Bad news with CAMC

[Dustydog]

The fact is Clive the Insurers underwriting tables do not follow the BBC. The point as I understand it from the quoted article is older are not as bad as younger. But what isn’t said is that both are worse than middle aged drivers. Well this was how it was when I worked for the CU.

 

[otherclive]

The fact is Clive the Insurers underwriting tables do not follow the BBC. The point as I understand it from the quoted article is older are not as bad as younger. But what isn’t said is that both are worse than middle aged drivers. Well this was how it was when I worked for the CU.

Table 1 and 2 is of interest in the Rospa paper linked below. The accident rates for killed and severely injured per million don’t show the middle aged safer when it comes to severe accidents. They are significantly higher than older drivers but may have less minor knocks but they aren’t counted in the wider debate on Are Old Drivers Safe. You don’t say whether your source relates to accident rate in the respective age bands for male or female nor is the cost of the accident discussed. And I mean the social cost as well as the cost of just repairing or replacing the vehicle and compensation etc. It’s a hugely complex subject studied in depth both in UK, USA, Australia and other EU countries too.

https://www.rospa.com/rospaweb/docs/advice-services/road-safety/drivers/older-drivers-2010.pdf

 

[Dustydog]

Perhaps some Insurers should read Rospa. Their stats are usually based on their own claims experiences rather than global stuff as such. Many years since I last read their underwriting guidesbut I doubt much has really changed.

 

[ProfJohnL]

All I can say it its a shame you don't all live in my parallel universe, and enjoy my insurance model....

What my model does not allow is for high risk drivers to have insurance...Problem sorted.
Now where did my wife park her disabled adapted Bugatti Chiron in the car park.

RIght.. that's my humour exhausted for another year so back to "nose loads"

 

[Hutch]

Never mind Prof I saw the funny side of your posting.

 

[otherclive]

Never mind Prof I saw the funny side of your posting.

Me too 👍

 

[Raywood]

Perhaps some Insurers should read Rospa. Their stats are usually based on their own claims experiences rather than global stuff as such. Many years since I last read their underwriting guidesbut I doubt much has really changed.

From my experience the underwriting books have gone out the window. Basically when I left the computer checked everything and set the rates on the basis of statistics . As we were one of the biggest we had enough for a decent analysis but not sure how the smaller ones manage it.
None standard cases still got the human touch if the computer could not manage or there was a query.
Quotes can in fact be wrong due to computer error. My son in law had a job at one time where he simply put in proposals to check what came back and to make sure it was correct. There were a fair number of wrong ones coming up, enough to justify employing him.

 

[ProfJohnL]

....Quotes can in fact be wrong due to computer error. ...

Hmmmmm Computers making errors????

No they don't -
Humans entering data make errors,
Humans writing and programming the software make errors,
Computers do exactly what they have been programmed to do within their capabilities - it may not be what the commissioners wanted exactly, but that's down to humans interpreting the specifications for the programme, and humans understanding the capabilities of the computer they are working with.
Humans also design computers and they do not always understand the limiting factors of proper design, and how the components of a computer may interact or fail.

Humans make computers make errors.

 

[Parksy]

Hmmmmm Computers making errors????

No they don't -
Humans entering data make errors,
Humans writing and programming the software make errors,
Computers do exactly what they have been programmed to do within their capabilities - it may not be what the commissioners wanted exactly, but that's down to humans interpreting the specifications for the programme, and humans understanding the capabilities of the computer they are working with.
Humans also design computers and they do not always understand the limiting factors of proper design, and how the components of a computer may interact or fail.

Humans make computers make errors.

Or to put it more simply - GIGO

 

[Raywood]

Whatever the problem I have two son in laws doing very well out of checking programs for errors.

 

[Guzzilazz]

The ability to check software for errors is a bit of a thankless task. I used to deal with a mainframe financial budget application, which had about 10,000 lines of code. The number of permutations of routes through that code was that it would have taken about 20 years of work for a team of about 50...


Windows has about 30,000,000 lines of code...

 

[Hutch]

The ability to check software for errors is a bit of a thankless task. I used to deal with a mainframe financial budget application, which had about 10,000 lines of code. The number of permutations of routes through that code was that it would have taken about 20 years of work for a team of about 50...


Windows has about 30,000,000 lines of code...

Sounds like gender finding of chickens, made easy. 😅

 

[Dustydog]

No wonder the 737 Max is still grounded

 

[Scorpy]

I insure with LV too on a Multy Car Policy. Thankfully the premium hasn't changed for the past 3 years. I am at maximum NCB so doesn't change anymore and on 10k per car mileage. Costs about £480 a year for 3 cars
Only downside is they won't include the bikes on same policy
Mike

 

[RayS]

I went to what is now LV through CSMA when I became a civil servant back in 1987 and have not been able to beat their prices ever since particularly if you include 180 day European cover.
Their definition of civil servant is pretty broad so if you or a close family member is or has been one, postman, telephone , etc etc it may be worth enquiring.

 

[audiorob]

When I retired a few years ago my insurance went up, despite no longer having business use included, when I queried was told that all the extra time on my hands suggested increased motoring use. Little did they know, since I changed my car in November I am now averaging less than 15 miles a day, about 5500 a year and still dropping as it mainly sits idle on my drive!

 

[ProfJohnL]

I think I'm a civil servant , after all I'm at the beck and call of the governement and tax man

 

[Raywood]

The annual mileage is one of the underwriting criteria so if your mileage has dropped then tell your insurer. They do have a minimum mileage below which the premium remains the same, so it might not work.
At renewal do get more quotes to see if you are being overcharged, although I would look at the cover and go for a better policy rather than the cheapest.

 

[Robert_374373903]

Am with LV over many years, first claim three years ago when a tip up lorry reversed into our Skoda whilst parked . Insurance went up even though it was not my fault from £270 to £600, went on line found they were even dearer up to £1000+. They say its my age .

 

[Beachball]

My wife got a Mitsubishi Colt Attivo 1.1 car she got it when it was three years old it a 58 plate she use this insurance they do a match search it called
One Call Insurance & breakdown so far they have been very reasonable

 

[CustardAvenger]

I have cycled through LV, More Than, Admiral, Churchil and Direct Line for insurance over the last 21 years as their renewals are always up on the previous year forcing a move. However, for the last 2-3 years, we have not been able to beat the Admiral multicar policy for our 2 cars. But for some reason our home cover bundled in to that policy went up by over £200, despite no new claims. We had to split that out, and went with More Than [as our pet insurance gave us extra discount] to reduce the premium back to the average price across other providers.

What has increased for me, with no cheaper option, is the cost of Caravan insurance. CAMC has always been the most expensive option; Towergate the cheapest, but the prices are converging. After my first year of Tourer insurance the premium increased £160. 2020's renewal was similarly increased but after much discussions on the phone, the increase was reduced to £20 - still a good £150 cheaper than my CAMC quote.

 

[Raywood]

The CAMC policy has always been expensive, but their claims service is known as exceptional and the settlements always fair. If a policy is the cheapest, you have to wonder how they do it, and assume something is missing. I have the middle of the road priced C&CC policy, which was very good when I had a Claim, and there was no increase in premium at renewal.

 

[Guzzilazz]

Until the insurance industry stops trying to buy new business, this rubbish will continue. I had to renew my Motorcycle insurance this week. The renewal quote from Bennetts (part of Saga) was £100... I went on to Comparethemarket, and the top quote was £89... From Bennetts... I rang up and told them what I thought! Made me feel better

 

[Buckman]

We use RIAS for my vehicle and Towergate for caravan insurance. Towergate is as good as CMC who no longer offer insurance, but do offer Caravan Cover.

 

[Raywood]

The CAMH policy is slightly different, but perfectly safe as it is reinsured. They are probably the most generous in their claims handling which tends to make the premiums that bit mnore expensive.
I have looked at the Towergate web site and there is nothing to say that it has a DEFAQTO rating which means the cover may be lacking. They give you a FEEFO rating but this seems to be nothing more than customers saying that the sales service is good, but this applies to almost all insurance sales. I appreciate that DEFAQTO is largely about cover and not service but unless you start with the best cover you are doing yourself down from the start.
They do not seem to say who the insurer is, which would also put me off, as you cannot be sure of the level of service without this.
Towergate are a large and reputable business but I think the information on the website is not up to the standard I would want.
Given the above there is nothing to tempt me there.