a 8mm gas supply pipe looks like then you jolly well shouldn't be doing the work in the first place." and "There is no rubber hose under the chassis so what you can see near the gas bottles is all there is. Whatever you do, do not be tempted to use garden hose unless you have a very strong death wish."
I therefore believe he is covering himself in that he is not recommending anyone understand this work if they are not competent. It's no different to someone asking advise on how to change a light switch. Anyone could change a light switch, you don't need to be an electrician to do this but if you're not confident in what you're doing, understand how light switches work (particularly 2-way switches) then you should consult a qualified electrician.
As it stands, I (and others) thought it a rather good article on gas self-service in a caravan and since I know no better, I can't challenge it. If anyone reckons they know better then they should be posting their objections either on the thread itself or to the original poster privately via PM or email. Do bear in mind that it was posted 2 months ago now.
The fact remains that I was answering Neil's original post on this thread that you do NOT need to be CORGI registered to service the gas systems on your caravan. That's all.
Sorry, I disagree. I have tonight taken advice from a lawyer friend of mine who says that the original poser of that article claims to be a CORGI registered gas installer who knows what he's doing and on the other hand, I know nothing about the subject.
The disclaimer I have states and I refer to point 12 -
[12] Legal ownership - Each message posted is owned by and the opinion of the original poster. Neither Camping and Caravanning Community nor its owners or webmaster are legally responsible for anything posted on these forums. The webmaster reserves the right to remove any or all of your messages at any time and ban you if he sees fit.
I'm assured that this covers me against such posts in that it is "the opinion of the original poster" and not my own. He also states that most cases on forums are of a libellous nature. For example, if someone was slated to be a child molester and that someone asked me to remove the post and I refused, then I could be held liable for maintaining the publishing of a libellous statement.
I would also like to add that the original poster of that article does say and I quote "If you don't know what a 11mm spanner or a 8mm gas supply pipe looks like then you jolly well shouldn't be doing the work in the first place." and "There is no rubber hose under the chassis so what you can see near the gas bottles is all there is. Whatever you do, do not be tempted to use garden hose unless you have a very strong death wish."
I therefore believe he is covering himself in that he is not recommending anyone understand this work if they are not competent. It's no different to someone asking advise on how to change a light switch. Anyone could change a light switch, you don't need to be an electrician to do this but if you're not confident in what you're doing, understand how light switches work (particularly 2-way switches) then you should consult a qualified electrician.
As it stands, I (and others) thought it a rather good article on gas self-service in a caravan and since I know no better, I can't challenge it. If anyone reckons they know better then they should be posting their objections either on the thread itself or to the original poster privately via PM or email. Do bear in mind that it was posted 2 months ago now.
The fact remains that I was answering Neil's original post on this thread that you do NOT need to be CORGI registered to service the gas systems on your caravan. That's all.
hi all
like most caravan regulations the ones for bottled gas seem to be very ambigious, you do not have to be registered to carry out the work but you do have to be competent and aware of the regulations and have the required test equipment "got it" yep clear as mud. well can you or not?? personally I would not.
however it does remind me of when we thought there was a gas leak in the m/home, we had been able to smell gas on one weekend away and being causious took it to a dealer to be looked at.
bearing in mind the only gas appliences were the two ring hot plate and the fridge both had only the rubber gas pipe attached to a tee-piece and then on to the bottle acceses was gained from opening the rear doors the ""registered gas fitter"" at the dealers opened the rear doors painted the joints with what looked like washing up liquid in a jar waited for the bubbles to appear when none did he said thats ok I will look at the bottle, the regulator had a cracked "o"ring so he fitted a new one (just the "o"ring not the regulator) put it on the bottle and painted it with the liquid again around the seal no problems there now "that will be
like most caravan regulations the ones for bottled gas seem to be very ambigious, you do not have to be registered to carry out the work but you do have to be competent and aware of the regulations and have the required test equipment "got it" yep clear as mud. well can you or not?? personally I would not.
however it does remind me of when we thought there was a gas leak in the m/home, we had been able to smell gas on one weekend away and being causious took it to a dealer to be looked at.
bearing in mind the only gas appliences were the two ring hot plate and the fridge both had only the rubber gas pipe attached to a tee-piece and then on to the bottle acceses was gained from opening the rear doors the ""registered gas fitter"" at the dealers opened the rear doors painted the joints with what looked like washing up liquid in a jar waited for the bubbles to appear when none did he said thats ok I will look at the bottle, the regulator had a cracked "o"ring so he fitted a new one (just the "o"ring not the regulator) put it on the bottle and painted it with the liquid again around the seal no problems there now "that will be
Well said, Colin. Which is where I believe gasgas's article could save you millions in future, IF you felt competent enough to tackle the problem yourself.
Hi Colin,
No I don't think the caravan regulations are ambiguous - they clearly state what is required in the way of understanding, training, tools and test equipment in order to safely carry out any maintenance work.
As to whether an individual feels they are competent or able to carry out work, that is a decision for the individual - and a forum guide may help you assess your own capabilities.
CORGI is designed to give trades-people a minimum acceptable level of understanding, correct working procedures and safety skills.
Me - I design process control systems for oil refineries and in my professional life I wouldn't get very far with a CORGI certificate - the legal and professional requirements are somewhat different.
But whilst I can happily self certify myself as competent, I don't have the test equipment on hand to complete the inspection side of the work - so I'd have concerns about completing safety checks like a pressure drop test...
And in that case, having someone else do the work - then you pay the rate for the job - but before going away or if I felt there was a problem, I'd have checked all the joints in the system from front-to-back with diluted washing up liquid the very instant I'd smelt gas...
Robert
No I don't think the caravan regulations are ambiguous - they clearly state what is required in the way of understanding, training, tools and test equipment in order to safely carry out any maintenance work.
As to whether an individual feels they are competent or able to carry out work, that is a decision for the individual - and a forum guide may help you assess your own capabilities.
CORGI is designed to give trades-people a minimum acceptable level of understanding, correct working procedures and safety skills.
Me - I design process control systems for oil refineries and in my professional life I wouldn't get very far with a CORGI certificate - the legal and professional requirements are somewhat different.
But whilst I can happily self certify myself as competent, I don't have the test equipment on hand to complete the inspection side of the work - so I'd have concerns about completing safety checks like a pressure drop test...
And in that case, having someone else do the work - then you pay the rate for the job - but before going away or if I felt there was a problem, I'd have checked all the joints in the system from front-to-back with diluted washing up liquid the very instant I'd smelt gas...
Robert
hi all
the reason I quoted from my experience was twofold, first the professional approach was in my view quite amaturish using WUL or similar to test for a leak "anyone could do that" however he did know where and how to fix it which is why I paid the bill my point was any one with a tub of wul and a brush could find a leak and after fixing it retest it so where does the special test equipment come in and how do you do a drop pressure test (ie as with domestic gas) in a closed system with no bleed vent.
second if you did do your own repairs on the van gas system who would know????? and how far do we go down the profesional route, before we get to a point where we are not allowed to do any diy of any kind.
colin.
the reason I quoted from my experience was twofold, first the professional approach was in my view quite amaturish using WUL or similar to test for a leak "anyone could do that" however he did know where and how to fix it which is why I paid the bill my point was any one with a tub of wul and a brush could find a leak and after fixing it retest it so where does the special test equipment come in and how do you do a drop pressure test (ie as with domestic gas) in a closed system with no bleed vent.
second if you did do your own repairs on the van gas system who would know????? and how far do we go down the profesional route, before we get to a point where we are not allowed to do any diy of any kind.
colin.
hi all
the reason I quoted from my experience was twofold, first the professional approach was in my view quite amaturish using WUL or similar to test for a leak "anyone could do that" however he did know where and how to fix it which is why I paid the bill my point was any one with a tub of wul and a brush could find a leak and after fixing it retest it so where does the special test equipment come in and how do you do a drop pressure test (ie as with domestic gas) in a closed system with no bleed vent.
second if you did do your own repairs on the van gas system who would know????? and how far do we go down the profesional route, before we get to a point where we are not allowed to do any diy of any kind.
colin.
the reason I quoted from my experience was twofold, first the professional approach was in my view quite amaturish using WUL or similar to test for a leak "anyone could do that" however he did know where and how to fix it which is why I paid the bill my point was any one with a tub of wul and a brush could find a leak and after fixing it retest it so where does the special test equipment come in and how do you do a drop pressure test (ie as with domestic gas) in a closed system with no bleed vent.
second if you did do your own repairs on the van gas system who would know????? and how far do we go down the profesional route, before we get to a point where we are not allowed to do any diy of any kind.
colin.
I don't profess to be a gas fitter but I do know you shouldn't use washing up liquid, diluted or otherwise, to check for gas leaks. The high salt content can eventually corrode gas pipes. Use a purpose made gas leak detector spray.
I would question if anyone using washing up liquid was "competent", Corgi regestered or not!
I would question if anyone using washing up liquid was "competent", Corgi regestered or not!
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