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Electric cars and towing
- Thread starter stagthelad
- Start date
- Nov 11, 2009
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See posts by Tobes (use search “polestar” and “Tobes”) he’s been towing his caravan for 2-3 years. You need to accept reduced range and having to uncouple the caravan whilst charging the car. But Tobes has developed an approach that works for him, and balances his solo usage, with his leisure usage whilst towing. From memory the caravan is 1500/1600kg and the car a Polestar.
You don’t necessarily have to uncouple the van, some dedicated charging stations have bays for vehicles with trailers, probably few and far between though.
Doesn’t stop idiots from taking them up with a car when there are ample single bays available, or as I have seen, just parking up to use the shop/cafe when there is a separate car park! 🤷 Nowt so weird as folk.
For info, this is at Dartbridge on the A38 in Devon. The dedicated, long, charging bays are to the north and east of the main charging bays, you can clearly see them. There is also a farm shop/cafe, and a separate large car park , not in shot.
Sorry for the grainy pic.
Sorry for the grainy pic.
- Mar 14, 2005
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I'm not sure what you are trying to ask?
As with any car it has to be type approved before it can tow, so just like ICE vehicles some can and some can't. generally becasue of the weight of the EV's battery, an EV's towing capacity is usually lower than its equivalent ICE car.
When you tow any trailer the tow vehicle has more work to do so it will use more energy(Fuel) compared to its solo duties. The effect of that is the miles per kWh/Gallon will reduce when towing. As EV's still have less mileage per charge compared to an ICE, an EV's towing mileage can be as little as 50% of its solo capability.
Whether ICE or EV the best way to improve mpg or m/kWh is to slow down!
When it comes to refueling, presently EV's are still disadvantaged by the lack of public DC chargers, and the fact that recharging can take over 30minutes . This is particularly the case for EV's with trailers. However more chargers are being installed so the number of chargers should continue to improve across the UK, but whether they are trailer compatible is down to the companies and local authorities planning departments.
We have seen an increase in petrol stations that also have some form of refreshments and rest room facilities since the 1960's Hopefully EV charging stations should have similar facilities as the driver and passengers have to spend more time compared to refilling with dino juice.
You can tow with electric vehicles, but you can't expect to get away with the casual approach expecting to find a service station every few miles where you can turn up, fill up and go in a matter of minuets. As long as we have poor numbers of public chargers , EV drivers will have to plan their route and journey time more carefully to include stops for recharging. Some cars can help by automatically working out a route strategies with charging stops, even estimating charge remaining, and how long you should charge for.
This does generally mean long journey will take longer becasue of the charging stops.
Specifically when it comes to caravanning , as most holidays will see the caravan being used on a site, you also have to consider how to charging the car ready for your next journey. I have not heard of any caravan site that presently allows you to charge an EV adjacent to the caravan, (Please correct me if I'm wrong) It is certainly an issue that will arise as more people have no alternative but to have an EV.
EV caravanning is definitely possible, but you have to change your mind set from ICE to EV and chill out.
- Nov 11, 2009
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Certainly is, and very well used during peak times, great food too. But, apparently, it is more expensive per mile, than filling up an ICE vehicle. So much for incentivising EVs. 🤷
- Nov 11, 2009
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Yes but most times during the year an EV is probably charged at home on an off peak rate, or at a company’s premises. If used for business the charging costs incurred at commercial chargers will most likely be reimbursed. When my grandson had a Tesla Y he found its fuelling costs far lower than his 5 Series PHEV. Unfortunately he’s decided to go for the new Model Y Tesla so even the sticker won’t come in handy.
- Jul 23, 2021
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As has been said, I have been towing for almost 4 years with an EV, and am now into my 5th season. I have just placed an order for my next tow car, which will be an EV (Polestar 4 to replace the Polestar 2).
As with all cars, you need to ensure it's suitable for your caravan (nose weight and towing weights observed). You will notice the reduced range when towing compared to solo (as with any car). My polestar 2 gets about 190 to 210 solo and 120 to 140 towing. I am expecting to achieve close to 180 with the Polestar 4 when towing.
Charging while towing typically means unhitching though there are locations that you can charge at when hitched. The new Instavolt hub at Winchester is an example of a new location with such a capability.
There are a number of Facebook groups dedicated to EV caravanning, and if you have a car and caravan in mind there is a chance someone has some relevant experience to help you make a decision.
I certainly have no intention of returning to fossil fuel for towing. For me, the benefits of the electric drive train (torque, power, silence, response, efficiency, home charging, not having to visit fuel stations, lack of fumes and smell, and cost) massively out weigh the drawbacks of the need to unhitch when charging, which is perhaps 6 or 8 times a year depending on our trips.
If you are the kind of person who likes to hitch up and tow from the north of UK to the south of France, only stopping when you are totally out of diesel, then an EV may not be for you. If you are looking at an EV for other reasons (for me 90% of my miles are solo), and towing is just one minor (though important) use of the car, - and you have a home charging solution - then I would highly recommend it.
For charging when on site, CCC allow it. CMCC charge for it. Many CLs have warnings about not charging (as they are rightly concerned about being stung by the increased cost), but for those I have approached and asked permission with the intention to pay, they have been accepting. I carry a 3pin plug power meter with me that allows me to track usage and can report that usage to the site owners, so we can calculate costs.
As with all cars, you need to ensure it's suitable for your caravan (nose weight and towing weights observed). You will notice the reduced range when towing compared to solo (as with any car). My polestar 2 gets about 190 to 210 solo and 120 to 140 towing. I am expecting to achieve close to 180 with the Polestar 4 when towing.
Charging while towing typically means unhitching though there are locations that you can charge at when hitched. The new Instavolt hub at Winchester is an example of a new location with such a capability.
There are a number of Facebook groups dedicated to EV caravanning, and if you have a car and caravan in mind there is a chance someone has some relevant experience to help you make a decision.
I certainly have no intention of returning to fossil fuel for towing. For me, the benefits of the electric drive train (torque, power, silence, response, efficiency, home charging, not having to visit fuel stations, lack of fumes and smell, and cost) massively out weigh the drawbacks of the need to unhitch when charging, which is perhaps 6 or 8 times a year depending on our trips.
If you are the kind of person who likes to hitch up and tow from the north of UK to the south of France, only stopping when you are totally out of diesel, then an EV may not be for you. If you are looking at an EV for other reasons (for me 90% of my miles are solo), and towing is just one minor (though important) use of the car, - and you have a home charging solution - then I would highly recommend it.
For charging when on site, CCC allow it. CMCC charge for it. Many CLs have warnings about not charging (as they are rightly concerned about being stung by the increased cost), but for those I have approached and asked permission with the intention to pay, they have been accepting. I carry a 3pin plug power meter with me that allows me to track usage and can report that usage to the site owners, so we can calculate costs.
One overlook benefit of PHEV and EVs is ability to power caravan from vehicle. Allows you go offgrid with $$ savings while still having access to AC power.
- Mar 14, 2005
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That's only a possibility with an EV with Vehicle to Load or Grid capability and as yet this is not a universal fact, But also it will depend on your vehicles state of charge when you reach your destination.
We tow with a PHEV, we have considered a full EV especially as range seems to be increasing, as I am on a mobility walker unhitching the caravan would be a no. We have considered changing the way we caravan, we like going to the New Forest, instead of towing in one hit we could break the journey into two, stop off at Broadway or Cirencester and recharge then onto the New Forest.
- Jun 20, 2005
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I had a good look recently at the Kia EV9 full bodied SUV . Very tempting tug. Sadly £75k is just a tad too expensive.
Its range is quoted at 304 miles. Towing should see near 150 maybe? Perhaps when it’s three years old depreciation may make it buyable😉
Certainly I have to admit a very good attempt at a real world SUV EV.
But a long way off the Touareg all round performance😎
Its range is quoted at 304 miles. Towing should see near 150 maybe? Perhaps when it’s three years old depreciation may make it buyable😉
Certainly I have to admit a very good attempt at a real world SUV EV.
But a long way off the Touareg all round performance😎
- Mar 14, 2005
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Yes, apart from the fact that I am unable to install a dedicated charging point in my garage because it is too far from the house and a power line would have to cross someone else’s property, that is for me the major obstacle in buying an EV. We tow the caravan to the south of France or Spain two to three times a year and our stops en route other than overnighting every 300 or so miles seldom take longer than 15 minutes, which wouldn’t be enough to recharge.
- Nov 11, 2009
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- Jun 20, 2005
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- Nov 11, 2009
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I’m not voting for pretty just aesthetically pleasing. The Kia EV 6 is a good looking car, but not an SUV, Polestar too looks good.
- Jul 23, 2021
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As per my post #9
This is a huge factor. I would personally make do without one as I hate the idea of returning to fossil fuel, but that would be a non-starter for many others, so I fully understand that point of view.
As for the long tow, overnighting every 300 miles would be my strategy too. Further than that and I would be too tired to concentrate.
My next planned car (Polestar 4 ) has a 100kWh battery, which I am expecting to deliver something around 160 to 180 miles of towing range. It also has a pretty good charging curve (you can see it here). With a 250kW charger, starting from around 10% state of charge, 15 mins will add about 50% to 55% of the battery, or another 80 to 90 miles of towing range.
Though the curve is not yet available, the Polestar 3 (110kWh battery and the best part of 200 miles towing range) has an even higher maximum charge speed of 250kW, that same 15 mins may yield 100 miles or more of towing range.
The aforementioned Kia EV9 also has a 100kWh battery (towing range of the order of 160 to 180 miles) and a very impressive charging curve that could yield 60% charge (100 miles or more towing range) in 15 mins .
All three of these cars can tow 2000kg or more so have an impressive range of vans you can hook up. All three of these cars could also achieve a 300 mile towing day with a single slightly extended stop around the 160 to 170 mile mark, or a couple of shorter stops.
Yes - they are very expensive, but are not at all far off from the starting point of a VW Touareg Touareg £60k new
Polestar 4 £66K new
Polestar 3 £75K new
Kia EV9 £61K new
Personally - I think the future is pretty bright...
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- Jul 23, 2021
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I am not sure a Touareg is "pretty", but maybe beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Personally I think the Polestar 3 looks fabulous.
- Jan 20, 2023
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I've been running a PHEV for nearly six months now, mine has a very usable 40-odd miles running solo as an EV. I'm a devout petrol-head but I just love running the Audi in EV mode, it's seamlessly quiet with ample power and charging it at home equates to (very roughly) half the price of running it on petrol. It wasn't cheap (£63.5K new) but buying it as an ex-demonstrator at 3 months old saw the price drop to a more palatable £45K. At the end of the day, there's very few "cheap" new tow cars nowadays.
Driving with the (1500kgs) caravan on the back the other day in full hybrid mode saw an economy of 36mpg, returning home just on petrol (battery flat) saw 23mpg (yes, I KNOW that a diesel would do more but a diesel doesn't suit the 95% of my driving that isn't towing).
The negatives for me are the proliferation of charging point providers that charge a bewildering difference in price, I use Pod-Point as they have a charger at Tesco that charges around 30p/kwh, but another Pod-Point charger 1/4 mile away charges 65p/kwh. I'd love to use public charging points more but the majority are more expensive that running it on petrol.
EV's and their infrastructure are undoubtedly getting better but not good enough for me, not yet anyway.
Driving with the (1500kgs) caravan on the back the other day in full hybrid mode saw an economy of 36mpg, returning home just on petrol (battery flat) saw 23mpg (yes, I KNOW that a diesel would do more but a diesel doesn't suit the 95% of my driving that isn't towing).
The negatives for me are the proliferation of charging point providers that charge a bewildering difference in price, I use Pod-Point as they have a charger at Tesco that charges around 30p/kwh, but another Pod-Point charger 1/4 mile away charges 65p/kwh. I'd love to use public charging points more but the majority are more expensive that running it on petrol.
EV's and their infrastructure are undoubtedly getting better but not good enough for me, not yet anyway.
- Nov 11, 2009
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Do you think that EV charging point providers may be creaming the profits. Unlike fuel stations where prices are clearly visible I’ve not really noticed an EV charging station showing prices. Around us there are quite a number of stations but unless you are specifically looking for one you don’t really notice them.
- Jan 20, 2023
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Absolutely, unless maybe the ones at Tesco are in some way subsidised by Tesco themselves (possibly contributing to the installation costs)? The kwh costs are a huge variable, quite possibly the providers greed but I honestly don't know enough about how the whole "selling kwh's" works.
- Nov 11, 2009
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There must be a level of infrastructure where effective competition comes to the fore. Clearly for those EV/PHEV drivers who may not be able to maximise home charging we aren’t there yet. But even around us a local Sainsbury supermarket is 135.9 just one penny less than three Esso stations. But in a town around 8 miles away Sainsbury’s is 125.9and a BP 133.9. Even our local Morrisons is now less competitive since the fuel station was sold to the same company that own the Esso stations. Price fixing………
- Jun 20, 2005
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You would have thought so!
Son’s last three trips from Harrogate to Wiltshire needed two stops . With young kids aboard he couldn’t make detours to fined the cheapest chargers. He attempted to avoid Motorway services but even those nearby were not cheap. Cost him £110 with enough charge to do 50% of the return journey. His older diesel would have been cheaper.
But on home charge costs the Volvo EV is cheaper.
Why don’t the chargers at M Way services bill board their prices.The chargers at Bath Hospital show no costs. Seem you have to plug in and stick your CC in first. A bit late to pull out the 😉
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