Kerbweight question (Newbie, please be gentle)

[Grant_374462637]

Hello everyone, This is my first of many questions, so please bear with me !!

We are looking to buy a new van, of the many things to consider a major stumbling block is 'can we keep our current car?", (A '04 Fiat Stilo JTD Multi Wagon).

According to the manual its kerbwieght is 1410kg. I know abut the 85% guidance etc, but here's where I get confused..

The car will have me, my wife our two boys (10 & 6) and the usual clutter that goes with us( no kitchen sink this time, thats why we want the caravan!).

If the car is going to be loaded up, will this reduce the potential weight of the caravan I can tow ?. Is there a general rule of thumb I can use? It would make it easier if I knew what weight I can safely tow and then go through the brochures.

Thanks in advance.

 

[602]

Hi,

The 85% thingy is a recomendation. The fact that you are asking suggests that you "pious beyond your years", and will probably drive sensibly.

What is important is your licence entitlement. If you passed your test before 1997 (I think) you will have a B+E licence, and can tow almost anything that you are likely to want to. Subject to the manufacturers limits.

Pass your test after 1997, and you probably have a B licence only.

I think a B-only licence resticts you to a total of 3500kg for the whole outfit, and the trailer must not weigh more than the tow-car. NOTE. Unless told different, weights refer to the MGW, MAM, or whatever they call it now. Thats the maximum permitted weight, not the actual weight. You should find this on a plate somewhere on your car.

No doubt somebody will be along in a few minutes with the actual figures.

602

 

[Jaydug]

You could safely tow any caravan that has a maximum weight of 1200Kgs. Use this website to check weights when you've looked at any vans you fancy.

http://www.whattowcar.com

 

[Grant_374462637]

Aha the plot thickens,

(Thanks 602, Im okay for licence entitlements etc...)

This is where Im starting to get really confused..

My vehicle kerbweight is 1410 kg

Max Towable load is 1300 kg

Max permissible weight 3200 kg.

Im only looking at going up to a MTPLM of no more than 1400kg.

Am I being too bold ?. The van will have a stabalizer etc and Im used to towing.

 

[Jennifer_374461363]

If the Max Towable load stated by Fiat is 1300kg, then that is the max weight of van (MTPLM) you can tow.

 

[Grant_374462637]

Yeah, thats what I suspected was the case..Oh well, back to the internet & magazines..

Thanks people

 

[ProfJohnL]

Hello Grant

I feel you are pushing the limits and I fear that one of them might bite back.

Contrary to Jennifer's answer, technically you can tow a trailer whose MTPLM is greater than the tow vehicles maximum allowance but you can only part fill the trailer so it does not exceed the cars towing allowance.

In your case you have stated that your considering a caravan with MTPLM 1400 It is likely that the caravan will only have about a 200Kg loading allowance which means its mass in running order is about 1200Kg. You cars limit sit in at 1300Kh half way through the caravans loading allowance. My concern is that you will easily swallow up 100Kg with gas, battery, and the general essential items crockery bedding etc, and that might take the actual weight of the caravan over the 1300 allowance.

This all seems a bit to close for comfort.

John Douglas's approach makes more sense and gives a greater safety. I must add that do not simply rely onteh information obtained from 'Whatcar' and other third party web sites, as these do contain errors. Always check the details with an authorised source such as documentation/dealer/manufacture etc.

 

[Grant_374462637]

Hi John.

Thanks for that

Local Fiat dealer said 1300kg is 'set in stone'..

They suggested that as long as I keep the caravan (including the bottles/battery etc) to 1300kg. I can always put other stuff in the car & roof box. (Clothes/kettle....oh yeah, wife, my two sons!!) I wont be taking vast quantities so as long as Im sensible with the weight and dont overload the car. I'll be alright.

 

[Jennifer_374461363]

I would say you would be better to stick to a van with an MTPLM of 1300 or less. Onto the MIRO you have to add the battery and gas bottles before you start packing the pots, dishes, bedding, clothes food etc.

At least if the van is within your allowance you will still get a decent payload.

Assuming there is space in the car I would put the awning (if you buy one) in there, plus Aquaroll, security devices, outside table and chairs, and anything else that is not used in the van. That way you are unlikely to be overloaded.

Our previous van was a 4 berth (Sterling Emerald) and weighed in at MIRO 1050kg, MTPLM 1300kg, so you should be able to find something to suit.

 

[Jennifer_374461363]

One other thing came to mind re weights. There seems to be some doubt as to which weight the police would use if you were stopped. Some say its the actual weight, others the plated van weight.

If you were to be involved in an incident, towing a van of MTPLM over your cars allowable towing weight could be tricky, and might give your insurance a get out from paying. And we all know they are always keen to find a reason not to pay!

Personally, it is not a risk I would want to take, I prefer to be able to sleep at night.

 

[seth1]

Hello Grant, i,d tend to stick with Jenifers advise.But one other problem comes to mind,we,ve had issues with it as we use the same car,and that is the nosewieght or max load on the towbar,if i remember correctly its only 60kg.Might be differcult to obtain the advised percentage,due to a heavier van.

 

[Grant_374462637]

Thanks guys,

Good point about the MLTPM Jennifer, Even if I hadnt loaded the van up to that figure, and it was under my 1300kg limit.

Im going to speak to a black rat friend of mine about the plated & actual weights.

Seth, I never even gave the nose weight a thought... bu***r !...that changes things. it is 60 kg. Hmm back to the bat cave.....

Thanks to you all.

 

[scottiemad]

Thanks guys,

Good point about the MLTPM Jennifer, Even if I hadnt loaded the van up to that figure, and it was under my 1300kg limit.

Im going to speak to a black rat friend of mine about the plated & actual weights.

Seth, I never even gave the nose weight a thought... bu***r !...that changes things. it is 60 kg. Hmm back to the bat cave.....

Thanks to you all.

Hi Grant - will follow this friend with keen interest - re discussion about plated and actual weights. I posted message on other thread about this (car permissible towing limit or something like that) Our Qashqai has a max towing limit of 1400kg and we want to get a van 1410kg. It has been suggested we take it to a weigh bridge when loaded and get a print out to carry with us. The problem i can see is with insurer assessors if there was an accident.

I have spoken to manufacturers to see if microwave could be removed and van plate weight downgraded but they said the dealer would have to sort this out.

Will be interested in what your black rat friend says!