x trail tow bar

[darren_374234478]

We have today had a Witter tow bar fitted to our new x trail, and when i tried the caravan hitched on the car it seems that the caravan is siting to low on the car, we never had this trouble with our previous x trail.

We have only a 5" ground clearence between jocky wheel and the ground, which i suspect will be reduced further when the car and caravan is loaded.

Has any body else had this problem?

cheers,

darren

 

[WatsonJohnG]

I have the new model X Trail and the suspension has settled quite a bit

I have fitted Pyramid doughnuts to the rear springs and it has reduced the sag without spoiling the ride

It has reduced roll on the corners and generally enhanced the suspension and the car/van outfit "looks" much better as well as giving better ground clearance for the jockey wheel

I approached several after market spring assister type firms and was told that M A D were having the new model in a couple of weeks ago to see what they could do but nobody else has yet got anything on the market other than doughnut type rubbers

I haven't heard any more from the M A D agent

On the "old"model X Trail I had the M A D variable rate springs fitted and they much improved things with the van " almost" level,slightly nose down and looking well set up to the car

Have you read my posting about the spare wheel situation?

 

[darren_374234478]

I have the new model X Trail and the suspension has settled quite a bit

I have fitted Pyramid doughnuts to the rear springs and it has reduced the sag without spoiling the ride

It has reduced roll on the corners and generally enhanced the suspension and the car/van outfit "looks" much better as well as giving better ground clearance for the jockey wheel

I approached several after market spring assister type firms and was told that M A D were having the new model in a couple of weeks ago to see what they could do but nobody else has yet got anything on the market other than doughnut type rubbers

I haven't heard any more from the M A D agent

On the "old"model X Trail I had the M A D variable rate springs fitted and they much improved things with the van " almost" level,slightly nose down and looking well set up to the car

Have you read my posting about the spare wheel situation?

no i havnt, is there a problem with it?

 

[Lutz]

If you have only 5" ground clearance when the empty caravan is hitched to the empty car, then, as you say, this will obviously reduce even more when both are loaded up. The noseweight itself should not bring the back end of the car down so far so this would suggest that the towball is already too low before the caravan is attached. I'd check whether it is within spec. Maybe you have the wrong towbar fitted.

 

[RogerL]

The centre of the towball should (must) be between 350mm and 420mm from the ground with the car laden but without caravan attached.

Under type approval regulations the towball height requirement doesn't apply to 4x4s to prevent compromising their departure angle but I can't think of any reason to engineer a low mounted towball, even on 4x4s.

XTrail may not even be classed as 4x4 - all-wheel drive doesn't automatically put it into that category.

 

[Lutz]

Short comment here regarding Roger's statement: "The centre of the towball should (must) be between 350mm and 420mm from the ground with the car laden but without caravan attached."

The added note, ".... but without caravan attached.", is superfluous. As the noseweight is part of the payload, if the car is fully laden, it's fully laden, regardless of whether the caravan is attached or not.

 

[RogerL]

Not always so Lutz - some vehicles have different max rear axle and max gross weights dependent whether towing or not - Vauxhall Astra and Subaru Outback to name two - it's all documented in their Certificates of Conformity.

 

[WatsonJohnG]

Its a no win situation because if you remove items from the caravan as I have to do to get the nose weight down(even with the rear bed space loaded ) then if its in the car boot its still a load on the rear suspension.

 

[WatsonJohnG]

I have the new model X Trail and the suspension has settled quite a bit

I have fitted Pyramid doughnuts to the rear springs and it has reduced the sag without spoiling the ride

It has reduced roll on the corners and generally enhanced the suspension and the car/van outfit "looks" much better as well as giving better ground clearance for the jockey wheel

I approached several after market spring assister type firms and was told that M A D were having the new model in a couple of weeks ago to see what they could do but nobody else has yet got anything on the market other than doughnut type rubbers

I haven't heard any more from the M A D agent

On the "old"model X Trail I had the M A D variable rate springs fitted and they much improved things with the van " almost" level,slightly nose down and looking well set up to the car

Have you read my posting about the spare wheel situation?

In the handbook under emergency use it says do not tow a trailer when using the temporary spare wheel

I have contacted Nissan and they are looking into it

What is strange is that the wheel well will take a full size wheel and tyre and the emergency wheel is full size but 16 in rather than 17 in low profile

I thought of buying another alloy wheel and tyre but was quoted by Nissan dealer

 

[WatsonJohnG]

The centre of the towball should (must) be between 350mm and 420mm from the ground with the car laden but without caravan attached.

Under type approval regulations the towball height requirement doesn't apply to 4x4s to prevent compromising their departure angle but I can't think of any reason to engineer a low mounted towball, even on 4x4s.

XTrail may not even be classed as 4x4 - all-wheel drive doesn't automatically put it into that category.

This is the Witter spec so I don't think that it is classed a 4 X $ as you say

EC Type Approved: Yes Tow Ball: Flange 2 Bolt

EC Type No: 00-5017 S Value (kg): 100

Max Towing Capacity (kg): 2000 D Value (kN): 9.93

Max Coupling Packer (mm): 25 Cycle Carrier: ZX88 or ZX89

Max Drop Plate Size (mm): 0 Spare Wheel Location

 

[Lutz]

Yes, but the towball height would always be measured with the car at the GVW specified for the towing condition, i.e. as if the caravan were attached. Measuring at any secondary GVW which may be specified for solo wouldn't make sense, although to my knowledge, the differences, where such exist, are usually fairly minimal. I seem to recall cases where it is around 50 to 60kg, which shouldn't make an awful lot of difference in standing height and would certainly be of interest only in borderline cases anyway.

 

[Lutz]

Its a no win situation because if you remove items from the caravan as I have to do to get the nose weight down(even with the rear bed space loaded ) then if its in the car boot its still a load on the rear suspension.

Of course, but you can't load the rear suspension any more when the caravan is attached or not. The maximum permissible rear axle load is an absolute figure, regardless of how the maximum payload is achieved. In other words, you can't have a worse condition than if the car is solo and fully laden. If you then attach the caravan, you will have to remove payload out of the boot by the same amount.

 

[RogerL]

The Astra's difference in max rear axle load for solo/towing conditions was 75kg - exactly equal to the maximum noseweight of 75kg.

To me, logically, the towball height should be checked with caravan attached at car's maximum noseweight and car loaded to maximum remaining payload - but that's not the official wording.

 

[WatsonJohnG]

Of course, but you can't load the rear suspension any more when the caravan is attached or not. The maximum permissible rear axle load is an absolute figure, regardless of how the maximum payload is achieved. In other words, you can't have a worse condition than if the car is solo and fully laden. If you then attach the caravan, you will have to remove payload out of the boot by the same amount.

That'show I see it

 

[Lutz]

The actual wording of the EU Directive is as follows:

Coupling balls and towing brackets must be attached to a vehicle of category M1, category M2 below 3.5 tonnes and category N1 in a manner which conforms to the clearance and height dimensions given in Figure 30. This requirement shall not apply to off-road vehicles as defined in Annex II to Directive 92/53/EEC.

When you look at Figure 30 it says 350-420 (vehicle load). This "vehicle load" has always been interpreted by the car manufacturers as fully laden. I appears to leave open which of the two GVW's are meant, if different ones are specified for solo and towing. As you say, it only makes sense when applied to the case if the caravan were attached, but this can easily be simulated, so I would say the higher of the two would apply.

 

[DavidW1]

I am wondering wether you actually have problem here as you say "it seems to sit low". All of the recent rigs I have had looked a bit, front of the van low, when viewed from the side and that includes four different off roaders and an estate car with most of the towbars fitted by by myself.

I read somewhere, think it was in a PC article, that a slightly nose down attitude is normal on a single axle and that the van will level up when underway. Wouldn't want to qantify that scientifically as I'm not that academic, momentum and aerodynamics come into it I expect, but I do know that it's true.

On my current combo, Shogun and Senator, the van is nose down at rest. On the move it seems to level out perfectly, how do I know? It's the old reflection in a shop window trick, only try this when there's no traffic though.

 

[Lutz]

The standard height of the a towball is 350 to 420mm. The standard height of the coupling when the caravan is standing level is 395 to 465mm. Therefore, the caravan will normally be standing nose down, especially in the extreme if the towball is 350mm and the caravan 465mm. Only in the opposite case, (towball at 420mm, caravan at 395mm) would there be a slight nose up attitude. Assuming that manufacturers try to aim for a median value, nose down will be the norm.