Caravan Club....don't you just love them?

[otherclive]

We have just arrived back from a really good holiday in southern Spain spent visiting the Moorish cities and walking in the national parks (without caravan again). On our way home we were talking about how we were looking forwards to our next 'proper' holiday in the caravan which is booked foor early September, although there will be short get aways in between.
The planned two week break consists of one week in Northumberland on a CS followed by one week at Caravan Club Hawes site in Yorkshire Booked February 2013). We have visited Hawes several times and really like it for its walking and the town pubs and shops. Anyway when ploughing through the mail I came across a letter from the Caravan Club advising us that we could no longer have a pitch with an awning at Hawes as the growing size of outfits and the need to ensure 'best practice' (whatever that is) and safety meant the number of awning pitches had to be reduced and we were now on a non-awning pitch.
Much as I expect this summer to be superb the thought of spending a week 'up North', or anywhere, without an awing doesnt fill me with joy. But seriously the awning is part of the outfit. We use it as part of our living space, and its not even a full size one.

This problem facing the CC has not suddenly cropped up this year, as I think that we all know that oufits have been getting larger. Why the CC could not have done their homework and then introduced the changes with the 2014 booking beats me. Having made our arrangments in February this year we now have to deciide what to do about the week in Yorkshire. But one thing is certain and that is that we will not be taking the caravan to Hawes Caravan Club site. That booking is cancelled now, especially after reading Changing pitch page 15 of the June issue of the Caravan Club Magazine, and I quote "....nothing ignites my ear drums like the gentle slap of the awning canvas in the breeze"; he should be so lucky!!

 

[cooky1]

We stay on the Hawes site a few times each year and know that some of the plots are a bit on the small size. How can they decide that it is you who can no longer put up an awning? How do they know which plots will be free when you get there? I certainly would not be verty happy to have my booking changed and I would also cancel my booking.

 

[Connie1]

We stayed at CC site Aberban earlier this year, and was told by the temporary warden that they had lost some of their pitches as they were not the 6 meter distance apart, and the pitch next to us was one of them, only just over a car widith away from us. When the wardens changed over the very next day a caravan arrived and was put on the pitch. Not on we even could not spin the van to get out, its a joke. I am now worried about our pitch at Castleton at new year as they are not 6 meters apart.

 

[dave8858]

Duplicate Post

 

[dave8858]

Have you tried Bainbridge Ings its 5 minute walk into Hawes.

Details on this link http://www.bainbridge-ings.co.uk/site_details.htm

Regards

Dave

 

[otherclive]

Dave
thank you for the link. I have emailed them to see if they have a pitch available. The location looks good and Hawes is such a nice village to walk into to shop, or a pint. Fingers crossed!

 

[otherclive]

Thanks again, we are now booked at Bainbridge, very friendly lady and good reviews. Roll on September!

 

[colin-yorkshire1]

Thanks again, we are now booked at Bainbridge, very friendly lady and good reviews. Roll on September!

well done Clive talk with your feet

. been on Bainbridge allthough a few years ago now while we had the m/home (tended to use sites within walking distance of towns) to avoid moving the van, nice site even then, ENJOY

 

[otherclive]

Colin,
totally agree with your sentiments re voting with your feet, or wallet. Must say I think it came out of the recent H&S risk assessmenst undertaken by the CC. As a few weeks back I noticed at Cirencester Park the proliferation of signs warning you of hazards, which in most places would not even get a mention. Examples were warning you of rabbit holes ina grass bank, yet the site sits in a wonderful parkland setting where there are hundreds of holes and bumps. The other one was warning you about a slippy slight incline again a short cut not a recognised path. Compared to Spain where we have just spenta good holiday touring the southern cities and walking in the national parks UK is a veritable proliferation of signs. Few if any do any good except for yard arm clearing on behalf of the poster. But eh mustnt go there as Ive recently had a pseudo-political post removed!!

 

[dave8858]

They have a sign at Lower Wensleydale CC site saying Don't swing on the gate! If it hadn't been for that sign I'd never have even thought about it.

Needless to say I had a little swing

Dave

 

[Raywood]

The Caravn Club have made a mess of this. The problem is that fire regulations are now being enforced but the club surely should have known this when they took bookings for this year. Not taking action could result in the loss of licence so it had to be done and could not wait until next year but the way it was done has been a mess.
There should be no chance of anyone who has a confirmed awning pitch not getting one as the non awning pitches are marked and if you take the wrong one you will be told to move.

 

[otherclive]

I have today received a letter from the CC responding to my complaint. It explains that initially they tried contacting affected parties by phone but it was impracticable. Deciding who to take off an awning pitch was done on a first in last out basis. So for a booking made in February for September I wasn't far enough up the list to retain my awning pitch. This doesn't bode well for those not able to commit very early when the on- line booking system opens for the 2014 season. If awning pitches have all been booked early in 2014 will members go for a nonawning pitch on a CC site or vote with their feet to CL, C&CC, CL or commercial sites where they can have an awning. Time will tell. It would be interesting to ascertain which CC sites are most affected.

 

[stevearty]

Could someone enlighten me. In the early parts of this thread people mention "6 metres", could a kind person clarify this for me, thanks,

 

[colin-yorkshire1]

Could someone enlighten me. In the early parts of this thread people mention "6 metres", could a kind person clarify this for me, thanks,

simple really fire regulations, think of a line of vans on site side by side from pitch to pitch, each has one car, one van, and one awning,
thats 2mtrs for the van 2mtrs for the awning and 2mtrs for the car, 6mtrs in all, or18feet and thats tight it used to be 10mtrs.

 

[woodsieboy]

Hi Colin

I was under the impression that the 6 metre rule was the space needed between pitches,so that the gap between outfits on adjacent pitches is 6 metres.The gap between say my car parked next to the caravan and my neighbours awning would be 6 metres,the reasonong I believed was for the gap to act as a firebreak. In effect anybody who chooses not to use an awning can theN be accomodated on a smaller pitch,as long as the gap between outfits remains 6 metres, perhaps somebody else can give a definitive answer.

 

[otherclive]

Hi Colin

I was under the impression that the 6 metre rule was the space needed between pitches,so that the gap between outfits on adjacent pitches is 6 metres.The gap between say my car parked next to the caravan and my neighbours awning would be 6 metres,the reasonong I believed was for the gap to act as a firebreak. In effect anybody who chooses not to use an awning can theN be accomodated on a smaller pitch,as long as the gap between outfits remains 6 metres, perhaps somebody else can give a definitive answer.

that is my understanding and that's why on some sites you have been asked to park your car in front of the van across the nose wheel.

 

[Parksy]

Could someone enlighten me. In the early parts of this thread people mention "6 metres", could a kind person clarify this for me, thanks,

simple really fire regulations, think of a line of vans on site side by side from pitch to pitch, each has one car, one van, and one awning,
thats 2mtrs for the van 2mtrs for the awning and 2mtrs for the car, 6mtrs in all, or18feet and thats tight it used to be 10mtrs.

Hi Colin
C&CC rally stewards are instructed that the 6 metres has to be a clear gap between the nearest object, be it a car, caravan or awning.

 

[Parksy]

Colin,
.............. But eh mustnt go there as Ive recently had a pseudo-political post removed!!

Tis true, your removed post was a response to 'pseudo political' points made by others.
Unfortunately experience has shown that when even mildly political material appears on the forum the whole thing escalates to a point where extreme political views start to be aired.
That being the case even mildly political material is taken down to avoid accusations of political bias.

 

[colin-yorkshire1]

hi all,
thank you for pointing out my mistake, I shall make note of it next time I arrive on a site that has distinct markers on bays I have in the past been on sites where the spaces were so close you could not park the car between your van and your neighbours awning, or having chosen a corner pitch with loads of space, arrived back one day and found a tent pitched right in the corner,
mostly we use CL's where spacing in not a problem

 

[stevearty]

Hi folks, the reason I asked was because I am "wardening" on a caravan park for the season and have a copy of the local authority fire regulations which states;

There must be 6 metres between caravans. This distance may be reduced to 3.5 or 4.5 metres if the Caravans are of modern fire resistance construction, subject to risk assesment. There must be a 3 metre gap between an awning and a Caravan. Awnings must not face each other, and where the seperation is only 3 metres, awnings are not to be used for sleeping accommodation.

I was wondering whether the Caravan Club were employing more stringent regulations?

 

[otherclive]

The regulations seem awfully vague. Who defines modern fire resistant construction? How would you determine whether a 3.5 or 4.5 metre gap is appropriate or something in between. Nothing said about the car either. Have a look on the CC website their policy is explained. Looks like a trip to B&Q for a good tape measure!!

 

[dave8858]

If there were a 'jobs worth' award between the clubs I know which one would win it by a country mile!

David

 

[ed1]

Hello all, We got our letter today, telling us the pitch booked for August BH, at park coppice would no longer be available due to the new rules. They were sorry for this and gave the option of cancelling or keep checking with the site to see if someone cancelled. We need our awning as we go kayaking from this site, and have dogs, and were taking our granddaughter. I rang the club to ask if by rebooking another site I would end up getting another letter in a few weeks time, the lovely lady did try her best to find out but could not give me assurance of which sites had been visited or not. It's August BH, I can't wait till the last minute. I did feel like not bothering anymore, but we actually go to Kendal on Friday, but non awning pitch, as no kayaks this time or grandchildren, an only for 1 night as a stopover. I do feel it's a bit odd to do this but understand the safety issue, but I am reluctant to book again. I think I am going to ring the sites direct and hopefully they will be able to let me know if their site has been visited. But obviously not park coppice, coniston.

 

[Surfer]

I am beginning to think that the CC has got hold of the wrong end of the stick and applying the 6m rule incorrectly There seems to be a misunderstanding regarding the 6m regulation as
it only applies to caravans with plywood walls and how many caravans
nowadays have plywood walls? Also awnings should not be facing one
another according to the regulations. Seems the
CC have got it wrong?

If aluminium then the spacing is 5m and not 6m. As per the following link
http://www.rother.gov.uk/media/pdf/k/o/STATICCO.pdf

DEFINITION OF "CARAVAN"

Section 29: "Caravan" means any structure designed or adapted for
human habitation which is capable of being moved from one place to
another (whether by being towed or by being transported on a motor
vehicle or trailer) and any motor vehicle so designed
or adapted.

SPACING OF CARAVANS

1. Every caravan stationed on the land and used for the purposes of human habitation shall not be less than in the case of

(a) aluminium or other units made of similar fire performance materials -
5 metres, and

(b) for those with a plywood or similar skin - 6 metres

from any other caravan in a separate occupation and not less than 3
metres from a site boundary (which at all times shall be kept clear), or
carriageway or parking space, providing that, if the spacing of the
caravans is arranged as shown upon the layout
plan, a minimum distance of 3.5 metres, corner to corner, shall satisfy
this condition.

2. The point of measurement for porches, awnings, etc is the exterior cladding of the caravan.

3. Porches may protrude 1 metre into the 5 metres and should be of the open type.

4. Where awnings are used, the distance between any part of the
awning and an adjoining caravan should not be less than 3 metres.
They should not be of the type which incorporate sleeping accommodation and they should not face each other or touch.

5. Eaves, drainpipes and bay windows may extend into the 5 metres
space provided the total distance between extremities of 2 adjacent
units is not less than 4.5 metres.

6. Where there are ramps for the disabled, verandahs and stairs
extending from the unit, there should be 3.5 metres clear space between
them and such items should not face each other in any space. If they are
enclosed, they may need to be considered as part
of the unit and, as such, should not intrude in to the 5 metres (or 6
metres) space.

7. A garage, shed or a covered storage space should be permitted
between units only if it is of non-combustible construction (including
non-combustible roof) and sufficient space is maintained around each
unit so as not to prejudice means of escape in case
of fire. Windows in such structures should not face towards the unit
on either side. Car ports and covered walkways should in no
circumstances be allowed within the 5 or 6 metres space for cars and
boats between units, see Schedule J(M).

Here is the link to the original Act which ahs been adapted by all councils within England. http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/Eliz2/8-9/62

Any comments?

 

[ProfJohnL]

Hello Surfer

Your point is accurate, if tedious, and if site owners were to follow the regulations preciously then the site wardens would be out with their measuring sticks and structural test kits when ever we arrived to ensure safety distances were maintained.

That clearly is impractical, so the next best thing is to adopt a keep it simple policy that encompasses the worst case scenario, and in practice that is a 6M distance.

On a whole season pitch it may be worth going through the detail options to maximise ground usage, but for the more conventional touring sites customers would be very unhappy if they all had to rearrange their caravans and awnings just because a caravan arrived that needed a bigger safety distance.

It is also far more pragmatic to plan a site based one size safety distance so site facilities can be installed effectively (Bollards and drains etc).