do i need a 4x4 to tow a baileys pagent mozelle

[stan_5124568]

please can any one help me im thinking about buying a new caravan and i like the pagent, but im unsure what car i need to pull this large caravan.at this moment i drive a vw passet 1.8 20v turbo

but i may change it shortly i would like a newer vw passet estate

(52) or(53) plate but im unsure weather this would pull it or do i

have to buy a 4x4 please help a new caravaner many thanks stan

 

[PC_5119929]

NO

 

[BrianStAlbans]

NO, but get one anyway. ;O)

 

[Merve_5103671]

Hi Stan,

Passats- Fantastic cars but have you ever thought of a Touareg? Pull anything! If you go to www.whattowcar.com and put your details in of both your car and caravan you may find it helpful- Good luck.

 

[Andrew_5124618]

I tow with a discovery 2 V8 on LPG pulls like a train and is as solid as a rock with the van on the back wouldn't use anything else

 

[DavidW1]

Stan,

By modern standards the Bailey Pagent range is not large or heavey - the heaviest tips the scales at 1400kg mtplm.

If you want to keep to the 85% rule you need a towcar with a kerbweight of around 1650kg - there are plenty of family type vehicles at that wieght, I would guess the Passat Estate is not far away from that figure.

If you are new to this forum - be warned you may have opened a can of worms! If you are a regular reader then this is all rather unsubtle.

 

[DavidW1]

Sorry Stan - just saw that you are asking about the Mosselle. Well that is 1323Kg mtplm so reducing the towcar kerbwieght down to about 1550kg.

That covers a great many family vehcles on the market - my advice go for rear or 4wd and that puts you into BMW, Merc, Subaru or Suzuki Vitara , Nissan X Trail and Honda CR territory.

 

[PC_5119929]

According to www.whattowcar.com many of the newer Passats will to the van well and it will also come in under 85% .

 

[Steve L]

Hi Stan.

Passat's are very well built and well capable of towing your van. The 85% is NOT A RULE but a mythical guide to supose'd safe towing.

Paying attention to the finer points of loading the outfit has more affect. Get the weight over the axle area and a 75Kg nose weight and you've more or less cracked it.

The 130BHP diesel will offer plenty of pulling power and a good economy too. They are not too noisey and I saw several both in Passat and Bora format on our campsite over the last few days so they are a popular choice.

You'll struggle to find many options with rear wheel drive and these days with the finely tuned suspension you realy don't get much wheel spin.

I tow with a Laguna estate 2Ltr and find this to be a good tow car for what I need and being front wheel drive is no handicap even on our last site where the exit was up a 1-6 loose stone track with a 90 degree turn at the top to stop you taking a run at it.

If you want 4 wheel drive, you might look at the Octavia estate, but just check out the tow capacity as this might be close to the manufacturer's limit. I tow at maximum manufacturer's limit with my Laguna and sure you have to be slick with gear changing to keep max momentum up hill, but then that applies to most cars. I don't feel that the car is pressed to it's limit and can cruise all day at the towing speed limits.

Take your time and choose what suits all your daily need's, don't feel pressured to go for a large vehicle that may well cost more to run on the 80%of the time it's solo and cost a packet at the garage. I know of a few people who have had very expensive experiences with Disco's and have reverted to Subaru Forresters for towing so they might be worth a look. But thye can get pricey to repair.

Steve.

 

[ProfJohnL]

Stan,

By modern standards the Bailey Pagent range is not large or heavey - the heaviest tips the scales at 1400kg mtplm.

If you want to keep to the 85% rule you need a towcar with a kerbweight of around 1650kg - there are plenty of family type vehicles at that wieght, I would guess the Passat Estate is not far away from that figure.

If you are new to this forum - be warned you may have opened a can of worms! If you are a regular reader then this is all rather unsubtle.

David.

85% is guide not a rule.

 

[DavidW1]

Aggree with everything you say Steve - which is unusual for me! - except your remarks about 85%

Stan says he is new to vanning and I suggest that he would be well advised to keep to an 85% ratio - as well as all the other good things you suggest.

We know you have been towing for 40 years with alls sorts including an Austin Champ and probably pedal bikes too but Stan hasn't

 

[RickyLionheart]

I would also go along with what Steve says, a large saloon car would be more preferable to a 4x4 given the extra fuel consumption and all the other problems associated with the "Chelsea tractors"

 

[DavidW1]

David.

85% is guide not a rule.

A pedantic comment I think - subsitute recommendation if it upsets you but it's longer to write and harder to spell!

 

[Ian_5040589]

I've been towing a Moselle with a Passat for the last couple of years Stan and have yet to realise its on the back!

I've got the 1.9 TDI 4 Motion which sort of is a 4x4! If you can find a 4M they're worth getting as they're more sure footed and benefit from a heavier kerbweight.

 

[Andrew_5124618]

I would also go along with what Steve says, a large saloon car would be more preferable to a 4x4 given the extra fuel consumption and all the other problems associated with the "Chelsea tractors"

as regards the chelsee tractor comments did you know that a v8 4 litre auto landrover discovery running in lpg is cheeper to run in all ways than a vw passat.

There's nothing wrong with the passat but why have a car that will do the job when you can have one that's built for the job

My chelsee tractor as some people call it has been very handy in the past for helping people off of muddy feilds

but hey each to there own at the end of the day it's all about what you feel comfortable towing with

 

[Andrew_5124618]

as regards the chelsee tractor comments did you know that a v8 4 litre auto landrover discovery running in lpg is cheeper to run in all ways than a vw passat.

There's nothing wrong with the passat but why have a car that will do the job when you can have one that's built for the job

My chelsee tractor as some people call it has been very handy in the past for helping people off of muddy feilds

but hey each to there own at the end of the day it's all about what you feel comfortable towing with

and to add to the above they cost about the same to buy

 

[chelsea1]

and to add to the above they cost about the same to buy

i live in devon with my freelander...so does that mean its not a chelsea tractor?! cos i live in the country and drive on muddy roads with grass growing up the middle and really high hedges?!!

ps - my freelander tows like a dream, wouldnt know you had my senator on the back

 

[stan_5124568]

I've been towing a Moselle with a Passat for the last couple of years Stan and have yet to realise its on the back!

I've got the 1.9 TDI 4 Motion which sort of is a 4x4! If you can find a 4M they're worth getting as they're more sure footed and benefit from a heavier kerbweight.

Thanks to everybody that has replyed to my message it has been a great help too me. i now can continue too look for my new car and caravan,by the way i think i will be buying a newer passat and the

pagaent many thanks to all*******

stan

 

[chelsea1]

I would also go along with what Steve says, a large saloon car would be more preferable to a 4x4 given the extra fuel consumption and all the other problems associated with the "Chelsea tractors"

example -

if you have a discovery 4.0 litre pulling a caravan and a 2.0 litre mondeo pulling a caravan - surely the fuel consumption on the 4x4 would be better as this car would be like it wasnt pulling anything as it is built for the job.

our freelander tows like it hasnt got anything on the back and we get 35mpg, which is the same as if we werent towing and driving at 60mph.

 

[Stephen_5077753]

I would also go along with what Steve says, a large saloon car would be more preferable to a 4x4 given the extra fuel consumption and all the other problems associated with the "Chelsea tractors"

The only problem associated with "chelsea tractors" is narrow mindedness by people like yourself who would insist on thinking that any car that has drive to all 4 wheels is a chelsea tractor and is just a fashion accesory.

As more sensible people know this isnt the case. The smaller 4x4's (x-trail,crv, sorento etc) are smaller (width and length) then many large family saloons (especially as people go for estates to increas the kerbweight). They are also, often put to a good use off road for peoples work or recreation.

Granted, many folk in towns/cities buy them to ship their little ones to school and no more and that is pure stupidity, but driving any child less than a mile to school in ANY car is plain stupidity, its quicker to walk!!

Point is, not all 4x4's are chelsea tractors.

Steve

 

[Steve L]

Oh dear, you've stirred the "chelsea" hornets nest there Ricky.

I can't put my finger on it ( well not here anyway or else it won't get printed!!)but there only seems to be one particular "class" of vehicle that has attracted the "rapid responce defence team" leap of faith.

Everyone has different perceptions of what is good or bad about anything and as ive said in the past "you can call me what you like, but never call me late for breakfast". I've had our 4 wheel chums and as my mum would say there's a place for everything and everything has it's place.

So I too find it strange that there seems to be plenty of the "tractors" parked outside the local school, and they always gleam with plenty of bling!!

For the moment you'll get away with running a 4 Litre V8 on gas and it may well beas cheap as a Passat on oil (diesel), but just wait until Gordon Brown has found a way to tax gas the same as petrol and you'll have the last laugh again!!

Even last night Clarkson tested the golf R32 against the BMW 130i and found that the golf was 4K cheaper and just as quick and further more, you could get 4 adults in it and not 2 stick insects in the back like the beemer. But of coarse the beemer has B for bling on it!!

Go with facts and information and a look at the running cost's and then you'll make the right choice. Often trying to be in the bling only cost's more for the same outcome.

 

[RickyLionheart]

I am purely answering the question at the top of the page, or rather giving my opinion, which is as I see it given the choice of a Chealsea tractor or a saloon car for towing I would recommend the saloon car, why lug around something that does 20-30 MPG 365 days a year for the odd occasion that you get stuck on the grass on a campsite?

 

[clivea]

Hi,

you don't need to go up to your van's max weight but I do find that with the normal things such as battery, gas, water etc and clothes, fridge contents you are not far off. Howver if you do have a car witha good carrying capacity then you can load up the car and keep the van beneath its max. this way although not strictly meeting the 85% rule the principle is being followed. Having towed with Mondeos and SAABs at 85% my current outfit of Sorento and Bordeaux is around 64% and I know which I prefer on the long hauls.

Have you considered the Santa Fe (old model), Tuscon or Sprtage. All would be heavier than most mid range estates and give reasonable mpg.

 

[dsmiles]

Try a BMW 530d touring. Loads of grunt and pulls my Senator Indiana as if it's not there. 26ish mpg when towing

 

[chelsea1]

The only problem associated with "chelsea tractors" is narrow mindedness by people like yourself who would insist on thinking that any car that has drive to all 4 wheels is a chelsea tractor and is just a fashion accesory.

As more sensible people know this isnt the case. The smaller 4x4's (x-trail,crv, sorento etc) are smaller (width and length) then many large family saloons (especially as people go for estates to increas the kerbweight). They are also, often put to a good use off road for peoples work or recreation.

Granted, many folk in towns/cities buy them to ship their little ones to school and no more and that is pure stupidity, but driving any child less than a mile to school in ANY car is plain stupidity, its quicker to walk!!

Point is, not all 4x4's are chelsea tractors.

Steve

my point exactly stephen, i hope your comment isnt directed at me?!

it sooo niggles me for my car to be called a chelsea tractor.

They started off with that name because people in chelsea, london drive them in the city, im in rural devon, the road is full of 4x4's and they are not chelsea tractors!