Increasing MTPLM??

[Dustydog]

Bailey parts by e mail have offered me a MTPLM upgrade from 1670 kgs to1800kgs on my s6 Senator Wyoming,.
I get a new weight plate. All for £65.00 including postage.

Did they get the MTPLM wrong 6 years ago?
Should I go ahead with the purchase? Just wondered what you all think.

 

[ProfJohnL]

Hello Dusty,
If you need the extra capacity then go ahead, otherwise it makes the caravan non standard and might affect its resale/trade-in value. You would have to ask Bailey to get their specific reasons for downrating the MTPLM on the Senator, but it seems to be quite common, and one of the possible reasons is to do with the choices of towing vehicle a particular target cohort of customers are likely to use. We know (because there have been protracted debates about it) the (miss-guided) perceived importance that some caravanners place on getting the exact towing ratio, and if its a percent over they will refuse to tow it, well if your original MTPLM of 1670kg represented 85% then the towcar's Kerbweight would have to be 1965Kg minimum. Now with a raised MTPLM to 1800Kg to keep to the 85% figure you would need a towcar of 2118Kg kerbweight. Not too many family saloons tip the scales at that, so fewer people might choose the Senator. There was also the restriction of only cat B licence holders where the combined MAMs must not exceed 3500Kg, and the ratio not exceeding 100%. At 1670kg this caravan could be towed by a vehicle of MAM of 1830Kg. Its tight but it leaves the car with only maximum 160Kg payload. But at MTPLM 1800 the tow car could only be 1700MAM, and that immediately fails the 100% ratio criteria as the MAM is always more than the kerb weight. There is a slightly wider scope than I have indicated because I haven't taken into account the effect of the way the caravans nose weight is distributed.

 

[Dustydog]

Thanks John

I see the reasoning here. However with my Sorento I will still be well within the guidelines even if I increase the plated weight. I guess it must be to my advantage to accept a higher payload.

I assume the Law will still check the plated MTPLM versus actual weight if they think I am, say, overloaded??
An extra 130kgs of payload does have an attraction.

I believe some manufacturers in the past have reduced the plated MTPLM to allow for a lighter tow vehicle .
It just seemed a bit of jigory pokery to me after owning the Wyoming 6 years to be offered the increase.
Dare I say "Money for nothing" for Bailey???

 

[otherclive]

I had our Bailey Bordeaux upgraded on purchase and it gave an extra 50 kg but involved no material changes other than a new tally plate. The reason it was feasible is that the heavier Vendee used the same chassis and running gear. What I did then was upgrade the tyres to give a higher LI which strictly wasn't essential but the OEM ones gave 1420 kg total load and the upgraded ones give a higher rating similar to those used by Bailey on the Senator which weighed in at an MTPLM of 1460 kg. Why Bailey didn't allocate my van the full 1400 kg MTPLM is as Prof John says it makes it look potentially more attractive to owners of slightly lighter cars. But everyone seems to assume that owners always load to the MTPLM. Wheras as we see on sites it makes absolutely no difference to many people's approach to safe loading!!!

 

[xtrailman]

If the increase requires no modifcation i dont see the point of paying £65 for a sticky label that fades away anyway.

My Valencia can be increased to 1600kg with no modifications other than increasing the pressure on the standard tyres, its normal rating is 1565kg on a 1600kg rated axle.
So i try and load it to 1565kg but don't worry about going over slightly.

 

[otherclive]

Isn't the plate a legal requirement? I suspect that there aren't many buyers who would know where to find the axle rating and what it refers to. I have a duplicate plate within the van and when out always carry the vans papers.

 

[DeliDave_]

We wanted an upgrade on our Indiana as with motor mover battery gas cylinders etc eating into payload didnt seem much left.Kelly was on here then and said it was at its limit already so we just have to be careful.I'd have the upgrade,cheaper than a fine if you go a little over one day and get pulled

 

[Sproket]

We had a good debate about this in November 2011

 

[Gagakev]

Just imagine how many more bottles of beer you could carry

 

[Mel]

You could also carry arc welding gear, scaffolding, and most of the B&Q tool aisle........like Sprocket. (smiley icon)
mel

 

[Surfer]

The MTPLM plate is not mandatory and you cannot be prosecuted if there is not one on your caravan. If upgrading the MTPLM, they will need to issue a new certificate from the NCC and you will need to check the load rating on your tyres. It is not a modification as the MTPLM is a guideline decided by the manufacturer and the caravan remains standard. However if there is a plate on the chassis with a maximum weightr athing or load, then this is not a guideline and cannot be exceeded.

 

[Lutz]

The MTPLM plate is not mandatory and you cannot be prosecuted if there is not one on your caravan. If upgrading the MTPLM, they will need to issue a new certificate from the NCC and you will need to check the load rating on your tyres. It is not a modification as the MTPLM is a guideline decided by the manufacturer and the caravan remains standard. However if there is a plate on the chassis with a maximum weightr athing or load, then this is not a guideline and cannot be exceeded.

If the caravan was homologated after introduction of ECWVTA its MTPLM must be declared on the plate. Then, only the manufacturer can document a change to the Certificate of Conformity that was issued with the caravan.

 

[Surfer]

The MTPLM plate is not mandatory and you cannot be prosecuted if there is not one on your caravan. If upgrading the MTPLM, they will need to issue a new certificate from the NCC and you will need to check the load rating on your tyres. It is not a modification as the MTPLM is a guideline decided by the manufacturer and the caravan remains standard. However if there is a plate on the chassis with a maximum weightr athing or load, then this is not a guideline and cannot be exceeded.

If the caravan was homologated after introduction of ECWVTA its MTPLM must be declared on the plate. Then, only the manufacturer can document a change to the Certificate of Conformity that was issued with the caravan.

I think the above is incorrect as the MTPLM plate is not mandatory even after the rule changes. I think you are getting mixed up with the mandatory plate on the trailer chassis. The MTPLM on the MTPLM plate is still only a guideline however cannot exceed the maximum weight on the chassis plate.

 

[Lutz]

I think the above is incorrect as the MTPLM plate is not mandatory even after the rule changes. I think you are getting mixed up with the mandatory plate on the trailer chassis. The MTPLM on the MTPLM plate is still only a guideline however cannot exceed the maximum weight on the chassis plate.

Where there is a discrepancy, for example in weight details, between the chassis and the caravan manufacturer's plate, the latter takes precedence. The same applies to motorhomes based on truck chassis. The regulations specifically refer to the way a so-called multi-stage build is handled.

 

[ProfJohnL]

We have been down this path before.
The majority of caravan chassis are assembled from a catalogue of standard parts with varying capacities. This means that a design of axle beam may be available in differing capacities - probably with 100Kg increments. Caravan manufactures will select the components for the chassis according to the designed weight capacity of the caravan body. It will be coincidence if a caravan design exactly matches a particular axle beam rating, so they will normally choose the next axle increment up. Whilst the axle beam may have a greater rating, the side members or caravan body may have a lesser rating. Consequently you may have a caravan that apparently has an axle beam with a greater load capacity that the structure of the caravan. You may try loading to the axle limit, but by doing so you may be exceeding the bodies capacity as specified by the MTPLM. You may not be exposed to prosecution for over weight, but you could be exposed to unsafe load requirements.