Alde Central Heating

[TonyG]

Surfer - it's clear to me that you had badly installed Truma systems so you're not comparing like with like..
Convection from the Alde heating elements will also stir up dust.
It'll always be quicker to heat air from cold than water/glycol.

Rodger we can only compare systems from our own experience. How do we know that a system has been badly installed. we buy a brand new caravan with an heating system pre installed!!!
having experienced Alde,( installed correctly or not) I personally would not but another caravan without it.

 

[RogerL]

No "d" please.

 

[TonyG]

No "d" please.

Sorry consider the "d" dropped

 

[RogerL]

No "d" please.

Sorry consider the "d" dropped

Thanks.

 

[ProfJohnL]

I am in the process of changing to a caravan with Alde heating and require some practical info please.
1) Can you be selective in which areas of the van you want to heat i.e. are there valves you turn off in the bedroom area for example
2) We normally with our current fire/blown air system just switch the fire on for short spells to take of the chill - would I have to switch the whole system on in the case of the Alde system.
3) How long does it take to heat up from cold??
Any help on this system would be appreciated.
Thanks, John

Hello John
I think you can see from the posts how different people feel about both types of heating. No sytems is universally better than the other, there both good and have particular plus points which in many cases are down to personal preferences.
As ever there are some people who will claim one systems is streets better than another, but as Roger L points out it all depends on having the systems properly installed, and I know from my past experience how the perfomance of blown air can be compromised by poor installtion by the caravan manufacture, just as I also know how the wet system has its draw backs and plus points.

Getting back to your specific questions.and in the numbered order you gave them.
With the Alde systems I have experienced all the radiators were connected in series. This meant you could not turn off different areas of the caravan, so it was all or nothing. Domestic systems can get round this with thernostatic radiator valves and radiator bypass pipes, perhaps these can be fitted to Alde systems. With blown air systems you simply adjust the air regulator valve.

Again from my experience with an Alde, you could select just hot water without space heating. With most blown air systems you have totally seperate heaters for space and water heating - Though I know Truma have offered a combi boiler.

How long a caravan takes to heat up as someone has already stated depends on the size of the heater, the size of the space to be heated, the insulation in the floor ceiling and walls, the outside temperature and the temperature you want to achieve inside. So you can see no one can give you a hard and fast answer to that, BUT you do start to get warm air from a blown air heater faster than the Alde system, but that advantage may be lost as the Alde system gets up to temperature.
I recall the NCC standards require manufactures to fit a heater that meets (or exceedes) a rate of temperature rise within the caravan. and that maintain a certain temperature rise above ambient. So you should not have a concern on that point.

Surfer has made some valid points regarding the dust that a blown air system can redistribute in the caravan and fan noise. Those are pesonal preferences which may or may not be a concern for you.
He also made the point that the loaction of the Alde radiators in the bedding lockers allowed warm air to rise up behind the seat cusions, implying that blown air cant do this. this is actually incorrect as the ducting for the blown air systems does provide heat to any of the lockers it passes through, and in fact Truma sell a pierced duct, and special window demister vents that can be fitted.
Its not actually difficult to peirce the duct yourself with a screw driver, and if you make a mistake a bit of masking tape quickly works to seal the unwanted hole(s) Angling the screwdriver when puching through can form a small detail to help direct the where you want it.
I would be happy with either system for most of my caravanning, but I know I can achieve the most even temperature distibution throughout the whole caravan with blown air, and in particular from top to bottom to reduce the hot head cold feet scenario. but in reality such perfection is not needed.

 

[Jennifer2]

Another thing I like with the Alde is the programmable thermostat. It's great being able to set it to warm up the van in the morning without getting out of bed!

 

[RogerL]

I leave my Truma running all night so it doesn't get cold !

 

[otherclive]

I really find it quite amazing that in these days of high energy prices, and environmental concerns that people heat their van's during the night, what happened to duvets, sleeping bags and 'cuddles'? Hubby should get up 10 minutes earlier and switch on the heating before making tea.

 

[RogerL]

I really find it quite amazing that in these days of high energy prices, and environmental concerns that people heat their van's during the night, what happened to duvets, sleeping bags and 'cuddles'? Hubby should get up 10 minutes earlier and switch on the heating before making tea.

Same reason I heat my house at night - it uses no more energy - if you let the caravan/house go cold overnight it takes all the energy you've "saved" to heat it back up again.
I do acknowledge that sleeping bags are very warm so the thermostat is turned down to 16 at night and then back up to 21 in the morning.

 

[anotherDavid]

We are about to get a van with Alde heating and since we do most of our caravanning where we spend more time trying to keep cool we are not looking forward to losing the fan element of the Truma system that we use to help cool the van. However it looks very good for the cooler end of the season and the water heating aspect looks a big improvement on what we had.
David

 

[otherclive]

The low overall 'specific heat' and mass of a caravan does not support your arguement as evidenced by the speed at which caravan loses heat compared to the time overnight on which heat is on.

 

[RogerL]

Specific heat and thermal mass are only part of the equation, insulation determines the rate of heat loss.
Because we turn the thermostat down from 21 to 16 at bedtime, the initial rate of cooling and heat loss is at exactly the same rate as if we switched the heating off - only when sufficient heat has gone to bring the temperature down to 16 does the heating cut back in just to maintain the temperature.

 

[Heethers]

The Aldi can have two temp settings one for night and one for day, the system then switches to the set temp for night and then for day setting, its programmable read the manual.

 

[otherclive]

Roger,

thank you for answering my comment and confirming the point that during the night you will be putting energy into the caravan heating system to maintain 16 deg C. All the insulation will do is to reduce the total amount of energy used in the period.. No complaints then if fuel duties are raised in January 2012 or site fees rise on account of unecessary EHU use?

 

[RogerL]

Clive - I think sites need to tackle those who heat uninsulated awnings with electric heaters first - if sites go to metered EHU so be it.

 

[Dustydog]

Roger
I am not convinced maintaining 61 deg F throughout the night is condusive to a good night's sleep. Power is being consumed, unneccessarily imo for no real gain. It is well doumented in medical circles that us humans sleep better in cold atmospheres but where the sleeping bag / duvet keep us warm.. At your temperature even a summer low tog quilt would make you very hot and uncomfortable. Unless of course you have green stuff running through your veins

.

No wonder poor old Steve in Leo is facing a 15% hike in his seasonal pitch price. Must be all those all nighter Alde boys

 

[RogerL]

I don't know where the idea comes from that it's a good thing to freeze all your bits off!
A BBC report on optimal overnight temperature http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/5372296.stm gives 18 deg C for the elderly, which I am, so I certainly don't regard my 16 C in the caravan as unreasonable.

 

[Dustydog]

Roger
Dry air is very bad for the breathing no matter what age. Under a good duvet or sleeping bag you will stay warm and not get cold.
I guess you are are a naturist who doesn't do bed clothes

 

[Danddandy]

Heethers. . Yes the Alde is progammable but I am of a generation that could never get the video machine to record want I wanted.

 

[Jennifer2]

This is one of those "urban myths", the Energy Savings Trust has commented on it. It does cost more to keep a house (or caravan) warm all the time than to let it cool down and heat it when you need it heated.

We hate sleeping in a warm bedroom. Our Alde is set to 12 degrees from 11pm to 7am, then to about 20 degrees for getting up in the morning.

When we go out during the day, we turn it down to about 16 degrees, then tun it up when we return

 

[Jennifer2]

Now, now, that is just being pathetic!! Sit down with the manual, half an hour peace and quiet, and concentrate. It does need concentration, but rocket science it ain't.

 

[RogerL]

Roger
Dry air is very bad for the breathing no matter what age. Under a good duvet or sleeping bag you will stay warm and not get cold.
I guess you are are a naturist who doesn't do bed clothes

Dry air is dependent on humidity and ventilation, not temperature - at least not in the range we're debating.

 

[Danddandy]

Concentration? . . I've never been good at that

 

[Guest]

So the Energy saving trust says it's cheaper to let your house cool down and then heat it up again and keeping it warm 24/7 is an 'urban myth'?
Way back in 76, several of us newly weds lived on a little estate of identical new 3 bed terraced open plan houses, no double glazing, wooden frames and doors.heating was a gas fire and a blown air gas heater up one end of the open plan lounge, this I kept on a fairly low setting 24/7, the gas fire, usually only then needing one bar in the evenings
A group of us were in our end of terrace house one evening late in 76, damn cold it was after that long summer!, anyway house was toasty and several conmmented, first on why the fire was only on one bar, then said they could not sit under their stairs as the draught coming down in their houses was too cold on three bars?, they also said I must be rich to pay the gas bill LOL
We had all just had ours bills, (no choice then, British Gas), and when I produced mine, they were stunned! all were paying considerably more than me to keep their houses cold!!!
Turned out none even used their blown air heater!
Exactly the same applies to caravans, this is the basis of all the collated information I've been handing out on the correct use of blown air, get the van 'thoroughly' warm and don't let it cool down. Once warm the fabric of the van is an energy store, the heating then has little to do to keep this store topped up
Any sudden drop in air temperature causes the store to give up heat, the heating can then cycle at leisure on a low setting to top up.
So now imagine the capacity of the energy store that is your modern fully insulated house? why would you allow that to get cold?. When we go away in January, the heating is turned down to 12C 24/7, this year, it will automatically switch back up to 22c day/18c at night, 5 days before our return, tried 3 then 4 days and the house had still not reached full heat.
Note, although heating is normally 18C overnight, actual temp only falls to around 19-20c the stored heat sees to that so all the heating is doing is topping up 2-3 degrees in the morning which takes perhaps an hour, then once or twice during the day.
So urban myth? or are they talking utter tosh?.... I can only speak as I find

 

[Surfer]

I agree with Gary as it makes sense. You have to have the heating on full for about an hour to warm up the caravan so that negates any savings made during the day. If out during the day, have the heating on low so it takes the *** out of the air and then only 10 minutes for the caravan to warm up when you turn it up.