Caravan Weights - Advice Needed Please

[Adria542Chick]

Hi
I am not sure whether I have posted in the right forum, so please forgive me if I haven't.
I am just wondering how many of you load your caravan up to the exact amount of your user payload or do any of you go over this ???

The reason being, is that we have just had a motor mover fitted onto our caravan and it has used up alot of our user payload. When we first bought our caravan we had to have an alko stabiliser and spare wheel fited which added weight to our user payload. With the motor mover fitted, it now leaves us with 158 kg to play around with

We have always loaded our caravan correctly (eg. heavy items over the axle) and have always been within our user payload, usually a couple of kilos under. I have even gone to the extremes of weighing everything before it went into the caravan. I have always been very particular about the weight and safety etc, which is why this is causing us a headache.

However, we are now 7kg over and that doesn't take into account any clothes (we are a family of 5)
There will be no room for other items in the boot of the car as the space and weight there has already been accounted for. We are also taking the bare essentials, and cannot afford to leave anything behind.
Your thought on this would be much appreciated.
Thank You

 

[Damian]

The main figures you must NOT exceed are the MTPLM, the hitch limit which for Al-Ko is 100kg, the car towball limit which may be lower than the Al-Ko limit and the total outfit train weight.
For a VERY detailed explaation of how to arrive at the final figure see the topic MTPLM in Technical.

To be very accurate you should take the van to a weighbridge to find its actual weight, not the figure quoted in the literature

 

[forestgump]

If you have a adria you have a good pay load anyway what you have left is what most vans have at the start the alko hitch will not make a lot off diffrence as the old one is replaced .I have thought about a mover but the wieght is a issue but ive found that ive not needed one (famouse last words).

 

[Adria542Chick]

Thank You Damian
Our MTPLM is 1300 Kg, with a user payload of 215 kg.
The alko stabiliser, spare wheel and motor mover totals 57 kg
Leaving us with 158 kg for all the essentials and personal effects.

 

[dougie201]

Hi
Your MPTLM weight is the maximum weight your caravan can be by law. If you go over this weight you run the risk of making the van unstable and unsafe when towing, and if you are stopped by the police they can charge you for having a overloaded trailer, and make you unload the excess weight before you carry on with your journey. And please be aware they can stop and get your caravans weight checked at any time day or night.
Did you actually need to get the mover fitted? As my mover is the tow car!!!

Dougie.....

 

[Adria542Chick]

Thank you Forest Gump !!

Do you know for the past 2 years that we have had the van I have never thought that the original stabiliser was taken off and replaced with the alko so the weight should really has stayed the same ............. doh !!!!

As for the motor mover, you are right they do add alot of weight which we probably wouldn't have even considered before had it not been given to us supplied and fitted for free.

 

[Adria542Chick]

Hi Dougie
Thank you for taking the time to reply !!!
My Dad got stopped in his caravan last year and had it weighed by the police.
I would never do anything that would jeopardise either ourselves or anyones safety, that is why this is such a big worry.
We keep our caravan on a farm, and the pitch is a gravelled hardstanding on a slight slope so trying to get it in between 2 caravans on a pitch that seems like the size of a postage stamp the mover has been a god send. The motor mover was actually supplied and fitted as compensation to some very bad customer service that we received, but that is another very long story.

 

[forestgump]

Ive been lucky as we can push the van if all els fails i to have a adria but have a large pay load and dont fill it but it came wiyh new miro that includes habitational goods.Try to cut down on a gas bottle to a smaller back up light chairs no glass or all plastic melamine plates ect any thing that can be replaced with a lighter product is a good thing its amazing how much you can scrape off you load.Is it a new van and did the miro include the inhabitational goods or did you deduct this.

 

[Adria542Chick]

Hi Forest
Our caravan is 2 years old !!! I absolutely love it, what model have you got ???

I have got everything lightweight in the caravan, all the crockery is melamine and plastic.
I have just realised that I took into account the old gas bottles not the new lighweight 6 kg calor gas bottles. So I have gained 8 kg ...... woop woop !!!!! I am just wondering how much the spare wheel would weigh on its own, as ours isn't in a carrier. I have accounted 20 kg for this and the alko stabiliser but as you so rightly said the alko would have been just swapped over for the exisiting one

I have accounted 20 kg for all our bedding too (1 kingsize duvet, 3 sleeping bags for kids, 8 pillows and all the sheets and duvet covers, towels etc) I think I will try and weigh all these tomorrow.
Thank you for all your help it is much appreciated.

 

[Lutz]

The post raises a couple of comments:
1. Exceeding the permissible payload is breaking the law.
2. The unladen weight, or MIRO, of caravans (and, for that matter, most cars, too) is almost invariably higher than what one finds in brochures, databases, etc. It is therefore advisable to check the figures at hand. As the MTPLM is absolute, you may be in for a shock, how little payload you may be left with.
3. I suspect that in the majority of cases where payload is exceeded, this is done without giving the issue much thought. Those people that go to the trouble of weighing everything that goes on board are a lot less likely to exceed the limits.
4. Customer demand for ever more features and convenience items in caravans inevitably raises their unladen weight. On the other hand, caravan manufacturers will want to keep the MTPLM as low as reasonably possible to make the caravan more attractive to a wider market, especially with regard to the 85% weight ratio recommendation prevalent in the UK. The net result is a reduction in the available payload. In some cases, it doesn't meet average family needs any more. I would consider a payload of much less than 250kg for a family caravan to be unrealistic.
5. Fortunately, to get around the above problem, some caravan manufacturers offer uprated versions of some of their models, giving the customer the opportunity of taking advantage of a higher payload where this is a viable alternative (my own caravan, normally a 1600kg, was fitted ex-works with an optional 1800kg chassis). This should be considered at the time of placing the order for a new caravan as later technical changes to uprate the MTPLM can be very expensive depending on the extent of the work needed and can even involve axle changes, etc.

 

[Adria542Chick]

Thank you Lutz
I really value your opinion as an experienced caravanner. We would never exceed our MTPLM, so will just have to look at ways at re-juggling everything. Am I right in saying that in your user payload, you have to take into account your caravan battery. I have taken 25kg off of our payload for this. Overall, I have allocated 45kg to the spare wheel and battery.

 

[forestgump]

i have the adora 612dp if its 2 years old it may have the miro as (abc) this will take into consideration the spare wheel the loo the battery and a gas bottle ehu ect,so dont add these up twice The spare wheel 15 inch was put at 19 kgs when iasked the dealer as it travells in front locker but the long a frame and delta chasie tow great and still get the right nose wieght.

 

[Adria542Chick]

Ours is a 2009 model, and I think the new Miro's came into effect in 2010 so I still have to add battery, gas bottles etc to my user payload.

 

[forestgump]

is it the altea mine was stamped somthing like 1230 not exact but when i pucked it up i was told its 1330 again not exact so i was a bit shocked but then the good news was that i didnot have to deduct the for mentioned bits and bobs.(it was already done)

 

[Adria542Chick]

Ours is the Altea 542 DT, and the MTPLM is definitely 1300 kg, with a miro of 1085 kg which leaves 215 kg payload.
Thanks Forest

 

[forestgump]

theres only one thing you can do then (get rid off the kids )he he.

 

[Adria542Chick]

Well, I have now gained 4 kg so it is getting better

I think the next things to go will be the hoover and the saucepans, no cooking or cleaning !!!!!!
Thanks again for all your help

 

[forestgump]

a hoooooover?

 

[ProfJohnL]

Hi
Your MPTLM weight is the maximum weight your caravan can be by law. If you go over this weight you run the risk of making the van unstable and unsafe when towing, and if you are stopped by the police they can charge you for having a overloaded trailer, and make you unload the excess weight before you carry on with your journey. And please be aware they can stop and get your caravans weight checked at any time day or night.
Did you actually need to get the mover fitted? As my mover is the tow car!!!

Dougie.....

The only certanty is if you are overloaded you are illegal. There is no direct link between MTPLM and instability. It is quite possible to have an unstable caravan when it not even loaded anywher near its MTPLM, equally it is possible for some trailers to be grossly overloaded (and I'm not advocating it!) and yet they can be very stable.

 

[Robert_374373903]

This thread is what i often read as our Pegasus 462 and the Skoda Octavia with dsg are on paper quite a good match, however the nose weight is a big problem.Does Baily take their weight without the battery and all the other things they include when buying such as tv ,gas bottle, carpets?.Personally I take all this with a pinch of salt as weigh bridge is the only way to go.

 

[ProfJohnL]

Hello Robert,

Bailey along with all other manufacturers can only quote an ex-works nose load. That is the nose load as it leaves the factory without any of your items or the battery gas bottles etc in the caravan. The ex-works nose load has no real relevance to any caravanner, as it changes as you put your items in the caravan.

You adjust the nose load by positioning your items inside the caravan. Your nose load should be no less than 25Kg or 4% of the caravan gross weight, (EU regulations) and no more than lower of either the car or the caravans maximum allowance.

If you are having difficulties in getting the nose load within the above window of values, try moving heavier items around in side the caravan.

However safety you must always carry gas bottles and the battery in their designated spaces.
.

 

[Gafferbill]

Adria542Chic...............have you thought of the obvious solution!
A tow car with a bigger load carrying capacity .......providing funds allow.
Must be something to aim at, as there are five of you.

 

[TheTravellingRooster]

Hi
I am not sure whether I have posted in the right forum, so please forgive me if I haven't.
I am just wondering how many of you load your caravan up to the exact amount of your user payload or do any of you go over this ???

The reason being, is that we have just had a motor mover fitted onto our caravan and it has used up alot of our user payload. When we first bought our caravan we had to have an alko stabiliser and spare wheel fited which added weight to our user payload. With the motor mover fitted, it now leaves us with 158 kg to play around with

We have always loaded our caravan correctly (eg. heavy items over the axle) and have always been within our user payload, usually a couple of kilos under. I have even gone to the extremes of weighing everything before it went into the caravan. I have always been very particular about the weight and safety etc, which is why this is causing us a headache.

However, we are now 7kg over and that doesn't take into account any clothes (we are a family of 5)
There will be no room for other items in the boot of the car as the space and weight there has already been accounted for. We are also taking the bare essentials, and cannot afford to leave anything behind.
Your thought on this would be much appreciated.
Thank You

Hi, I have read through the posts and your replies but I don't see any mention of what tow-vehicle you have or what experience you have in years of towing/mileage covered or the frequency of your caravan jaunts.
As has already been pointed out, there are weight related No-No's that must be adhered to. They are never go over 100% of known (not published) Kerbweight). Never exceed the Maximum Braked Towing Weigh.Never exceed the MTPLM. Never exceed the maximum weight on the ball,the hitch-head weight may be higher,that does not count. Observe the maximum axle weights,ALL of THEM. Don't forget that the weight on your tow-ball is actually counted as in the car payload but it does not come off the vans. Which part of the country do you reside/store your caravan?. The most reliable way of knowing "what is what" is to find a Dynamic Axle Weighbridge,get your car and caravan weighed. Weigh the car as it came from the manufacturer but add a tank of fuel (or the equivalent weight) forget the 7kgs of luggage it is likely about 2kgs heavier than the difference between 90% full & full. Weigh the caravan as @ MiRO state. Now you know where you are going. Keep a written account of everything that is loaded into/onto both. Allow for your passengers/dog/cat/guinea pigs etc, then if in doubt as to the positioning of everything go back to the weighbridge.
A regular fee is around £6.00. per pass-over/across. It is an inexpensive reassurance and helps to keep you & yours safer.

 

[xtrailman]

Hi
I am not sure whether I have posted in the right forum, so please forgive me if I haven't.
I am just wondering how many of you load your caravan up to the exact amount of your user payload or do any of you go over this ???

The reason being, is that we have just had a motor mover fitted onto our caravan and it has used up alot of our user payload. When we first bought our caravan we had to have an alko stabiliser and spare wheel fited which added weight to our user payload. With the motor mover fitted, it now leaves us with 158 kg to play around with

We have always loaded our caravan correctly (eg. heavy items over the axle) and have always been within our user payload, usually a couple of kilos under. I have even gone to the extremes of weighing everything before it went into the caravan. I have always been very particular about the weight and safety etc, which is why this is causing us a headache.

However, we are now 7kg over and that doesn't take into account any clothes (we are a family of 5)
There will be no room for other items in the boot of the car as the space and weight there has already been accounted for. We are also taking the bare essentials, and cannot afford to leave anything behind.
Your thought on this would be much appreciated.
Thank You

Don't take any food, we recently weighed our fridge contents at around 7kg.
Or take a second car.

 

[Lutz]

Only 7kg? When we went to Norway some years ago, knowing beforehand how expensive food was up there, we had 150kg of food on board!