Brake rod and handbrake lever replacement

[arob.wk]

New to caravans and new to caravan mechanicals. As reported in my new member introduction post, I have a 2004 caravan with a trashed Al-Ko brake rod and hand-brake lever. Damage caused by my neighbour in his field unfortunately: long story - I won't bother you with. Caravan now dragged, noisily, to my field.

I've contacted Al-Ko shop UK about what I can get to replace, but they've not bothered to get back yet. I'm hoping PC members can offer me a few tips on how to fix this. As the 'van cannot be towed very far (rod now digging into the ground), repairs will need to be conducted in my field. Caravan very low slung and not easily "crawled" under even when jacked (I've tried). A couple of caravan servicing companies have both said this will "cost you" if we have to come out !!
One suggested I could remove the rod and tow it to them unbraked, but 'van weighs more than my vehicle's unbraked towing limit therefore requiring towing assistance from a.n.other.

So, this is where I'm at:

The bent bespoke Al-Ko brake rod (pull-rod) is only threaded at the front end: it is 9mm in diameter !!! (So a standard replacement 8mm or 10mm rod will need all new linkage components to make it fit.) If it was 8mm or 10mm, I would saw through it and have someone tow 'van to a service centre, but I'm reluctant to cut it (as it is bespoke 9mm) hoping I might be able to unbend the rear end at least and just replace the brake lever.

My first question is therefore: if I disconnect the rod from the clevis connector at the hand-brake lever and push the rod rear-wards will the brake cables easily disconnect from the balancing bracket (perhaps using some sort of extended tool with a hook on the end) or will I need to get under there to manipulate their disconnection?
(If I need to get under the caravan I will need neighbour to come dig me an access pit - they have an excavator.)

 

[ProfJohnL]

Hello Arob.

I'm not a caravan chassis expert, but as far as I know all UK caravan braking systems rely on the "overrun" principle where as the tow car slows down the caravan tries to carry on which compresses the sliding hitch which translates to pulling the brake rod forward and applying the caravans brakes. This system is largely self regulating once set up correctly.

But it does mean if the brake rod that goes from the hitch to "brake balancing bracket is disconnected from the hand lever end and supported the brakes should not be activated and the caravan can be towed to get it off the field to a place where you might be more able to make repairs.

Pulling the caravans road wheels up a few planks or wheel stands and leaving it couled to teh car should secure the caravan and give you a safer and easire working height.

 

[Buckman]

A couple of caravan servicing companies have both said this will "cost you" if we have to come out !!
One suggested I could remove the rod and tow it to them unbraked, but 'van weighs more than my vehicle's unbraked towing limit therefore requiring towing assistance from a.n.other.

Have you tried Approved Workshop Scheme technician? There wil be one in your area that probably could help. These technicians are registered with the NCC.

 

[Jcloughie]

An access pit is only good if the walls can withstand the weight of ground and van, otherwise it is better known as a grave. Get good quality axle stands, 4 would be good, 2 in front of the axle and two behind, and Jack it up. Support the hitch for safety.

when under, take some pictures and post them, that would help, even though your text is very descriptive.

John

 

[audiorob]

Not clear who muttered about a costly job, but there are usually mobile repairers/service engineers who are used to servicing vans on customer premises. Other thought is if the rod is easy to remove (and then replace) could you find a modern blacksmith who can heat it to straighten it for you - even a job you might tackle yourself if you have that sort of gear.

 

[Damian]

Get good quality axle stands, 4 would be good, 2 in front of the axle and two behind,

I am struggling to work out what you suggest.

There is only one axle and any axle stands will be in a line.

What do you mean by two in front and two behind.

You cannot use the chassis rails, or the floor.

What could be done is raise the van on a couple of jacks and use two axle stands, one at each end, then lower the steadies whilst working underneath.

 

[Jcloughie]

When I had work done in France, they used stands fore and aft of the axle, thereby spreading the load and making it very stable. They had the advantage of being able to use 4 trolly jacks, simultaneously to raise the van. Thereby keeping it level throughout the process. Yes they were supporting on the chassis, but with the load spread.

Alko and Kojack only spread the load on one part of the chassis.

Can’t find it now, I once saw a YouTube video from Truma in Germany. Where they put the van on the lift, then transferred to axle stands, on the lift to remove the wheels.

Chipping Sudbury caravans had mine, and 5 other vans supported this way while the changed the Axles. Surprisingly, they had no problem with both myself, and my wife going in the van while it was supported this way.


John

 

[arob.wk]

Thanks all for your many responses so far: this is such a great, friendly forum. Please give me a while to absorb b4 any further input/comments/questions from me. Of course, if anyone else is inclined to chip in I will be listening.

 

[Hutch]

Whilst at a caravan workshop, I saw a caravan tipped up on its wheels so that the stays at the rear took the weight and the front was really high 4 foot plus giving axcess to the underside. No pit needed.

 

[Damian]

When I had work done in France, they used stands fore and aft of the axle

So, just because some unknown idiot decided to jack the van on its chassis rails , that is OK?
The same can be said for the UK so called workshop.

Why then I wonder why manufacturers bother to spend money providing the best information on what can be done and , more importantly what should not be done with their products?

Al-Ko give three acceptable means of jacking a van, either with a sidelift jack, under the reinforced web behind the brake backplate or under the axle tube near the wheel.
They state quite clearly that a van should NOT be jacked under the chassis rails.
But, hey, what would they know !!!!!

 

[Ern]

So, just because some unknown idiot decided to jack the van on its chassis rails , that is OK?
The same can be said for the UK so called workshop.

Why then I wonder why manufacturers bother to spend money providing the best information on what can be done and , more importantly what should not be done with their products?

Al-Ko give three acceptable means of jacking a van, either with a sidelift jack, under the reinforced web behind the brake backplate or under the axle tube near the wheel.
They state quite clearly that a van should NOT be jacked under the chassis rails.
But, hey, what would they know !!!!!

In order to do the job being discussed, no Jack's are needed. Parking brake on and chocks in place. Raise rear steadies, raise the front (on a decent block under the jockey wheel if needed) to achieve maximum lift. Loads of space under the caravan to access the brake linkage.

 

[Jcloughie]

So, just because some unknown idiot decided to jack the van on its chassis rails , that is OK?
The same can be said for the UK so called workshop.

I know it’s a matter of common sense and interpretation. But just for your information.

Chipping Sudbury

It’s a major centre in the SW closely aligned with Bailey. But do major repairs on all makes. On mine they changed the axle, steadies, hitch, mover and one whole side. While it was being done, I part exchanged it at Golden Castle. They said they did not need to see it, if CS were doing it, that’s good enough for them.

What did confuse me was how they went about changing the axels. My van, and others were stood on stands waiting for axels to be fitted. I have always wondered how they moved them onto the lift, unless they fitted the new axels at low level.

But it does raise the question, if the axle is being changed, how else can the body be supported? Not on the steadies I hope.

The French place were motor home specialist. They used 4 large trolly jacks, two each side, with the handles angles to the middle. In this way, one person could operate two jacks, they communicated with each other and operated them simultaneously. Just in front of them was an unused 4 post lift.

Please don’t shoot the messenger, just saying exactly what I have seen and what is my experience..

If I was working under a raised van, jacked up at the axle, I would want stands as a precaution. Belts and braces.


John

 

[Anseo]

I know it’s a matter of common sense and interpretation. But just for your information.

Chipping Sudbury

It’s a major centre in the SW closely aligned with Bailey. But do major repairs on all makes. On mine they changed the axle, steadies, hitch, mover and one whole side. While it was being done, I part exchanged it at Golden Castle. They said they did not need to see it, if CS were doing it, that’s good enough for them.

What did confuse me was how they went about changing the axels. My van, and others were stood on stands waiting for axels to be fitted. I have always wondered how they moved them onto the lift, unless they fitted the new axels at low level.

But it does raise the question, if the axle is being changed, how else can the body be supported? Not on the steadies I hope.

The French place were motor home specialist. They used 4 large trolly jacks, two each side, with the handles angles to the middle. In this way, one person could operate two jacks, they communicated with each other and operated them simultaneously. Just in front of them was an unused 4 post lift.

Please don’t shoot the messenger, just saying exactly what I have seen and what is my experience..

If I was working under a raised van, jacked up at the axle, I would want stands as a precaution. Belts and braces.


John

I see Chipping Sudbury are approved by the NCC.
Quote: "when you bring your caravan to us you can rest assured it is in expert hands" .
They must be doing things by the book then .

Chipping Sudbury WORKSHOP

 

[arob.wk]

(Quote function isn't working for me so in response to Hutch's last post and Ern's later post).

I'll size that up, but it didn't work the other way around which is with the hitch on the ground and one side jacked up. Maybe with 'van wheels each on a concrete block, say, and jockey wheel also on a block and front end screwed up to max' who knows !?

Regarding the digging a pit idea: I would only have a 2'x2' channel dug out sufficient to crawl along (perhaps with 'van also on blocks) to fiddle with brake cable connections. I don't reckon any slumping would end up burying me beyond escape! Whether a mobile mechanic would be happy to crawl along is another matter. (I could always tie a rope to his/her leg just in case.)

As regards jacking-up on the chassis member; I did not know about this at the time I jacked the 'van up for the 1st time !! I did sensibly place jack very close to axle though so hopefully no ill affect on the chassis member (and 'van is a tiddler). Caravan came with a plain-topped scissor-jack so I'll place that under the axle itself next time. (With the wheel off, I didn't notice any jacking brackets or holes in chassis for fixings. I guess jacking brackets were a post-2004 design feature and I will just have to place jack under axle in future.)

I will check out the mobile mechanic option: I had simply called the closest caravan sales/servicing centres who, I guess, have not set themselves up for mobile repairs. Thanks for the suggestion.

At the moment, I'm inclined towards the "find a blacksmith" option rather than replace everything (once I've managed to disengage and extract the Al-Ko rod).

Thanks everyone for your comments.

 

[Jcloughie]

I see Chipping Sudbury are approved by the NCC.
Quote: "when you bring your caravan to us you can rest assured it is in expert hands" .
They must be doing things by the book then .

Chipping Sudbury WORKSHOP

I imagine they also have Risk Assessments in place for there operations and procedures. Nevertheless, they could be cutting corners, it’s not unheard of. But the manufacturers and insurance accessors seem happy.

John

 

[Dustydog]

Chipping Sodbury Caravans are the number one Bailey Dealer . We have had a few new caravans off them and their after sales has been excellent.
I guess the real question is “ How do you support the caravan to change the axle”?
Presumably the Engineers have guidelines from Al Ko? I don’t know but am very curious🤪

 

[Anseo]

Chipping Sodbury Caravans are the number one Bailey Dealer . We have had a few new caravans off them and their after sales has been excellent.
I guess the real question is “ How do you support the caravan to change the axle”?
Presumably the Engineers have guidelines from Al Ko? I don’t know but am very curious🤪

One of several options I guess DD (right click on link )

And another, google will probably find many more (right click on link)

 

[Dustydog]

Thanks John. So easy when you know. I bet the four contact points aren’t reinforced

 

[Anseo]

Thanks John. So easy when you know. I bet the four contact points aren’t reinforced

I can't tell from the pics Alan, but perhaps in some instances load spreader channels\plates are inserted to the underside of chassis members.

 

[otherclive]

Mine was replaced by Swift dealership Tilshead Caravans. It went up on hydraulic lifts with spreader bars. Here’s a YouTube video by Fraser Brown Engineering who rebush caravan and motorhome axles but the owner has to arrange to remove and replace the axle. I opted for a main dealer replacement as it gave me the assurance of a better warranty and I wasn’t taking the risk of removal and replacement via yet another party.

View: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=8I420hPkxQA&feature=youtu.be

 

[Dustydog]

Well Clive
Needs a carpenter 😜😜. Weird how these failures still happen. My two twelve year olds are well within tolerance.
Was it established why certain years had so many failures?

 

[Jcloughie]

My feeling from what I saw at Chipping Sudbury and France and the last few posts, is: Normal jacking under the rails is very bad as lateral forces can easily be applied with possible catastrophic affects. But supported squarely and level is a different thing altogether.

Knowing this, wouldn’t you think that Alko would provide a decent jacking point origionaly. The Alko and Kojack additions don’t appear to me to be man enough to spread the loads sufficiently, but just an opinion.

I don’t know what method Chipping Sudbury used to lift the vans up onto axle stands. It might even be that the weren’t standard axle stands, perhaps fitting closely to the rail.

When I asked if I could get things out of the van, they opened it and put steps in place, we both went in and did what we had to do. It felt solid. It was only went I went out, I noticed that the vans around us had no wheels, I then looked back at ours and that was the same.

Looking at the video OC posted, I now suspect the they fitted the new axle at low level. Sliding it under the van on that rig, and lifting into place. But I was not there for all that so just conjecture.


John

 

[otherclive]

Well Clive
Needs a carpenter 😜😜. Weird how these failures still happen. My two twelve year olds are well within tolerance.
Was it established why certain years had so many failures?

Mine was a swift not Bailey and 2012 build. Baileys seemed to fail at a later date. I’ve no idea why it failed. It could have been the first owner overloaded or it could have been pothole induced damage. I will never know but it left me over £1300 out of pocket.

 

[arob.wk]

"Guys" - to get back on thread (no issue with it wandering a bit and not for a newbie to "tut tut", but), no one has yet commented on whether brake cables will pop out of their "seats" easily if whole system slackened enough from the front end.
Will I need to get under there to disengage brake cables or will they pop out easily if slackened off (using, say, a pole with a hook on the end to pull them out of the cradle) so that I can pull the existing bent rod out without much else to do. (Putting it back togther is when I really expect to need to get under there to connect brake cables up.)

 

[Jcloughie]

"Guys" - to get back on thread (no issue with it wandering a bit and not for a newbie to "tut tut", but), no one has yet commented on whether brake cables will pop out of their "seats" easily if whole system slackened enough from the front end.
Will I need to get under there to disengage brake cables or will they pop out easily if slackened off (using, say, a pole with a hook on the end to pull them out of the cradle) so that I can pull the existing bent rod out without much else to do. (Putting it back togther is when I really expect to need to get under there to connect brake cables up.)

I can’t give specific help as it is not something I have experience of. But it seems to me that if you will need to get underneath to reassemble, why not start from underneath where you can work most comfortably and not blindly. These things all went together, so should come apart. I imagine, like bikes, cable ends will pop out when they are slackened.

John