Covid 19 complacency.

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Parksy

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Nov 12, 2009
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Let’s face it Parksy, nobody speaks like you Black Country Boys. 😀
Mel
Even though we 'talk posh' when outside our boundaries Mel? 😀
When I was hospitalised in 2001 after the stroke which partially immobilised me for a time the physiotherapist came to see me and I made her laugh when she asked "Do you need speech therapy?"
"Me and about 30,000 of my mates in Tipton" wasn't the answer she was looking for 😁
 
Mar 14, 2005
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Mind you, every Black Country Town almost has its own unique language, you need a translator if you venture further than a mile from your home!
 
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PTA

Mar 5, 2020
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My Father in Law fought in Burma alongside Australians. He told us how amazed the Aussies were that Brits who lived within a few miles of each other had completely different accents and dialects. In Australia, they said, you could travel a thousand miles and people would have exactly the same accent.
 
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Sep 26, 2018
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I was born 2 miles from Lands End, and in my early years it was very easy to detect three distinct accents in the area west of the St Ives-Penzance line...
 
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Jul 18, 2017
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Events in London are connected with civil disobedience coupled with poor policing.
It strikes me as odd that police and local authorities declare an emergency and vow to clear the area because irresponsible idiots crowd breaches, but they are happy to stand idly by and watch when statues are destroyed and national war memorials are vandalised.
Covid 19 notwithstanding, I think that we may be looking forward to a summer of discontent amongst some elements of society.
Well said Parksy but what can the policeman in the street do when he is instrcute dby his boss to kneel and to ignore civil disorder. The police have their hands tied behind their backs and the population are aware of this so choose to ignore the police who seem to have lost all respect!
 
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PTA

Mar 5, 2020
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I don't think any policeman has been told to kneel by his boss and "ignore civil disorder." Sounds like a Daily Mail headline!
 

Parksy

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The old local accents and dialects are becoming less pronounced now with TV and radio programmes introducing new words and speech patterns to young viewers who tend to copy them.
The ones that I find most irritating are the inner city cod London accents when young people use words like 'bruvvaar' and 'sistaaar' and they can't sound the letter T.
Posh little rich girl and Millenial singer Lilly Allen made a career out of it, her speech patterns and singing are straight off a Sarf London sink estate but she was privately educated with relatively wealthy parents.
My maternal grandmother lived about 3 miles from us and her Black Country dialect was peppered with old sayings and words, many derived from Middle English.
Chaucer may have been able to understand her as would someone born at the same time as Shakespeare but 21st century ears would have had to listen very carefully to understand what she would be saying.
 
Nov 11, 2009
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The old local accents and dialects are becoming less pronounced now with TV and radio programmes introducing new words and speech patterns to young viewers who tend to copy them.
The ones that I find most irritating are the inner city cod London accents when young people use words like 'bruvvaar' and 'sistaaar' and they can't sound the letter T.
Posh little rich girl and Millenial singer Lilly Allen made a career out of it, her speech patterns and singing are straight off a Sarf London sink estate but she was privately educated with relatively wealthy parents.
My maternal grandmother lived about 3 miles from us and her Black Country dialect was peppered with old sayings and words, many derived from Middle English.
Chaucer may have been able to understand her as would someone born at the same time as Shakespeare but 21st century ears would have had to listen very carefully to understand what she would be saying.
I blame thirty five years of Eastenders.
 
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Jul 18, 2017
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I don't think any policeman has been told to kneel by his boss and "ignore civil disorder." Sounds like a Daily Mail headline!
If they are doing it of their own accord then they should not be policemen or policewomen! The police are supposed to be impartial and not take sides!
 
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Parksy

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Well said Parksy but what can the policeman in the stree do when he is instrcute dby his boss to kneel and to ignore civil disorder. The police have their hands tied behind their backs and the population are aware of this so choose to ignore the police who seem to have lost all respect!
Agreed!
The police chiefs are definitely to blame.
Metropolitan police were ordered to make a tactical withdrawal during the recent Brixton rioting according to an anonymous police constable on social media.
The rank and file wanted to get kitted up to go back in after several of their comrades had been injured, but they were ordered to keep away by the higher echelons.
This is what happens when promotion is governed by box tick quota rather than by ability and leadership qualities.
 
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Parksy

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I don't think any policeman has been told to kneel by his boss and "ignore civil disorder." Sounds like a Daily Mail headline!
As opposed to a Guardian headline? 🤣
The police didn't ignore civil disorder, they simply failed abysmally to effectively deal with it.
 
Jul 18, 2017
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As opposed to a Guardian headline? 🤣
The police didn't ignore civil disorder, they simply failed abysmally to effectively deal with it.
Just to add another two cents. A good friend has a son in law serving in the metropolitan police in London and they were not happy about orders, but orders is orders. Apparently a large number of them are now considering resigning as they feel they cannot do their job properly due to PC governing their actions.
 

PTA

Mar 5, 2020
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Bending the knee was a gesture to show police do not support racism. That seems fine to me. Tactical withdrawal was a way of avoiding making the situation worse. Sometimes policing has to be a fine balance. Can you imagine what would have happened, given the current volatility around the race issue, if our police had gone in all guns blazing (metaphorically speaking!)?
Perhaps it's also the result of thugs, yobbo and low life (of all races) getting away with it for years due to chronic police force underfunding and understaffing? Not being political- that has happened under governments of all shades.
( I most assuredly do not read The Guardian!).
 
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Jul 18, 2017
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Bending the knee was a gesture to show police do not support racism. That seems fine to me. Tactical withdrawal was a way of avoiding making the situation worse. Sometimes policing has to be a fine balance. Can you imagine what would have happened, given the current volatility around the race issue, if our police had gone in all guns blazing (metaphorically speaking!)?
Perhaps it's also the result of thugs, yobbo and low life (of all races) getting away with it for years due to chronic police force underfunding and understaffing? Not being political- that has happened under governments of all shades.
I am sorry, but the police were supporting racism as surely "ALL lives matter" and not just Black lives? However a caravan forum is not the place to discuss these matters. I was was supporting Parksys comment which I thought was very valid. I am tired of a minority imposing their will on the majority. :)
 

PTA

Mar 5, 2020
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I don't really follow your point tbh.
However, it's stopped raining outside and I'm off to check the caravan.
 

Parksy

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Nov 12, 2009
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Bending the knee was a gesture to show police do not support racism. That seems fine to me. Tactical withdrawal was a way of avoiding making the situation worse. Sometimes policing has to be a fine balance. Can you imagine what would have happened, given the current volatility around the race issue, if our police had gone in all guns blazing (metaphorically speaking!)?
Perhaps it's also the result of thugs, yobbo and low life (of all races) getting away with it for years due to chronic police force underfunding and understaffing? Not being political- that has happened under governments of all shades.
( I most assuredly do not read The Guardian!).
No sane person 'supports racism'.
The 'taking the knee' is an overtly political act but gesture politics have no place with police who'se remit is to uphold the law without fear or favour.
Low life thugs have been getting away with it for ages, due to soft sentencing by magistrates and low key policing policies instigated by inept leadership.
Anyway, I'm off into the garden before it rains again, those roses won't deadhead themselves.
 
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PTA

Mar 5, 2020
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Sadly, in my professional life I experienced plenty of seemingly sane people who were overtly racist. For example the group on an estate who, on a regular basis, posted dog dirt through the letterbox of a black doctor's family, a school I inspected where some infants would not hold the hands of black pupils because their parents had told them not to. I was also, marginally involved in dealing with the aftermath in a school where a traveller youth had been murdered by a set of pupils.
One of my friends has a black daughter in law and she can certainly vouch for the continuing existence of racism.sadly.
Hence my strong feelings about racism and, sometimes, the need for "gesture politics."
Anyway, I post this by way of explanation and will say no more. I will take a leaf out of your book and get into the garden.
 
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Nov 11, 2009
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Here’s an interesting chart showing why Wack a Mole will not work. My brother who lives in Leicester told me three weeks ago that Covid infections were on the increase in the north Evington area. He'd lived in that area and so had a number of friends who still live there. Plus local social media was buzzing. But the local authority were saying that the infection rate was low and staying stable. But they were working on Pillar 1 data and HMG were not releasing Pillar 2 data which showed a sharp increase in infections.

One has to ask why on earth the totality of data isn’t made available to those on the ground who locally will have to manage the outbreak. Only today PHE signed an agreement to allow the flow of data to go to Local Authorities. Knowing that localised outbreaks would need the “wack a mole” treatment I find it incredible that no one had the nouse to think that data would need to be shared with Local Authorities.


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Jan 3, 2012
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Also just looking at the news tonight data reveals coronavirus hotspots Bradford , Barnsley , and Rochdale have alot of cases
Also (clive i hope your brother stays safe )
 
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PTA

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It all really emphasises, again, the need to avoid complacency and the belief that vigilance can be relaxed.
I'm not convinced that the UK's systems, as opposed to those having to deal directly with Covid 19, have covered themselves with glory - as further indicated by otherclive's post.
 
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Mar 14, 2005
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We criticise China becasue we believe they have not shared the whole data set, and now it seems our own government can be tarred with the same brush.

I continue to advocate that we are still in a situation where no one really knows all the necessary facts about C19, so there is no fool proof road map to tell how to deal with it.

However we do know a bit more about the virus, in particular its life cycle, and when hosts are infectious. This is why lock-down's were successful in bringing infection rates down. but that is far from the whole story.

We still don't know exactly where and how the outbreak started. The recent rise in infections in Germany seem to point to a meat processing plant, much like the suspicions of the wet markets in Wuhan, but its still not conclusive, becasue its not yet known if the German source was the meat they were processing, of it the infection was brought in by an employee.

If it was imported in the meat, then that is a very worrying, as it suggests C19 may have jumped to a wider range of food stock animals than was first thought, and of course it might start to reappear at other food processing plants. It also raises the question of how long the virus will survive in infected products. Could chilling of freezing extend its life cycle?

The success of the lock down does point to the methods of transmission being close contact with infected people, and pick up form surfaces, so continuing social distancing, and personal hygiene will be necessary, and that is going to be a huge ongoing task.

Consider:-
The UK has a population of approx. 66.7M people. So far Government figures suggest about 320,000 UK residents have been infected with C19, Infection disease experts suggest the figure could actually be as high as 800000. That still leaves about 65.9M potential victims just in the UK.

I totally agree we do need to begin to reduce the lock-down measures, not just to restart the economy, but to reduce the hardship (financial and social) it has been inflicting. However I'm sure we can each think of alternative ways and areas that might be released first.

In all of this there has to be a realistic expectation, If the infections start to rise quickly, then it the area and or activity that is fuelling the infection rate will need to be curtailed to bring the infection rate down.

With the social distancing measures in place, the risk of becoming infected is somewhat reduced, but it still leaves the majority of the population at risk of being infected. That risk will not be reduced until there is an effective vaccine, or medications that render the effects of the virus far less severe.

And all the work to reduce infections will wasted when irresponsible people ignore and put themselves and others at risk. The sun and sand seekers were a classic example the other weekend, as were the other mass gatherings were social distancing was not followed - mainly by the criminals who decided to go for a punch up, and looting.
 
Jun 20, 2005
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Very true Prof. This Saturday the pubs will reopen allegedly with self distancing in place. Realistically many will have a few drinks and drop their guard. I am convinced we are heading for massive secondaries in the autumn. The caravan sites open this weekend and are mostly full. So how is it all the showers can be used at the same time yet the swimming baths and gyms remain shut because they say use of the showers is too risky?
 
Jul 18, 2017
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Very true Prof. This Saturday the pubs will reopen allegedly with self distancing in place. Realistically many will have a few drinks and drop their guard. I am convinced we are heading for massive secondaries in the autumn. The caravan sites open this weekend and are mostly full. So how is it all the showers can be used at the same time yet the swimming baths and gyms remain shut because they say use of the showers is too risky?
One of the reasons we will not be visiting any pub while away. Even if you are sitting in the garden how do you know whether the person bringing the food to the table is not a carrier, or the person pouring the drinks, etc. I would have thought that opening swimming baths would have been okay as the chlorine in the water should kill off any virus?
 

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