we thought i should share our experience with others.in march 2007 we ordered a new elddis avante 544 from our local dealer,we were advised not to deal with them but did not listen,we were told it would take three weeks for elddis to `make it` sure enough it took three weeks we picked it up on april 6th while the salesman was showing us how things should work,not a demo just verbally telling us,we noticed a mark on one of the cuboard doors the owner of the dealership told us it would take three weeks to receive a replacement door so we took the caravan home.the next day we took the van out for the weekend but we had to phone the dealer to ask how certain things worked, no demo, three weeks passed and no door, we were locked out of the shower due to failure of the locking mechanism and the dealer told me to dismantle the lock to gain entry.five weeks passed by and still no door and no returned calls from the dealer so i phoned elddis to be told no door had been ordered, i phoned the dealer but the owner was on holiday so the customer service manager spoke(or i should say shouted at me)i have never been spoken to like that by a customer service before so i told him i wanted my money back, he couldnt do that so i waited until the owner came back by which time i had also calmed down, he apologised and told me the door was due in that week, it came the following week.week 9 i have since found out the door wasnt ordered until tree weeks after we bought the van.i have phoned elddis numerous times trying to speak to the customer service manager,he does not return my calls.i have tried to speak to the managing director of the explorer group he spends most of his time out of the office or on holiday. we now have a list of jobs that need rectifying,how did the van leave the factory like that .questions i cant seem to get any answers for.we like the van but the back up has been really bad. has anybody else had any bad dealings with elddis and a caravan dealer in flintshire?
elddis caravans
- Thread starter john_5126924
- Start date
we bought a 2004 Elddis Avante & i have to say that the build quality is not as good as we expected.
as for the dealership, i think there must be a few like the one in flintshire as we had loads of hassle with the one we dealt with in Glossop.
we have since been informed by lots of people that we should not have dealt with them. (bit late though.)
as for the dealership, i think there must be a few like the one in flintshire as we had loads of hassle with the one we dealt with in Glossop.
we have since been informed by lots of people that we should not have dealt with them. (bit late though.)
Hello John,
I am sorry to read of your experiences. In your posting you ask the rhetorical question 'how did the van leave the factory like that'? Well I cannot speak for current production methods, but I have seen no evidence to suggest they are significantly different from ten years ago, when I worked for a major appliance manufacture that supplied some products to the caravan industry.
Traditionally caravan manufacturing is a seasonal process. The construction workforce was employed for only part of the year ad they are paid on a piece-work basis. This tends to mean that speed rather than quality is the production operative's motivation.
The caravan manufactures logistics management often left a lot to be desired and they failed to coordinate the supply of parts to the production lines, they did not stick to their own production schedules, and that meant that suppliers were always being asked to change quantities and delivery dates at very short notice.
Frequently caravans could not be fully completed because of parts shortages, and they left the production facility with parts missing. In some cases they would rob parts from caravans in their storage yards or from OEM supplied items in the warehouse stock to try and complete other models.
Many's the time we would receive back from the Caravan manufactures pallets of goods that had been vandalised by production staff for parts to complete other models, and we were frequently asked to send some of our own work force to go to the manufactures storage yards to fit, product that they had omitted during the build, or repair damaged when robbing parts to complete other models etc.
As the manufactures only did a final inspection at the end of the production line, caravans in the storage yards were usually sent to dealers with only the most cursory of visual checks before being loaded onto the transporters.
Given the mayhem at the manufacturers, it is hardly surprising that caravans reach the dealers in unfinished condition and missing parts. That is why the PDI at caravan dealers is necessary, as it is actually doing what the manufactures fail to do - complete the caravan.
The next time you are purchasing a new caravan, if the dealer asks you to pay for the PDI - refuse to pay - Why should you pay for what the manufacture has failed to do?
I am sorry to read of your experiences. In your posting you ask the rhetorical question 'how did the van leave the factory like that'? Well I cannot speak for current production methods, but I have seen no evidence to suggest they are significantly different from ten years ago, when I worked for a major appliance manufacture that supplied some products to the caravan industry.
Traditionally caravan manufacturing is a seasonal process. The construction workforce was employed for only part of the year ad they are paid on a piece-work basis. This tends to mean that speed rather than quality is the production operative's motivation.
The caravan manufactures logistics management often left a lot to be desired and they failed to coordinate the supply of parts to the production lines, they did not stick to their own production schedules, and that meant that suppliers were always being asked to change quantities and delivery dates at very short notice.
Frequently caravans could not be fully completed because of parts shortages, and they left the production facility with parts missing. In some cases they would rob parts from caravans in their storage yards or from OEM supplied items in the warehouse stock to try and complete other models.
Many's the time we would receive back from the Caravan manufactures pallets of goods that had been vandalised by production staff for parts to complete other models, and we were frequently asked to send some of our own work force to go to the manufactures storage yards to fit, product that they had omitted during the build, or repair damaged when robbing parts to complete other models etc.
As the manufactures only did a final inspection at the end of the production line, caravans in the storage yards were usually sent to dealers with only the most cursory of visual checks before being loaded onto the transporters.
Given the mayhem at the manufacturers, it is hardly surprising that caravans reach the dealers in unfinished condition and missing parts. That is why the PDI at caravan dealers is necessary, as it is actually doing what the manufactures fail to do - complete the caravan.
The next time you are purchasing a new caravan, if the dealer asks you to pay for the PDI - refuse to pay - Why should you pay for what the manufacture has failed to do?
It is the same when buying anything you have no contract and very legal obligation on the manufacturer of the goods.
it is the person/company who directly sold the goods to you.
Companies like explorer have "customer Services" people but in reality they are there for the dealers not for the likes of us. They can be useful if something really ontoward is happening but for a marked cupboard or dodgy door lock I cant see them being of much use.
When buying anything large a house,car, boat, caravan. Inspect the goods thoroughly if they are not 100% do not take delivery walk away asking the shop dealer to contact you when it is 100% ready.
Accepting goods with a verbal rectification agreement you are always onto a loser.
I know there are good delaerships and my elddis dealer is fantastic, ( I hope so as I am about to order a replacement 2008 crusader from them). But if something is wrong I will not accept the van, Once they have the money and you have the van you are down on their priority list. if they have the van in their workshop and you have walked away they want your money and the van gone.
Sometimes it is very difficult to walk away sales people get very angry but you are within your rights and it is your strongest position ever in the sales process. I know we order things late and get excited and are normally eager to get the goods and use them but it can save a lot of time and agro later on.
As for a marked cupboard and a dodgy lock on some accounts you have been lucky thoose all could have been post QA from the line. I havent had a single fault with my 2005 crusader storm (excluding a blocked truma reg). but friends and relatives new vans have been verging on DIY kits.
What i would advise is agreeing with the delaership a jointly convenient time for all the niggles to be sorted. Use the van as much as possible in between right a snag list and fax it to them with enough time for parts to be ordered, ensure they have ordered the parts (Copy of the faxed order) take the van to them and leave it there until you are happy.
if you financed the van if they do not agree to fix the niggles when it is convenient and in a reasonable time frame reject the van from the finance company. I had to do this with a car it is amazing how quickly things get sorted then.
good luck keep us updated, if the delear is an arse name and shame them so others avoid.
it is the person/company who directly sold the goods to you.
Companies like explorer have "customer Services" people but in reality they are there for the dealers not for the likes of us. They can be useful if something really ontoward is happening but for a marked cupboard or dodgy door lock I cant see them being of much use.
When buying anything large a house,car, boat, caravan. Inspect the goods thoroughly if they are not 100% do not take delivery walk away asking the shop dealer to contact you when it is 100% ready.
Accepting goods with a verbal rectification agreement you are always onto a loser.
I know there are good delaerships and my elddis dealer is fantastic, ( I hope so as I am about to order a replacement 2008 crusader from them). But if something is wrong I will not accept the van, Once they have the money and you have the van you are down on their priority list. if they have the van in their workshop and you have walked away they want your money and the van gone.
Sometimes it is very difficult to walk away sales people get very angry but you are within your rights and it is your strongest position ever in the sales process. I know we order things late and get excited and are normally eager to get the goods and use them but it can save a lot of time and agro later on.
As for a marked cupboard and a dodgy lock on some accounts you have been lucky thoose all could have been post QA from the line. I havent had a single fault with my 2005 crusader storm (excluding a blocked truma reg). but friends and relatives new vans have been verging on DIY kits.
What i would advise is agreeing with the delaership a jointly convenient time for all the niggles to be sorted. Use the van as much as possible in between right a snag list and fax it to them with enough time for parts to be ordered, ensure they have ordered the parts (Copy of the faxed order) take the van to them and leave it there until you are happy.
if you financed the van if they do not agree to fix the niggles when it is convenient and in a reasonable time frame reject the van from the finance company. I had to do this with a car it is amazing how quickly things get sorted then.
good luck keep us updated, if the delear is an arse name and shame them so others avoid.
think you have been unlucky, especially with your dealer. we bought an elddis odyssey last year and did have some minor problems, but our dealership, downshire camping in northern ireland, have been great and any dificulties have been rectified at a time convenient to us.
John, did you take out any finance for this van? Technically its the finance company's van untill you have paid I think at least 2/3 of the cost/loan. If so get them involved and tell them what a pain the dealer is. Having had dealings with the Explorer Gp before, I know that there delivery times can be rather extended so to speak. In 3x yrs of ownership of a Compass they never did get round to sorting out the doors at the rear of the van. It did'nt help any with the dealer having staff problems, and the lack of ability to sort it. Getting the F/c involved moved things on a tad though. Hope you get things sorted, talk to the CAB if anything, get some advice, Bazz.
hi bazz thanks very much for your comments, unfortunately we paid cash and i think this could be part of the problem.i spoke to the dealer last week and he told me that the girl in charge of ordering parts had been sacked but i spoke to somebody of the same name this week and she told me the part had arrived ,the van is going in next saturday,it will be interesting to see what happens.
I have also had problems with Elddis. My elddis Avante 556 leaks on the rear garage door. It has had new door and frames fitted twice. This did not work. In the end it was sent back to Elddis to repair. They replaced the water damaged parts but did nothing to cure the problem or do a water test on the door. We got the van back to find it still leaked. I spoke to the customer service manager myself to try and find out what they had done but, they would not give me or the dealer a report. The customer service manager was abrupt and a waste of space in my opinion and he asked our dealer what they thought might fix the problem. They informed them that the door was not forming a good seal and that the door needed to be pulled in tighter. Elddis sent some spacers for the door catch. These have been fitted but small amounts of water are still getting in. I beleive I have given the deler enough chance to repair this problem. Can I request my money back nearly one year on from reporting the problem. We have had the van from new for 16months.
hi ian sorry to hear about your problems,mine dont seem too bad now,one reply ive had mentions finance,if its on finance maybe they might be able to help failing that park it outside the explorer group front door until they fix it,ive threatened to do that but the receptionist just says `ok then`they just dont care.the m d is a mr ford,if you can speak to him i would be very interested to know how you managed it i have a few words for him,most unprintable here.
hi just thought id post an update,weve had all the jobs satisfactory completed on the van now but the dealer customer service gets no better,we picked the van up on thursday afternoon,after receiving the keys we were informed that the van was in the `compound somewhere`,we ventured into the compound to find our van,hitched it up and proceeded to the barrier,one beep on the horn and the barrier lifted for us.at no time did anybody come to apologise for our troubles nor did they check we had the correct van,im sorry we didnt hitch up one of the big twin axles. needles to say i wont be taking it to them for any services.
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