Caravan Consumer unit

[Manuel_374563143]

I'm retro fitting electricity back into my Caravan as anything that was there was removed. I understand that site hookups varies from about 5Amp to 16Amp however when looking at consumer units the main switch is always well above 60Amps and MCB's as high as 30Amps for the circuits. I'm fairly proficient with electrics but can't see how this is safe. I don't really want to be burning out the cable to the hook up.

Is the EHU outlet fused at the output side? as anything more than 16 Amps drawn over the cable is unsafe.

how can you get small enough MCB's to deal with the small amount of power that a caravan uses?

 

[xtrailman]

I fitted a consumer unit to my shed, which would be ideal.

It has a rcd supplying two CB, rated at 6amp (lighting)and 16amp,(sockets) Bought it from screwfix or toolstation, cant remember which, sorry.

Or you can buy a empty unit, and make your own up. I would buy the former.

 

[Manuel_374563143]

The problem is that if you pull max Amps from the sockets and lightling then your pulling 22 amps which means that the cable isn't safe.

 

[ProfJohnL]

Hello Manuel,

There are specific consumer units designed for caravan systems, and normally they have a 6A mcb for the lighting circuits and an 10A for the power circuits. giving a max total of 16A. These are not standard domestic systems.

The function of the main switch is not to respond to current over loads, but to fault currents that imbalance the phase and neutral conductors, so its current capacity is usually higher than the combined values of the MCB's.

You also need to be aware that caravans should be double pole switched to limit the possibility of dangerous situations if the sites supply is reversed polarity, as can happen on the continent.

The supply end of the EHU (the site bollard) should installed according to the IEE regs and will be protected by its own MCB and RCD, which should protect your EHU cable.

 

[Damian]

Quote "You also need to be aware that caravans should be double pole switched "

Just a slight correction here.

Ther eis no "should" about it.

A caravan MUST have all circuit breakers and sockets double pole switched

 

[Manuel_374563143]

Hi thanks for the information.

I've had a look but can't find caravan consumer units am I using the wrong term?

 

[ChrisUK]

Quote "You also need to be aware that caravans should be double pole switched "

Just a slight correction here.

Ther eis no "should" about it.

A caravan MUST have all circuit breakers and sockets double pole switched

We have a 2008 Elddis and non of the outlet sockets are switched.

I agree I wish they were but I assume Elddis are following the rules.

 

[ProfJohnL]

Hello Manuel,

See:

http://www.towsure.com/product/532-Caravan_Mains_Kit#largeimage

 

[ProfJohnL]

Quote "You also need to be aware that caravans should be double pole switched "

Just a slight correction here.

Ther eis no "should" about it.

A caravan MUST have all circuit breakers and sockets double pole switched

Thank you Damian

 

[xtrailman]

Apologies, i completely forgot about the double pole CB's. However the RCD is.

Having said that, i would ensure the towsure product IS double poled. The CB's look too narrow to be double pole?

While single pole would be perfectly safe in normal circumstances, should the mains lead or supply be reversed, then only the neutral would be broke, the appliance still live.

 

[Woody3]

That is why you carry a plug-in mains tester with you and a short CEE47 plug-socket cable with L and N reversed at one end.

Note that supply reversal/double pole switching is only necessary if the caravan is being used outside the UK and RoI. As all UK outlets will be wired to UK regs the polarity will be correct and single pole breakers will be safe.

 

[Manuel_374563143]

John, Thanks for the link.

Only problem is that i don't want the hook up point of the sockets, Also no information on the consumer unit at all. How do i know hat fuses are it in and what the main switch is?

 

[ProfJohnL]

Hello manual,

The link was to show what was required, and the fact that it is available as a kit designed for caravans.

If you are not familiar with the necessary equipment, then I must respectfully tell you that in compliance with the electricity regulations you must have the work carried out by a qualified electrician, who will be able to test and certify the installation.

not recognise the items, then I have to suggest that the work required to safely install the electrics is beyond your

 

[steffanos]

Remember too that the EHU are protected, so even if you did attempt to overlaod in your van, the site supply would/should keep tripping.

 

[Manuel_374563143]

John L,

The electricity regulations don't say anything about a qualified electrician they say competent persons for installations then checked and signed off. I have a friend who's qualified and happy to check my work.

I don't have a huge amount of faith in the qualification since last time I used a qualified electrician he left the items he was working on in a dangerous situations, I then had to rectify. I would strongly suggest that most UK electrictians think that a single pole breaker would be ok since this is what the reg's teach them.

I'm familiar with home installations and understand that that there will be some differences with a 'van set up hence why I'm asking.

Even if I was getting a electrician to install it they should do so to my specification provided that what I'm asking for is safe as Ray said is the towsure item double poled? Does it come with an RCD?

 

[Chris_374530178]

The problem is that if you pull max Amps from the sockets and lightling then your pulling 22 amps which means that the cable isn't safe.

Untrue, the hook up cable is protected by devices upstream i.e. the caravan site's breakers in the connection post.

 

[xtrailman]

Manuel

This link will show you some options.

http://www.bcagroup.co.uk/products/consumer.shtml

 

[Manuel_374563143]

Ray,

I did come across this site a few days ago but didn't think that they dealt with consumers. I may give them a call and see who are thier end user suppliers are as this looks excatly what i want.

 

[xtrailman]

Manuel

This is what i fitted to my garage, you could still use this unit, but you need to remove the 6a cb, and replace it with another 16 amp cb, then get your electrician friend to supply the link bar to connect the two cb switches together.

also you will need to alter the internal wiring. Obviously this will only give you one 16 amp circuit.

Or if you dont like the cheap Volex, item 82637 is a square d unit.

http://www.toolstation.com/shop/Electrical/Circuit Protection/Volex Garage Kit IP65/d190/sd2615/p27838

 

[ProfJohnL]

Hello Manuel,

I apologise if I incorrectly assumed that you did not have the necessary skills and knowledge to fit electrical systems. Mty suspicions were raised by your apparent lack of knowledge about the current rating on the RCD, and the fact that you referred to Fuses, when such systems do not use fuses in the consumer unit.

I would be negligent if I continued to offer detailed fitting advice to a person who did not understand the important differences, and may have through ignorance or incompetence produced an unsafe and non-compliant system.

The kit I pointed to is specifically sold for use in caravans, and should contain the correct double pole and rated MCB's If it does not then it contravenes the trades descriptions and electrical equipment regulations. I presume that the company had made all the necessary checks in this matter.

I agree with you that I may have used the word "qualified" in error. Though to be come a qualified fitter one has to demonstrate a satisfactory level of competence. If you have found a qualified fitter has failed to perform to the codes of practice and safety laid down, you should report them to Trading Standards, their regulatory body (IEEE) and HSE.

Ray in his last posting refers to a garage system. As this is fitted a permanent UK supply the MCBs do not need to be double pole. Thus a garage kit is not suitable for caravans, But a caravan kit could be used in a garage, though the price hike for the specialist MCBs is likely to make it prohibitive.

As with any electrical or gas supply work, unless you are fully competent and conversant with e the regulations and testing, such work must be left to the professionals.

 

[xtrailman]

John L

If you read my post, i suggested modifying the garage unit, which is perfectly safe to use in a caravan, after being modified to take a double pole CB.

You do insist on preaching to people, and trying to overcomplicate was is a easy diy job, for a competent person.

And i know from personal experience, that i wouldn't trust some electricians to fit a 13 amp plug correctly.

 

[ProfJohnL]

Hello Ray,

I will continue to preach.