discovery series 2

[gforce]

We have a disco 2 on a 53 plate. It tows really well - we hardly know anything is on the back, although have noticed it does tend to bounce slightly. I have read that this is ? due to the independant suspension, however, this is not our problem.

I have read around and there are people who love the disco and there seem to be even more who think it is highly unsafe as a tow vehicle. I know there are always going to be those who dislike the vehicle in general, but has anyone any genuine views on it's instability?

Recently had an accident (although in no way was blame apportioned to the car) and yes, am slightly paranoid, but would really appreciate your comments, one way or another.

 

[rob_jax]

Hi,

Your vehicle has a relatively high centre of gravity, good axle articulation (for off-road use) with more suspension movement than a road car, and probably tyres with quite a tall aspect ratio.

If the caravan starts fishtailing, it will try to push the rear of the car around - until either you recover or a jack-knife happens. Improving the lateral (side to side) stiffness of the rear of your car can only help.

You can improve the lateral stiffness of the tyres when towing by either increasing the tyre pressure (see handbook) and / or fitting lower profile / wider / more road orientated tyres.

The axle articulation (off-road performance) means that there is quite a lot of compliance in the suspension - as you say it can be bouncy - might be a good idea to just have a professional check over the suspension, bushes, and springs - seek advice from the owners clubs and see, for example, if different bushes can be fitted (usually changing to PU or synthetic materials) or improved springs - whatever that will tune the suspension to road / towing.

Not much you can do about the higher CoG except learn to read the road, and exercise care when changing direction.

Robert

 

[mcghee]

I have a Hobby 635, fairly large and fairly heavy, which I tow with a Jeep Grand Cherokee.

This is extremely stable, even being in the middle lane of the M6 at 70mph with an artic to my left and large Transit to my right doesn't upset it.

From this I know that the caravan is stable.

Last summer I had occasion to tow my 'van to Hull using a Discovery and can honestly say it's the most frightening trip I've ever made with any outfit. Strangely the caravan did not waver, but the Discovery tended to veer all over the road. For most of the journey I was unable to exceed 45-50mph, which I do not consider acceptable.

My main concern was how would the Discovery behave in an unexpected situation?

I do know that the later Discoverys are better in this respect, or at least they don't exhibit the same bad manners until a higher speed.

I've also been told on good authority that the self levelling suspension and active corner system can actually exaggerate a snake to the point of no recovery very quickly. I raised this point a while back and was shot down in flames but as far as I'm aware the legal battle regarding one particular case is still ongoing.

I don't think the Discovery is a bad car, but of all the vehicles I've towed with, the Discovery is the one which I would avoid.

 

[sparkes]

I have come across the air units causing problems if the incorrect tow bar is fitted. But have never come across any complaints that the ACE unit can cause towing problems. Can you point out where this info comes from?

As a note, I have the later D2 with ACE and coil springs. I use MAD airbags in the springs and set these to the correct pressure as well as the tyres. The unit is stable at all speeds and I have not problems with passing lorries or being passed by high sided vans at speed. On the very few occastions the van has become unstable, this has corrected itself before I can even react.

For reference, our van is a 1800KG twin axle

 

[RiaandJames_374303418]

As a young married couple we ignored the rumour mongers and bought a sparkly new MG for Ria and spent 18 months out of pocket fighting the dealer and manufacturer.

My employer is probably Land Rovers biggest customer and that means that I can keep servicing costs to a minimum and I can also buy at a good price.

Twice we have had a "good" buy and ignored the rumours, twice we have paid heavily for that choice.

Works and personal experience have raised concerns over the stability and relaibilty of the car, also when towing at times the afore mentioned experience of stable towed unit and wandering car is one we are very familiar with both with caravans and boat trailers and at work other trailers.

A glider trailer towed by a D2 is another experience that most tuggers would not relish. Fine behind a large estate car but a nightmare with a Disco.

All our choices are personal, but good reports should also be balanced against the many bad Disco experiences.

Our current SUV tug has shown no such issues as those experienced by us and others we know who use Disco's and that's in straight out of the box condition.

The only tow cars we have felt needed add ons to aid towing ability have been our two Disco's and I note Steve has added after market air bags to a car with active suspension.

James

 

[sparkes]

James

You are correct we have added MAD air bags to the coil springs.

We chose a coil sprung Disco because we wanted to avoid a 7 seater and wanted to use the disco off road without air problems.

The only stability problems I have seen are based on incorrect towbar on air systems.

The air bags are to level the car after loading the bikes, luggague and caravan. The van is 100kg on the bar then we add 4 bikes etc.

The active suspension is not affected by this (spoke to LR and the manufacturers before fitting) as the ACE senses the lean on the car and corrects it.

We have towed many (about 10,000)miles with this and have not had any stability issues. The bar is set so the van is level or slightly nose down and I am so use to packing the van now I rarly check nose weight any more. (unless I change the van or are doing a very long tow)

I suggest that people with instability issues first check they have an adjustable tow bar and that the tyre are inflated as per the user manual

 

[Lutz]

So long as the noseweight is set with the coupling at the same height as when the caravan is hitched up to the car, stability is not affected whether the caravan is pointing down, level, or pointing up. Poiting up only has the disadvantage of reducing ground clearance at the back. This could be important if you have to negotiate speed bumps, for example.

 

[RiaandJames_374303418]

Steve.

If you have a reliable Disco no doubt you are a happy customer as it's a superb and very capable vehicle, from my knowledge base I believe that your cars active suspension is a manufacturer remedy rather than a luxury refinement.

ie - It is there to help solve known problems that existed for far to long.

Our old TDI adopted a tail down nose up attitude when the caravan was hitched and towing was not a relaxed or safe experience despite being within all the correct guide lines.

Three times on visits home we had reliability issues, once with the TDI and twice with the TD2.

Despite the first visit being years apart from the next two, after stamping my feet and acting out a hissy fit to get some dealer action I've ended up on the workshop floor of the dealers each time and also went out on test drives to assess the problems and check out the remedial work with the service engineers.

Those three experiences showed that Disco's are far from being reliable and perfect on each separate occasion.

I believe that the common complaints about LR dealers is down to poor reliability for far to may of the cars, the engineers have not known where they should turn as for years they have faced a mountain of problems.

That said we have known of the same experiences for LR engineers in Germany, France and Italy as well as in our works MT sections.

If you want a family car that fully seated will tow a large trailer and boat with people and equipment through mud and water and through sand dunes on to a beach the Disco is your car and probably will not be beaten. But it also has to be reliable enough to get to the beach to perfom ;o) We arrived two days after the rest of the group we left with and arrived home in Germany in a loan car thirty six hours after leaving at the same time as the rest of our friends and that was after all the numerous problems had been resolved on our TD2!

James.

 

[sparkes]

I can only say as I see

5 yr old facelift discovery

90,000 miles

total non service items replaced. Brakes and a

 

[RiaandJames_374303418]

Is that not where we should be on this site.

You Steve seem to have found a good reliable Disco sadly we found two that were not.

That is our personal experience without a vast list of other problems we know of.

I'm pleased to find annother Disco owner with a good experience and I do know others.

Take three Disco's owned between us, 1/3 (yours) was fit for purpose and two thirds (ours) were c--d.

I can then add in my works experience of the cars, they have constant attention amd servicing and maintenance far beyond that of normal ownership and still do not have a good reliability record.

So buyer beware.

Get a good one and hold on to it. If you get trouble, get on the dealers and manufacturer case straight away. But be aware that there are good Disco's like Steve's and on the other end of the Disco spectrum others that are far from perfect as well as the in between models.

James

 

[sparkes]

James.

The d2's you have experience of. Where they face lift models or pre? It could be that the facelift has less issues

 

[parker1158]

I must say I find this whole towcar thing frustrating. I am in the throws at the moment of changing my trusty CR-V for a heavier duty vehicle. It's a great tow vehicle for the van but for the other purpose I use it for which is pulling a box trailer, often over fields and down unmade tracks, it is at the limit of its capabilities.

I fancied an Isuzu 3.0 TD but have just been made aware of major engine failures. The Disco's seem to have their fair share of problems and anyway I am not that taken by them (although my wife likes them). I am looking this weekend at Jeeps but already folk are sucking in air and tut-tuting. Even when trying to part-ex the CR-V dealers are doing what dealers do and saying they are not well liked and have reliability problems etc etc.

So what is the secret to choosing the right vehicle? picking what you like and to hell with others opinion and keep your fingers crossed I guess!

 

[sparkes]

what ever you choose Martyn. do a search for a shocklink for the tow bar. this is an add on that is used for towing heavy trailers off road

 

[parker1158]

what ever you choose Martyn. do a search for a shocklink for the tow bar. this is an add on that is used for towing heavy trailers off road

Thanks for the info Steve. The trailer is only 600 Kg unloaded with a possible load of 1,000 although I don't exceed a total of 1,000 do I still need one?

The farmer who keeps the land around where I live mentioned these but I must admit I had never heard of them. Do they affect the towing characteristics when lugging a van?

 

[sparkes]

Thanks for the info Steve. The trailer is only 600 Kg unloaded with a possible load of 1,000 although I don't exceed a total of 1,000 do I still need one?

The farmer who keeps the land around where I live mentioned these but I must admit I had never heard of them. Do they affect the towing characteristics when lugging a van?

not used one myself but know of a few who do. The ones I have seen fix onto a removeable bracket that can be replaced with a std bracket. This means they get removed for normal towing. However, I don't think they have to be removed and do not affect normal towing.

They remove the shock load of the vehicle/trailer joint.

 

[mcghee]

Hi Steve. I'm aware that you tow a fairly large 'van with a Discovery and are very pleased with it. But you yourself say that you have added non-standard parts to your vehicle to reach that stage.

I'm also aware, as I've said already, that the later models are better, but in my experience, not perfect.

The problem is not all Discovery owners will make the modifications you have made for safety's sake.

I can't give any information regarding the legal case I know of, as soon as it reaches a conclusion I will give you all the details, if Landrover don't do it first.

 

[sparkes]

at no point did I state that I modified my Disco for saftey. And the MAD suspension aid is for comfort only. The car is more than capable of providing a safe tow without the aids I have added

 

[sparkes]

Mcghee

Where did the legal bit come from?

You stated that you have it on good authority that Air and ACE are bad. then you state you cannot give details because of legal issues of a case?

If that is correct then it is a single car out of the many thousands that have been sold. I cannot call that good authority.

As I have already said. I have come across no indication that ACE has ever caused issues in towing. I have been on many LR foums and searched with google and cannot see an instance where ACE has contributed or even thought to have contributed to an accident. Can you enlighten me? or is this just a single instance you cannot talk about.

 

[MichaelofKent]

I own a Discovery 2 and love it to bits. However, as a tow car (for my particular setup) it is very very dangerous. And it because of that I have bought a new Jeep Commander for towing.

Now before I get flamed, you guys have to stop talking absolutes. There are so many variables regarding a car and caravan combination that although one can say "yes it's a great tow car and I don't even know the caravan is there" that only applies to one's setup and one's experience.

Maybe, if one is to recommend or give an opinion on a particular towcar they should give a brief description of their setup. I'll start with the D2 setup(which is the same as the Jeep Commander):

Discovery 2 ES with ACE , air suspension, gas converted and done 85k miles)

Dixon tow bar with adjustable hitch

2 x Adults

5 x Children

New single axle 7.18m length 6 berth caravan weighing 1400kg (max 1500kg)

95-100kg noseweight

Everything loaded as per specs of caravan and CC club guidelines

The exact same setup with the Commander tows perfectly.

 

[MONKEY1]

As a fleet manager I have noticed that the LR Discovery owners often run a their vehicles lower end of the Psi scale. Often if we approve new tyres on a lease car and it has done low mileage ie 15000 miles then we will ask the customer as to their particular driving style often a comment is that the car rides better at a low psi.

What I can't tell from the data is do they have a towbar fitted as often they are paid for by the customer and don't come as part of the lease package.

Ford Ranger customers do the opposite and use max's psi as it cuts down on road noise !

Monkeys Husband

 

[mcghee]

Hello again Steve,

I have spoken at length with my friend who is involved with the case of which I speak.

So far Landrover have said that the 75kgs noseweight on the vehicle was too low, the 'van in question was about 1400kgs. I'd say there probably hundreds of 'vanners towing 1400kilo 'vans with 75kilos on the nose, are they all doing so dangerously?

They claim to have fully investigated the vehicle and are satisfied it was not the cause of the accident. Yet they have recommended that certain suspension components be uprated to improve roadholding. Draw your own conlusion.

I apologose for implying your vehicle required suspension mods on safety grounds.

I will keep you popsted as to the final outcome.

 

[mcghee]

Also, in the same case, AlKo have said that any 'van using their hitch stabilisers should be towed either level or nose down, never nose up as the friction pads will not seat properly.

I don't know why this should be,

but could this be the cause of the problem, since a lot of Discoverys I see tow 'vans nose up?

 

[mcghee]

Hello again Steve,

I have spoken at length with my friend who is involved with the case of which I speak.

So far Landrover have said that the 75kgs noseweight on the vehicle was too low, the 'van in question was about 1400kgs. I'd say there probably hundreds of 'vanners towing 1400kilo 'vans with 75kilos on the nose, are they all doing so dangerously?

They claim to have fully investigated the vehicle and are satisfied it was not the cause of the accident. Yet they have recommended that certain suspension components be uprated to improve roadholding. Draw your own conlusion.

I apologose for implying your vehicle required suspension mods on safety grounds.

I will keep you popsted as to the final outcome.

I do of course mean keep you posted, since keeping you popsted sounds rather uncomfortable.

 

[sparkes]

interesting

If the van was nose up then the chances are that the towbar (if adjustable) was set too high

As for the recommendation of uprating suspension. maybe its as simple as a suggestion to improve rodeholding.

If they investigated then they will have done it so they could defend in a court. It would be too much of a risk for any manufacturer to do otherwise.

I have to admit I am supprised in the negative towing of a disco. Mine is rock solid even at high speed. The only time I ever feel lateral movement is when a high sided van passes at speed close to the van. But it straightens up almost immediatly.

I don't think that I am just lucky. There must be 10's of thousands of disco that are towing. Maybe thats why we see more complaints on this forum. mearly a matter of numbers.

I hope your friend finds the reason for the accident. Its not nice wondering what could have caused it and if it will happen again